GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[torontocolin]

Maybe the coolest part of all this to me is that once we have Landsdowne and Caledonia, Barrie will basically be a Western Express connector from Union north that might even poach line 1 riders once fares are better integrated, a true network!

I'd think that mantle would belong to Kitchener which, when complete, will have stops at King, Bloor, St Clair, Eglinton, Lawrence, and, um, Etobicoke North, with an average of seven and a half minutes between trains at Bloor, Eglinton, and Lawrence, and fifteen at the rest. But either way, if you can run the promised service and properly integrate these two lines with the local TTC service (and knowing Metrolinx, that's a massive if) then I think it starts to become questionable whether you actually need a full DRL west or whether you could terminate at King-Liberty station and then the rest of the money would be better spent enhancing local service through bus/streetcar/LRT investments.

 

[Neutrino]

The Barrie Line is already poaching riders from Line 1 and it will only do so even more starting next week when GO Transit customers start getting 50% off TTC fares. Unfortunately, it's poaching the University leg of the line, rather than the overcrowded Yonge side.

The speed and comfort of the GO train are such that I've often taken the GO train where previously I would have ridden Line 1, and I have a Metropass so the price comparison was $5.02 vs $0.00! Once you've experienced getting from Union to Steeles in under 20 minutes, it's hard to go back to sitting on the subway and bus for an hour.

Line 1 does Downsview Park to Union in 45 minutes, but the GO train does it in 18 minutes. Which means that if you're coming south on Line 1 headed to Union in the AM Peak, it's always faster to get off at Downsview Park and transfer to the GO train. Even in the worst case scenario where you just miss the train and have to wait the full headway of the next train (15 minutes) you'd still get to Union 10 minutes before the train you got off of. On average you'd get there 18 minutes faster, and in the best case scenario you'd get there 25 minutes faster.
(Assuming 2 minutes to change platforms at Downsview Park)

I imagine more frequent service on Stouffville will relieve Yonge to an extent. Have Mlinx and/or TTC done any studies on this? IIRC a downtown relief study from 2012 found that a few extra GO stations would not do much to relieve Yonge, but that's obviously not the same thing as full RER service.

 

[TOareaFan]

^The majority of customers will have their behaviour controlled by “rider inertia”......even with a free transfer i think it would take a very large time saving to get people to leave a vehicle to point A to risk a transfer to another vehicle to point A.

As long as the ride on the first vehicle is going reasonably well (+/- on schedule and not experiencing a current delay) I think most people stay on the vehicle they are currently on.

 

[TOareaFan]

Still whats been suggested does seem to me to be a fair time savings,

Just check on Triplinx....looks like it is scheduled to save s whole minute between Downsview Park and Union

though hopefully it can be put to the test when there is a bad delay. I wonder if the TTC would suggest passengers transfer over the intercom?

yes, I am sure if there is an issue on the subway between the stations then Passengers will be advised to switch to GO (and vice versa).

 

[LNahid2000]

Just check on Triplinx....looks like it is scheduled to save s whole minute between Downsview Park and Union

According to the schedule on GO's website you'd save 9 minutes, plus GO is usually early arriving at Union due to padded schedules. I'm not sure why Triplinx is reporting incorrect information.

 

[Megaton327]

According to the schedule on GO's website you'd save 9 minutes, plus GO is usually early arriving at Union due to padded schedules. I'm not sure why Triplinx is reporting incorrect information.

Triplinx is not reporting incorrect information, @TOareaFan put the destination as Union TTC station rather than the GO station. In addition to the actual walking transfer time, online mapping services like Triplinx or Google Maps tend to have severe difficulty with walking directions/time estimates inside structures such as Union. If GO's stop were used as the destination the time for the train would be much faster and the time for the subway would be much slower.

 

[TOareaFan]

Triplinx is not reporting incorrect information, @TOareaFan put the destination as Union TTC station rather than the GO station. In addition to the actual walking transfer time, online mapping services like Triplinx or Google Maps tend to have severe difficulty with walking directions/time estimates inside structures such as Union. If GO's stop were used as the destination the time for the train would be much faster and the time for the subway would be much slower.

Yes since the premise being discussed was that people on a subway would realize significant time savings by getting off the Subway at DP and switch to a GO train I thought it the right comparison to start the timing from the southbound subway platform (where they would be the moment they stepped off the subway) and to end it at the Union Station TTC stop (where they would end up if they never got off the subway at DP).

