King Street (Streetcar Transit Priority)

[MetroMan]

Some of the planters that widen the sidewalk have already been installed. Of course, cyclists are already claiming them as "bike lanes".

 

[drum118]

Since I been away before the change, I took a visitor downtown today and had my first look and ride on King.

Eerie not seeing a lot of cars on King on a weekday. Got on at Bay and a fast ride to Cherry St.

The ramp I saw in a few photo wasn't a ramp I thought it was. It was a ramp from the sidewalk to the road and no issues with it.

What I did see and walked over to Bay to check the signs was cars going straight threw the intersection and not making the right hand turn requirement. The signs said this was ok.

One big issue was southbound Bay traffic blocking the lanes for a light or 2 to allow traffic/transit to be held up.

No shelter at the new Bay Stop, but the old one is still where it is. Going to take time to move them.

 

[MetroMan]

What I did see and walked over to Bay to check the signs was cars going straight threw the intersection and not making the right hand turn requirement. The signs said this was ok.

Bay Street does allow for through traffic. It's one of the exceptions. The other is at John.

One big issue was southbound Bay traffic blocking the lanes for a light or 2 to allow traffic/transit to be held up.

That's the reason through traffic is allowed at Bay. It's already backed up, they don't want to add more traffic to it.

No shelter at the new Bay Stop, but the old one is still where it is. Going to take time to move them.

They have to keep the old shelters in place because of advertising contracts. They're not allowed to install new temporary shelters over the Financial District BIA's granite sidewalks, unlike the concrete sidewalks elsewhere. Once it's permanent, new permanent shelters will be put in place and the old ones will be removed once the advertising period is over.

 

[Megaton327]

That's the reason through traffic is allowed at Bay. It's already backed up, they don't want to add more traffic to it.

Specifically, I believe Brad Ross explained it as that if they force cars to turn right onto Bay but Bay is clogged, those cars on King will be backed up all the way into the centre lane waiting for their right turns, and those cars will block the streetcars, nevermind box-blockers on Bay itself. Additionally, pedestrian volumes at Bay/King are huge so right turns would be difficult by that merit as well, once again blocking the streetcar lane as right turning cars queue up.

 

[mdrejhon]

My favourite tweet of the #KingStreetPilot is this one.

https://twitter.com/g_meslin/status/931529800774307840

Here are all images from the tweet.

.....Cue #KingStreetPilot going permanent in 4 years probably with bluestone paving on the road!

 

[nfitz]

uber is cheaper, mainly. And far better marketed.

That's odd, I'm not sure I've ever seen much advertising for Uber. Yet Beck's has rolling ads out everywhere.

Cheaper while uber has some regulatory advantages - that window is closing. Though I don't recall Beck having peak pricing.

Good stuff. I was thinking the traffic coming off Richmond and turning onto King would cause streetcar delays.

Westbound in PM rush? Always seems to speed up at Bathurst. When have you seen that happen?

No idea what happens in AM rush - as I only go that way after work.

Some of the planters that widen the sidewalk have already been installed. Of course, cyclists are already claiming them as "bike lanes".

I noticed standing in of the new 'stops' the other day, right in front of a ramp (where there's now a yellow strip), that the cyclists seem to think I was in their bike lane.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

My favourite tweet of the #KingStreetPilot is this one.

https://twitter.com/g_meslin/status/931529800774307840

Here are all images from the tweet.

View attachment 127512 View attachment 127513 View attachment 127514 View attachment 127515

.....Cue #KingStreetPilot going permanent in 4 years probably with bluestone paving on the road!

It must be so satisfying for City and TTC staff to see the tremendously positive impact the pilot is having on people lives.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Some of the planters that widen the sidewalk have already been installed. Of course, cyclists are already claiming them as "bike lanes".

View attachment 127500

This is wonderful. This means that cars will get stuck behind streetcars more often, further deterring travel on King. And the length of the LFLRVs means that using taxi stands (or other gaps) to pass the streetcars on the right will be more challenging. Are these being installed on every block?

 

[MetroMan]

This is wonderful. This means that cars will get stuck behind streetcars more often, further deterring travel on King. And the length of the LFLRVs means that using taxi stands (or other gaps) to pass the streetcars on the right will be more challenging. Are these being installed on every block?

Yes. The entire length of the pilot. The city ordered a huge amount of these but they didn't arrive on time. They'll be trickling in over the next little while. The city expects them all to be installed in December. The BIA's will be programming the public areas with music events or just tables and chairs.

