GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[Bojaxs]

I hope the Hamilton downtown grows north toward West Harbour. I also hope they extend LRT to West Harbour sooner rather than later. If those two things happen, the best way downtown will be using GO from Confederation, Grimsby, even Aldershot. With the amount of downtown development going on, arena upgrade etc etc, imagine a future where Hamilton becomes a significant draw for Go transit. And one last little thought, imagine if they had actually made the correct decision to build the football stadium at West Harbour. Great connectivity for sports and major concert events.

Having some kind of higher order transit connection from West Harbour GO to downtown would definitely make downtown Hamilton more attractive for office tower development.

The same argument could be made for downtown Mississauga. It'll be interesting to see if the Hurontario line makes downtown Mississauga more attractive to businesses and employers. Even more so if the Milton line had AD2W service.

 

[sixrings]

Having some kind of higher order transit connection from West Harbour GO to downtown would definitely make downtown Hamilton more attractive for office tower development.

The same argument could be made for downtown Mississauga. It'll be interesting to see if the Hurontario line makes downtown Mississauga more attractive to businesses and employers. Even more so if the Milton line had AD2W service.

Although I’m told over and over how there is no demand for offices at MCC magically offices came to downtown VMC once there was a direct link to a subway. It’s all a big coincidence.

 

[JJTheJetPln]

Although I’m told over and over how there is no demand for offices at MCC magically offices came to downtown VMC once there was a direct link to a subway. It’s all a big coincidence.

That's hilarious, especially given just how many office buildings are around MCC. You build one more, and the next thing you know, it's already filled before they finish construction.

 

[christiesplits]

The south side of Aldershot Station is indeed good residential development land. I wonder what the cost-benefit would be of building the garage (which are very expensive to build) and developing the south side with some medium density TOD.

The Wal-Mart Supercenter, only 15 years old, right next door to the Burlington GO is infuriating. Terrible planning.

 

[Willybru21]

The Wal-Mart Supercenter, only 15 years old, right next door to the Burlington GO is infuriating. Terrible planning.

To my understanding a lot of locals didn’t want that Walmart either (it’s one of the worst walmarts I’ve ever been in but that is unrelated to what locals thought about it before it was built). It’s a slight improvement over the car sales lot that was there before it though, at least it actually provides a service to the people around it.

 

[turbanplanner]

The Wal-Mart Supercenter, only 15 years old, right next door to the Burlington GO is infuriating. Terrible planning.

When I think of TOC's in north america that's what comes to mind lmao.

 

[innsertnamehere]

The Wal-Mart Supercenter, only 15 years old, right next door to the Burlington GO is infuriating. Terrible planning.

I mean there is no lack of intensification sites surrounding the GO Station and the Walmart at least provides a grocery store in walking distance in the area in the interim.

Those strip mall plazas are often built for only 25-30 year lifespans anyway. The thing is already halfway there, and will be ready for redevelopment come that time.

 

[Bojaxs]

What's CPKC's subdivision called for where the proposed midtown line is suppose to run? Looking at the track parallel to Dupont St. It looks as if at one point CPKC had started construction on a third track on the south side, but never got around to completing it. Any particular reason why?

Was the recently constructed Davenport bridge futureproofed to allow for a third track to run underneath it?

In the link I provided from Google maps, you can see where it looks as if CPKC constructed a bridge going over Dovercourt Rd., and cleared brush to make room for a future third track.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

 

[Krypto98]

What's CPKC's subdivision called for where the proposed midtown line is suppose to run? Looking at the track parallel to Dupont St. It looks as if at one point CPKC had started construction on a third track on the south side, but never got around to completing it. Any particular reason why?

Was the recently constructed Davenport bridge futureproofed to allow for a third track to run underneath it?

In the link I provided from Google maps, you can see where it looks as if CPKC constructed a bridge going over Dovercourt Rd., and cleared brush to make room for a future third track.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

North Toronto Sub,

 

[Northern Light]

What's CPKC's subdivision called for where the proposed midtown line is suppose to run? Looking at the track parallel to Dupont St. It looks as if at one point CPKC had started construction on a third track on the south side, but never got around to completing it. Any particular reason why?

The Dovercourt bridge maintained the CPKC ROW for 5 tracks at that location. (one truss is not there)

Was the recently constructed Davenport bridge futureproofed to allow for a third track to run underneath it?

The GO Barrie overpass of CPKC allows for 4 tracks to pass underneath.

In the link I provided from Google maps, you can see where it looks as if CPKC constructed a bridge going over Dovercourt Rd., and cleared brush to make room for a future third track.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

Based on Satellite Imagery, the work in the corridor to scrub the former south track bed and area took place circa 2018.

There's a lot of missing gap years in the TO Maps imagery but there were 3 operating tracks in 2005; and 4 in 1978.

***

Edit to add: I don't know for certain the nature of the work in the corridor at that time, but there were a couple of serious incidents in the corridor in 2016/17 that may have led to some investment, but that's merely hypothesis on my part.

Railway Investigation Report R16T0162 - Transportation Safety Board of Canada

www.bst-tsb.gc.ca

Rail Safety Advisory Letter 617-02/18 - Transportation Safety Board of Canada

Deterrence of trespassing activity on railway property

www.tsb.gc.ca

@crs1026 or @smallspy may have more insightful contributions.