Obviously there are a multitude of potential end points, but since it was being suggested that the GO train could offer relief to the subway via TTC to GO Train transfers....this seemed the logical comparison.

I think you are far more likely to see some transfers from GO to TTC at DP than the other way.

 

[smallspy]

^The majority of customers will have their behaviour controlled by “rider inertia”......even with a free transfer i think it would take a very large time saving to get people to leave a vehicle to point A to risk a transfer to another vehicle to point A.

As long as the ride on the first vehicle is going reasonably well (+/- on schedule and not experiencing a current delay) I think most people stay on the vehicle they are currently on.

The TTC has found that an average rider will go up to 10 minutes out of his or her way to avoid a transfer. Or maybe to put it another way, a transfer better save them more than 10 minutes of travel time when compared to their regular route.

And of course, the frequency of the connecting route can also play a factor. It's much easier to justify a transfer to a subway, which has a 5-minute headway off-peak than it is to an express route which may come every 15 minutes.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

 

[Megaton327]

Holy crap, a bad day for the Barrie Line, today of all days. From https://twitter.com/GOtransitBR

To start with, an operational issue caused cascading delays for about 2.5 hours because delayed trains cause the opposite-direction train to wait at the siding:
Update: The Aurora GO 18:11 - Union Station 19:03 #GOtrain is now delayed 26 minutes from Aurora because of an operational issue.
The Union Station 18:00 - Aurora GO 18:49 train #GOtrain is delayed 17 minutes from King GO after waiting for the train ahead.
The Union Station 19:00 - Aurora GO 19:49 #GOtrain is estimated to be delayed 15-20 minutes from Union after waiting for the train ahead.
The Aurora GO 19:01 - Union Station 19:53 #GOtrain is estimated to be delayed 10-15 minutes from Aurora after waiting for the train ahead.
The Aurora GO 20:01 - Union Station 20:53 #GOtrain is estimated to be delayed 10-15 minutes from Aurora after waiting for the train ahead.
The Union Station 20:00 - Aurora GO 20:49 #GOtrain is delayed 12 south of Downsview Park GO after waiting from the train ahead.
Update: The Aurora GO 20:01 - Union Station 20:53 #GOtrain is delayed 21 minutes from King City GO after waiting for the train ahead.

And it got MUCH worse once one of the new switches at Rutherford broke:
Update: The Union 20:00 - Aurora GO 20:49 #GOtrain holding south of Rutherford, track switch problem. Estimated delay is 45-50 mins.
The Allandale Waterfront GO 20:25 - Union 22:03 #GOtrain will hold at Aurora, track switch problem near Rutherford. Update to follow.
The Union 21:00 - Aurora 21:49 #GOtrain holding at Downsview Park due track switch problem. Current delay is 10 minutes. Update to follow.
Barrie #GOtrains: Major track switch problem causing delays & adjustments on your line. Update will follow as information becomes available.
Update: The Union 20:00 - Aurora GO 20:49 #GOtrain to reverse to York U. GO Bus to take passengers all stops north.
Update: Union 21:00 - Aurora 21:49 #GOtrain delayed 29 mins from Downsview Park & ending @ York University due track switch problem.#GObus will be available at each station to take you north.

Yikes. I think these were more or less the final trips until the New Year's late northbound trips starting at about 12:25 AM, hopefully they can manage to get trains running by then but I'm not all that optimistic.

EDIT: the switch has been repaired. The Aurora GO 22:01 - Union Station 22:53 was delayed 23 minutes from Rutherford GO, but they don't anticipate any further delays. Yay!

 

[yrt+viva=1system]

In case this has been lost amongst the pages:

Hwy 407 Bus Terminal
Bus Platforms:
Platform 1 EB: (25F, 40) York University/Richmond Hill Centre
Platform 2 EB: (46, 47-F, 48-B, F ) York University
Platform 8 WB: (46) Square One/Erin Mills Transitway/Oakville GO
Platform 9 WB: (47-F) Bramalea GO/McMaster University
Platform 10 WB: (48-B,F)Bramalea GO/Meadowvale GO/ University of Guelph
Platform 17 WB: (25F) Bramalea GO/Wilfred Laurier University/University of Waterloo
Platform 18 WB: (40) Pearson Airport/Renforth Transitway/Square One/Hamilton GO

http://www.gotransit.com/publicroot/en/travelling/stations.aspx?station=407T

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

If you'd like, here is a "transit" Twitter list that I made and monitor religiously.