The real magic will happen in the Spring when adjacent restaurants will be moving their patios into them instead of the sidewalks. Ironically enough, most of Restaurant Row where this would have the most impact is not getting this treatment. Car drop off areas and taxi stands are going here instead with just a small portion dedicated to these pedestrian areas.

 

[steveintoronto]

I noticed standing in of the new 'stops' the other day, right in front of a ramp (where there's now a yellow strip), that the cyclists seem to think I was in their bike lane.

This is wonderful. This means that cars will get stuck behind streetcars more often, further deterring travel on King. And the length of the LFLRVs means that using taxi stands (or other gaps) to pass the streetcars on the right will be more challenging.

Fitz is sounding an alarm, if I read him correctly, and rightly so. This is not going to end well. Planning better figure out how to lay out a path for cycling, and do it PDQ before someone gets really hurt, most likely a pedestrian or TTC patron alighting or boarding. And the cyclist themselves.I can't blame them for avoiding the incredibly dangerous strip next the track one side, the yellow suicide strip the other. There *isn't room for cyclists* to transit safely on King as presently configured. So why invite the failure of it, and someone's life and safety?

I witnessed mayhem watching the corridor today, as well as riding the King car downtown. It may in fact not be as slow, that doesn't make it fast. It has potential to do a hell of a lot better, compared to LRTs I've ridden in Europe and even in LA of all places. In all fairness, they are true LRTs, not streetcars hamstrung.

Cars were *crazily* ignoring the signs, and even the cops, to go sailing through, some of them at a very high rate of speed to beat the lights. Cops could only stop a fraction of them.

I'll say this: The rate of non-compliance with safety sense, let alone the law, is about equal motorists v. cyclists v. pedestrians. Walking westbound later, (2:30 PM) I was crossing westbound, north side of King at Spadina, and the pedestrians actually obeyed their sign, but motorist turning right just sat there, until I yelled at her (pardon me, it's reflexive from years of cycling) "Hey, either turn now or lose it. You schmooze, you lose". It was all beyond her. And a lot of motorists. She did finally turn with a second or two left on the right turn light. The pedestrians were oblivious to it all. Zombies with iPhones.

Be afraid, be very afraid...they have the vote and procreate too as well as drive in an oblivious manner. Who needs drugs? They have their 'safe spaces' to languish in. Just do as the nice light tells you to...

Tail-backs through many intersections (southbound, at 2:30 for Gawdsakes) were ridiculous. They just don't care if they block traffic, and why should they? There's no personal consequence to their actions.

No enforcement, no success...

And someone get the attention of Planners on the cycling situation. You encourage them to come, then you'll have to deal with the consequences and responsibilities of how this will go wrong.

 

[MetroMan]

Since we're on the topic of poorly thought out curb lane assignment, the point I've been making about the ridiculousness of how the Princess of Wales Theatre curb lane is being given to buses instead of widening a chronically crowded sidewalk, was proven right.

Do they really think that this is a good place to unload/load buses? Mirvish Way (Duncan) is literally the perfect solution being wide open, always devoid of cars and centred perfectly between both theatres.

Meanwhile, they're widening the already wide open sidewalk in front of David Pecaut Square.

(Blue is bus loading, car pullover spots. Green is pedestrian zones)

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Yes. The entire length of the pilot. The city ordered a huge amount of these but they didn't arrive on time. They'll be trickling in over the next little while. The city expects them all to be installed in December. The BIA's will be programming the public areas with music events or just tables and chairs.

The real magic will happen in the Spring when adjacent restaurants will be moving their patios into them instead of the sidewalks. Ironically enough, most of Restaurant Row where this would have the most impact is not getting this treatment. Car drop off areas and taxi stands are going here instead with just a small portion dedicated to these pedestrian areas.

I hope Restaurant Row didnt advocate for taxi stands over into potentially larger patio space

 

[MetroMan]

It's midnight on a Friday night. I'm going to go out and have a peek at King and Spadina. Wish me luck... *runs into the war zone*

(EDIT: I decided to Periscope it. Follow me on Twitter @metromanTO)

 

[mdrejhon]

That's one hellishly huge number of taxis in the nightlife section. Literally New York league.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

Do they really think that this is a good place to unload/load buses? Mirvish Way (Duncan) is literally the perfect solution being wide open, always devoid of cars and centred perfectly between both theatres.

Yes the front entrance of a theatre is the best place to unload a bus. They aren't there all the time though, it may have been a school group going to a show.