King Street (Streetcar Transit Priority)

[TransitBart]

How would forced right turns work in this situation though?

It's all nonsense. We should be honest and say the street is closed to vehicular traffic. The current state of affairs is a triumph of obfuscation rivaling Newspeak from 1984.

1. This is a pilot. That word should not be on any public signage. It means nothing to a driver.
2. This street is closed.
3. It has become a transit and pedestrian mall.

The second means something. Even to a visitor to the city.

As for cabs. No. If the street is closed, it's closed.

 

[nfitz]

A significant issue with this set up and state of affairs now is that bicycles and streetcars are competing for the same (piddly 2-lane) space.

Where? Everywhere I've been along the route, there is a small piece of the the second lane, that's been left clear and bikes can use.

 

[Leo_Chan]

Where? Everywhere I've been along the route, there is a small piece of the the second lane, that's been left clear and bikes can use.

But no inexperienced cyclists would use that space when there are massive streetcars running right next to them.

 

[DSC]

But no inexperienced cyclists would use that space when there are massive streetcars running right next to them.

and most experienced cyclists would avoid it for exactly the same reasons.

 

[nfitz]

But no inexperienced cyclists would use that space when there are massive streetcars running right next to them.

I watched today; the streetcars were simply hanging back behind the bikes, and not trying to overtake. No one was trying to cycle next to a moving streetcar!

Not sure the issue here.

 

[UD2]

I watched today; the streetcars were simply hanging back behind the bikes, and not trying to overtake. No one was trying to cycle next to a moving streetcar!

Not sure the issue here.

shouldn't the issue be we're reducing the speed of streetcars to that of bicycles?

 

[muller877]

I watched today; the streetcars were simply hanging back behind the bikes, and not trying to overtake. No one was trying to cycle next to a moving streetcar!

Not sure the issue here.

Do streetcars have the same law as other motorists where they have to give cyclists 3+ feet of space before overtaking them? Or is there an exemption?

Will definitely impede on the speed of streetcars. Are these cyclists breaking the law by going through intersections? Should police ticket all vehicles breaking this law?

Fully supportive of a bi-directional bike lane on the North side of Wellington as long as (1) all through biking is banned on King and (2) taxis are banned from taking up a whole lane (or two) of Wellington waiting for a fare. Will result in the same amount of traffic throughput if designed correctly on Wellington plus more room for transit & pedestrians on King

 

[ShonTron]

Do streetcars have the same law as other motorists where they have to give cyclists 3+ feet of space before overtaking them? Or is there an exemption?

Will definitely impede on the speed of streetcars. Are these cyclists breaking the law by going through intersections? Should police ticket all vehicles breaking this law?

Fully supportive of a bi-directional bike lane on the North side of Wellington as long as (1) all through biking is banned on King and (2) taxis are banned from taking up a whole lane (or two) of Wellington waiting for a fare. Will result in the same amount of traffic throughput if designed correctly on Wellington plus more room for transit & pedestrians on King

Only TTC vehicles and bicycles are allowed to go through each and every intersection on King Street at all times of the day. Can't ticket them!

I'm in complete agreement about a bi-directional bikeway on Wellington, with a clear route all the way west to Strachan Avenue to connect to Liberty Village and the planned extension of the Railpath, and once that's built, a ban on through cyclists on King, especially if we want to make it a de facto pedestrian mall.

 

[robmausser]

But no inexperienced cyclists would use that space when there are massive streetcars running right next to them.

I would take biking next to streetcars over a next to cars ANY DAY.

A car has a driver with who knows what level of skill, and the ability to swerve into me.

A streetcar has a highly trained driver with wheels that are locked in tracks. Ain't going nowhere.

If you chose to bike next to cars instead of streetcars due to safety, you are DUMB.

 

[PinkLucy]

Like Rob, I'd much rather bike next to a streetcar (frequent stops aside) than cars. Streetcars are predictable. Car drivers are not.

 

[Leo_Chan]

I would take biking next to streetcars over a next to cars ANY DAY.

A car has a driver with who knows what level of skill, and the ability to swerve into me.

A streetcar has a highly trained driver with wheels that are locked in tracks. Ain't going nowhere.

If you chose to bike next to cars instead of streetcars due to safety, you are DUMB.

I never said I preferred biking next to cars. Biking next to steetcars is definitely better then next to cars, but the point I was trying to make was that there's not enough space beside the streetcar to bike safely. I make errors too.

 

[robmausser]

I never said I preferred biking next to cars. Biking next to steetcars is definitely better then next to cars, but the point I was trying to make was that there's not enough space beside the streetcar to bike safely. I make errors too.

In a fully fleshed out King Street Transit Mall I would like to see a dedicated bike lane that is physically separated from the streetcar by a concrete divider. With streetcar stops on the streetcar side.

You are correct that in this current version of the Transit Mall its not great, but this should not be the end game. This is a beta test.

 

[PinkLucy]

My understanding is that the plans for King St. do not and will not include bike lanes because of the proximity of Richmond and Adelaide. Personally, I think every road should have protected bike lanes, because cyclists should be able to take the most direct route the same as other traffic, but the planners that be don't agree.

 

[adrianaliu]

im really supportive of bike lanes for the most part. but please can we treat cyclists as motorists on king. the problem with king was the cars turning left delaying an entire streetcar behind it. well now we have the problem of a single cyclist delaying an entire streetcar that is unable to pass, on a vehicle that is even slower than a car. ban through biking on king put the lane on wellington and have cyclists use richmond and adelaide. I wouldnt mind bike lanes on king away from the streetcar tracks but id prefer for it to be used for extended sidewalks, which was the original intent of the pilot.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Why can't Toronto test fitting rails with rubber inserts?
See link.

Because Toronto can't spend pennies on bicycles, that's why? Sad.