Thank you and happy new year!

 

[drum118]

Holy crap, a bad day for the Barrie Line, today of all days. From https://twitter.com/GOtransitBR

To start with, an operational issue caused cascading delays for about 2.5 hours because delayed trains cause the opposite-direction train to wait at the siding:
Update: The Aurora GO 18:11 - Union Station 19:03 #GOtrain is now delayed 26 minutes from Aurora because of an operational issue.
The Union Station 18:00 - Aurora GO 18:49 train #GOtrain is delayed 17 minutes from King GO after waiting for the train ahead.
The Union Station 19:00 - Aurora GO 19:49 #GOtrain is estimated to be delayed 15-20 minutes from Union after waiting for the train ahead.
The Aurora GO 19:01 - Union Station 19:53 #GOtrain is estimated to be delayed 10-15 minutes from Aurora after waiting for the train ahead.
The Aurora GO 20:01 - Union Station 20:53 #GOtrain is estimated to be delayed 10-15 minutes from Aurora after waiting for the train ahead.
The Union Station 20:00 - Aurora GO 20:49 #GOtrain is delayed 12 south of Downsview Park GO after waiting from the train ahead.
Update: The Aurora GO 20:01 - Union Station 20:53 #GOtrain is delayed 21 minutes from King City GO after waiting for the train ahead.

And it got MUCH worse once one of the new switches at Rutherford broke:
Update: The Union 20:00 - Aurora GO 20:49 #GOtrain holding south of Rutherford, track switch problem. Estimated delay is 45-50 mins.
The Allandale Waterfront GO 20:25 - Union 22:03 #GOtrain will hold at Aurora, track switch problem near Rutherford. Update to follow.
The Union 21:00 - Aurora 21:49 #GOtrain holding at Downsview Park due track switch problem. Current delay is 10 minutes. Update to follow.
Barrie #GOtrains: Major track switch problem causing delays & adjustments on your line. Update will follow as information becomes available.
Update: The Union 20:00 - Aurora GO 20:49 #GOtrain to reverse to York U. GO Bus to take passengers all stops north.
Update: Union 21:00 - Aurora 21:49 #GOtrain delayed 29 mins from Downsview Park & ending @ York University due track switch problem.#GObus will be available at each station to take you north.

Yikes. I think these were more or less the final trips until the New Year's late northbound trips starting at about 12:25 AM, hopefully they can manage to get trains running by then but I'm not all that optimistic.

EDIT: the switch has been repaired. The Aurora GO 22:01 - Union Station 22:53 was delayed 23 minutes from Rutherford GO, but they don't anticipate any further delays. Yay!

I was showing someone the transit system who hasn't been here in 15 years and it was the pits. Plan on catching the 21:41 train at Downsview Park to Union, but it ended up being cancel since it was to arrived an hour later and 5 minutes before the 22:31 train. The Aurora Train was sitting there upon arrival and tought it was our train that arrived a head of schedule. It was bitching cold in the Downsview station and rode the subway a few stops north to have a look at a few new one get warm.

When we got back 5 minutes for the first train, found out it was cancel with the 2nd train due in 8 minutes. That 8 minute was still showing 30 minutes later that we gave up and took the subway to Union to get the UPX. Arrived at Union and that Downsview train still hadn't arrived yet.

Even UPX was having major issues to the point we were 6 minutes late leaving and had to wait at both stops. As we use the incline, a southbound pass us. Upon arrival, another train was ready to depart with our train that just arrived was to depart in 5 minutes. The trip was a rough ride both way, with 5 minute between trains going north.

 

[TransitBart]

So what caused all this and what is the solution?

 

[PinkLucy]

I took the UPX at around 6 pm last night with no issues. Flights out of Pearson were a different story, however: lots of delays relating to frozen equipment.

 

[dowlingm]

Trip comparison between Barrie Line and Line 1 also suffers given that Line 1 gives a variety of downtown endpoints whereas Barrie requires additional walking over the subway unless you unless you work at or south of Union Station. It is a real shame that even Lansdowne GO is going to be south of Bloor, creating an inferior Line 2 access scenario, and put in the "do later" pile.