King Street (Streetcar Transit Priority)

[Midtown Urbanist]

They could probably move most of the parking to side streets and lots, restrict motor traffic to deliveries for several blocks and make it a transit mall/pedestrian zone ... but since Queen is more commercial than residential, it'd be a winkelstraat (shopping street) rather than a woonerf.

Zürich Is the same as above and duel tracks. Looking at the above photo, the tracks is going/from onto one way streets.

Here is my dad's home city, Katowice, Poland.

This used to be a busy roadway through the city's downtown core, now it is a streetcar pedestrian mall. I think this is a more realistic 'future' for King and Queen Streets. Imagine our Flexity vehicles on this road.

 

[smallspy]

Actually, it's far more forgiving than having to jackhammer out poured concrete. You can pull up the cobblestones in no time. And reuse them. And there's no curing time when you reinstall.

- Paul

You can reuse cobblestones/belgian blocks, but not infinitely. Due to damage, there is going to be some quantity that can't.

And yes, there is a curing time. Most cities using them today use a cementing mortar. Hell, Waterfront Toronto did when they installed the sidewalks on Queens Quay.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

You can reuse cobblestones/belgian blocks, but not infinitely. Due to damage, there is going to be some quantity that can't.

And yes, there is a curing time. Most cities using them today use a cementing mortar. Hell, Waterfront Toronto did when they installed the sidewalks on Queens Quay.

re: WT QQ - they used polymeric sand, which contains cement but isn't quite like mortar with a setting time of approx a day.

AoD

 

[smallspy]

re: WT QQ - they used polymeric sand, which contains cement but isn't quite like mortar with a setting time of approx a day.

AoD

My understanding with polymeric sand is that it sets using moisture, both in the form of rain and humidity.

Are you sure that's what they used on Queen's Quay? The product that they used needed to be kept at a particular temperature and humidity range while setting.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

My understanding with polymeric sand is that it sets using moisture, both in the form of rain and humidity.

Are you sure that's what they used on Queen's Quay? The product that they used needed to be kept at a particular temperature and humidity range while setting.

Yes and yes - see http://blog.waterfrontoronto.ca/nbe/portal/wt/home/blog-home/posts/queens-quay-on-time

AoD

 

[the lemur]

Here is my dad's home city, Katowice, Poland.

This used to be a busy roadway through the city's downtown core, now it is a streetcar pedestrian mall. I think this is a more realistic 'future' for King and Queen Streets. Imagine our Flexity vehicles on this road.

In case anyone thinks Europe doesn't ever take streetcars off popular commercial streets, for better or for worse ...

Weimarstraat, The Hague, 1947:

Now:
https://goo.gl/maps/YbtgDULMN4t

Some time before 1963:

1980s, awkward bike/car intersection:

Modern view:
https://goo.gl/maps/FbqYiVYexTG2
(wider sidewalks, some cycling provision)

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Here is my dad's home city, Katowice, Poland.

This used to be a busy roadway through the city's downtown core, now it is a streetcar pedestrian mall. I think this is a more realistic 'future' for King and Queen Streets. Imagine our Flexity vehicles on this road.

The future! This warms my urbanist heart.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

A render of the King Street Mall from way back in 2001. This is a street I want to walk down:

And here are existing conditions. Yuck

 

[innsertnamehere]

I'm pretty sure TTC would reject it. TTC has been doing emergency repairs from time to time on streetcar tracks. It would lengthen their repair duration.

The TTC still has a very small stretch of cobblestone track, at Victoria and Dundas. I see no reason why they wouldn't use it, the main reason they stopped using it is because it is horribly uncomfortable to drive on in a car.

 

[W. K. Lis]

During celebrations, expect streetcars, bicycles, and people.

 

[nfitz]

In case anyone thinks Europe doesn't ever take streetcars off popular commercial streets, for better or for worse ...

Streetcars were all but eradicated in Western Europe, just like North America. Look at the UK for example. There must have over 100 towns and cities with trams back in the early 1930s. Any population centre with tens of thousands of people had them. As far as I know - only one line of one city survived (Blackpool).

They've moved faster to put in new systems recently - but not sure why there's any impression that much was preserved!

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The TTC still has a very small stretch of cobblestone track, at Victoria and Dundas. I see no reason why they wouldn't use it, the main reason they stopped using it is because it is horribly uncomfortable to drive on in a car.

I suspect Fire and EMS won't accept cobblestone. Why wasn't it used on Queens Quay?

 

[the lemur]

Streetcars were all but eradicated in Western Europe, just like North America. Look at the UK for example. There must have over 100 towns and cities with trams back in the early 1930s. Any population centre with tens of thousands of people had them. As far as I know - only one line of one city survived (Blackpool).

They've moved faster to put in new systems recently - but not sure why there's any impression that much was preserved!

It really depends on the country. The UK certainly saw almost all trams eliminated by the 1960s, but several major cities have either brought them back on approximately the same lines or introduced new lines: Sheffield, Manchester, Nottingham, Edinburgh, Birmingham and Tramlink in the London borough of Croydon.

You're right, though - dozens and dozens of towns in the UK had trams at some point, some even for just two or three decades, even ending before WW2: Oxford, Luton, Northampton, etc.

Over on the continent, streetcars continue to operate in major cities in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Belgium and the Netherlands, and light rail of some description exists in many cities in France and Spain.

 

[the lemur]

I suspect Fire and EMS won't accept cobblestone. Why wasn't it used on Queens Quay?

If they don't accept cobbles/pavers, how do they put up with having to respond to emergencies in the Distillery District?

 

[Edward Skira]

Looking to see how the TTC handles crowds on King East when the Canary District starts to populate this summer. A lot of people going to be moving into the area in a very short time.