 

[Willybru21]

On the topic of the North Toronto Sub here’s the 1992 plan for the corridor, including all the connections to the other subdivisions it runs over/under:

 

[crs1026]

There are a couple of things to note here, before moving to the North Toronto line thread

1) The North Toronto corridor west of Mount Pleasant is most certainly wide enough to house both a 2ish track CP freight line and a 2ish track transit corridor (be it conventional GO heavy rail pax, or some other flavour of transit). CP no longer switches many sidings along this route so would not be seriously impacted by such a proposal.

However.....

2) Similar to LSE east of the Don, and ML on the Kitchener line thru the Brock-Lansdowne area..... building a transit corridor would likely trigger a desire to rework all the aging road underpasses, and CPKC would no doubt pass this cost to government. So costs and impacts would be commensurate to what ML is shouldering for the Ontario line. Certainly doable.... but at a major cost. Can we make the case for giving this funding priority over other potentil corridors ?

3) I can't agree with earlier posts that suggest that VIA would have difficulty reactivating the Don Branch. As much as we hope to reinvigorate the Don Valley, a railway line that runs a stone's throw away from the DVP cannot be described as environmentally intrusive. HSR will have no difficulty qualifying this line for an important (electric) intercity passenger line. It's a short stretch of track, and the major bridge, while in need of repair, is fundamentally sound.

4) While people look at the lovely former North Toronto station and romanticize about it reverting to a railway station.... the reality of land development already in progress in the area of the station, and the cost of building a terminal at Yonge, or converting the heritage structure and surrounding infrastructure (think platforms and layover infra) is not economically viable or simple in an engineering sense. Possibly a new station might be built, especially closer to the Dupont subway (as opposed to Yonge-Summerhill) but I question the desire to add ridership to the already stressed Yonge transit line.

5) Add the cost of buying this line from CPKC and the undesirability of splitting either a GO or an intercity service away from the Union hub

6) The closely parallel TTC Line 2 is not yet running at capacity

7) While the corridor may have width, east of Yonge there would be a need for some new bridges.... very, very big bridges....

So to my mind, while transit might come to this route in about 2060, I can't see either the need nor the political interest in building it sooner than that. By then I will be long gone.... not my problem ;-)

- Paul

 

[Allandale25]

There are a couple of things to note here, before moving to the North Toronto line thread

3) I can't agree with earlier posts that suggest that VIA would have difficulty reactivating the Don Branch. As much as we hope to reinvigorate the Don Valley, a railway line that runs a stone's throw away from the DVP cannot be described as environmentally intrusive. HSR will have no difficulty qualifying this line for an important (electric) intercity passenger line. It's a short stretch of track, and the major bridge, while in need of repair, is fundamentally sound.

- Paul

Reminds me of this that @Willybru21 posted (red arrow added for the Don Branch).

 

[Towered]

There's a lot of missing gap years in the TO Maps imagery but there were 3 operating tracks in 2005; and 4 in 1978.

I can confirm that overgrown, dilapidated remains of a third track are still present on the south side of the ROW in the Dufferin-Bartlett sector, from uh...recent personal observations

 

[Northern Light]

There are a couple of things to note here, before moving to the North Toronto line thread

1) The North Toronto corridor west of Mount Pleasant is most certainly wide enough to house both a 2ish track CP freight line and a 2ish track transit corridor (be it conventional GO heavy rail pax, or some other flavour of transit). CP no longer switches many sidings along this route so would not be seriously impacted by such a proposal.

However.....

2) Similar to LSE east of the Don, and ML on the Kitchener line thru the Brock-Lansdowne area..... building a transit corridor would likely trigger a desire to rework all the aging road underpasses, and CPKC would no doubt pass this cost to government. So costs and impacts would be commensurate to what ML is shouldering for the Ontario line. Certainly doable.... but at a major cost. Can we make the case for giving this funding priority over other potentil corridors ?

3) I can't agree with earlier posts that suggest that VIA would have difficulty reactivating the Don Branch. As much as we hope to reinvigorate the Don Valley, a railway line that runs a stone's throw away from the DVP cannot be described as environmentally intrusive. HSR will have no difficulty qualifying this line for an important (electric) intercity passenger line. It's a short stretch of track, and the major bridge, while in need of repair, is fundamentally sound.

4) While people look at the lovely former North Toronto station and romanticize about it reverting to a railway station.... the reality of land development already in progress in the area of the station, and the cost of building a terminal at Yonge, or converting the heritage structure and surrounding infrastructure (think platforms and layover infra) is not economically viable or simple in an engineering sense. Possibly a new station might be built, especially closer to the Dupont subway (as opposed to Yonge-Summerhill) but I question the desire to add ridership to the already stressed Yonge transit line.

5) Add the cost of buying this line from CPKC and the undesirability of splitting either a GO or an intercity service away from the Union hub

6) The closely parallel TTC Line 2 is not yet running at capacity

7) While the corridor may have width, east of Yonge there would be a need for some new bridges.... very, very big bridges....

So to my mind, while transit might come to this route in about 2060, I can't see either the need nor the political interest in building it sooner than that. By then I will be long gone.... not my problem ;-)

- Paul

I basically agree w/the above, but will put in a couple of asterisks.

Line 2 was quickly approaching capacity before the pandemic and will foreseeably reach its limits by 2040.
Though I don't see what that has to do with a mid-town GO Line as I don't really see that diverting much existing demand from Line 2 in the form likely to evolve.

My other quibble is the 2060 number, we'll see what unfolds, it certainly is not in the short or medium term offing. But that said.........I think by the 2040s it may well be a matter under examination.

Now that's just a bit far out to take seriously. There are simply a long list of projects in the queue first, and that list is in turn based on likely, but not assured growth, with some idea where it likely to go, but no assurances.