GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[TOareaFan]

If ML didn't get something binding in writing when they paid for that track upgrading, then shame on them. If they did, then that should govern.

- Paul

It really surprises me that the track purchase agreements are not easily accessible public documents.....they should be on ML web page. Most of the times (maybe all) ML buys track from one of the rail companies the public release includes the tag line "CN (or whoever) retains running rights.....I have said it before but if those running rights retained are exactly what they had before then the value of the purchases has to be brought into question....and, yes, I still get the odd notice from ML that train "X" is delayed to allow a freight train to clear....one just last week had such a delay on track owned by ML.

Overall (IMO) ML benefits from the image of them being a "good guy" doing "good work" because we all want the transit issue solved.....but I have a hard time thinking of a body that spends as much taxpayer money with as little real public scrutiny/disclosure as they do.

 

[innsertnamehere]

^MTO?

 

[Allandale25]

Bramalea Station is most certainly not on Metrolinx trackage.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

That helpfully clarifies why Metrolinx can't just easily add the evening/weekend service referenced in Budget 2016 just to Bramalea.

 

[cbrown2009]

And at least advertise the service increase properly.

ML definitely needs to do more advertising. Outside the transit system. Posters, billboards, street signs, whatever it takes. I know people who still don't know about the existence of midday trains to/from Brampton after almost two years.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

The next board period, ie "schedule change" starts June 24th not end of the month.

Thank you fritter. Will we here anything about Stouffville and Barrie at those meetings?

And I wonder how they are going to do hourly service to Barrie w/o that second and third track.

 

[cbrown2009]

That helpfully clarifies why Metrolinx can't just easily add the evening/weekend service referenced in Budget 2016 just to Bramalea.

If and when they reopen Platform 4 at Bramalea, that much, at least, could become easier as that Platform is on a siding track. Been closed for two years now for the simple task of installing an ice melt system and a shed.

 

[Fritter]

Thank you fritter. Will we here anything about Stouffville and Barrie at those meetings?

And I wounder how they are going to do hourly service to Barrie w/o that second and third track.

Sorry, allow me to explain a "board period". A board period is the chunk of the year drivers and train crews bid on work. The company presents the work available and then drivers and train crews select the routes and trips they want to work. The beginning of the board period is the opportunity for the company to make changes like new service. There are usually 5-6 "board periods" per year. the next opportunity for schedule changes after April 8 is June 24th. I'm sorry if I made you think a board period was in reference to the Metrolinx board meetings.

 

[johntauren]

If and when they reopen Platform 4 at Bramalea, that much, at least, could become easier as that Platform is on a siding track. Been closed for two years now for the simple task of installing an ice melt system and a shed.

I haven't seen what looks like any progress on platform 4 in months.
Yes, it's been winter, but this is dating back to summer that it hasn't seemed to change progress.

 

[smallspy]

If CN has an objection to increased GO use of the tail track at Bramalea, I'd sure love to know what it is. That's a most unreasonable position to take. Trains can run to and from Bramalea without ever touching a Halton Sub main line.

Not quite.

Because of the layout of the tracks and crossovers, track #3 has to be used to access Bramalea Station. While it's only 100 metres or so of track from the crossover to #2 and the switch to the pocket track, it's still there. If nothing else, it's spectacularly bad planning on Metrolinx's part to not have the pocket track start further east and bypass all of the mainline crossovers.

Of course, the fact that the pocket has been out of service for the better part of 2 years doesn't help, either.

If ML didn't get something binding in writing when they paid for that track upgrading, then shame on them. If they did, then that should govern.

- Paul

I have no reason to think that they would have. They never have before, nor has VIA - CN has rejected any overtures towards "this is our track, and this is yours".

The next board period, ie "schedule change" starts June 24th not end of the month.

GO doesn't have "board periods". There are scheduled change-of-cards, which happen at the end of April and the end of October every year, but the agreement with Bombardier allows them to request a new timetable at any time.

It really surprises me that the track purchase agreements are not easily accessible public documents.....they should be on ML web page. Most of the times (maybe all) ML buys track from one of the rail companies the public release includes the tag line "CN (or whoever) retains running rights.....I have said it before but if those running rights retained are exactly what they had before then the value of the purchases has to be brought into question....and, yes, I still get the odd notice from ML that train "X" is delayed to allow a freight train to clear....one just last week had such a delay on track owned by ML.

This was the fight that West Coast Express had with CP - they wanted to make the agreements public, whereas CP fought to keep them private - and I do believe that CP won that court case. The argument from the railroads (both CN and CP in this case) is that the costs that they charge the operators such as GO and WCE is a proprietary blend of costs that would allow others to see how they operate.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

 

[crs1026]

Because of the layout of the tracks and crossovers, track #3 has to be used to access Bramalea Station. While it's only 100 metres or so of track from the crossover to #2 and the switch to the pocket track, it's still there. If nothing else, it's spectacularly bad planning on Metrolinx's part to not have the pocket track start further east and bypass all of the mainline crossovers.

Of course, the fact that the pocket has been out of service for the better part of 2 years doesn't help, either.

Looked up the track map and now I see what you mean. That's still a very lame reason for CN to resist. They use the third track for what.....one daily roadswitcher?

This was the fight that West Coast Express had with CP - they wanted to make the agreements public, whereas CP fought to keep them private - and I do believe that CP won that court case. The argument from the railroads (both CN and CP in this case) is that the costs that they charge the operators such as GO and WCE is a proprietary blend of costs that would allow others to see how they operate.

I would bet that the A-G report was intended to pry this open a tad. I wonder what a FOI request would yield. Sure, redact the price information, but information on the number of slots, or amount of track time, GO is allowed has no competitive value.

- Paul

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Sorry, allow me to explain a "board period". A board period is the chunk of the year drivers and train crews bid on work. The company presents the work available and then drivers and train crews select the routes and trips they want to work. The beginning of the board period is the opportunity for the company to make changes like new service. There are usually 5-6 "board periods" per year. the next opportunity for schedule changes after April 8 is June 24th. I'm sorry if I made you think a board period was in reference to the Metrolinx board meetings.

Thanks again. So we if there are even slots at the next board period, then we know for sure if people in Brampton, Stouffville and Barrie get extra service.

 

[jys]

could someone post a link to the planned service increases over the next few years again? I always forget where to find it.

Is this what your talking about?
http://www.metrolinx.com/en/regionalplanning/rer/rer_service.aspx

 

[djsurflfs]

I mentioned in the Brampton Transit thread that BT plans to operate the 501A, at least, right into the campus if fare integration isn't going to happen. There will probably be more 501A service once the subway opens too; BT expects ridership to grow on the corridor, especially on the express variant.

BT's first open house for the 2017-2018 service plan is this Thursday.

YRT and the TTC will still operate a few buses on the ring road.

Brampton Transit will also run right into campus (as opposed to ending at VMC Pioneer Village) in 2 of its 3 service change options for 501/501A, according to its 2017 Service Plan:

http://www.brampton.ca/EN/residents...ts/Documents/BramptonTransit_PICBoardsWeb.pdf

 

[crs1026]

Thanks again. So we if there are even slots at the next board period, then we know for sure if people in Brampton, Stouffville and Barrie get extra service.

The process is - the bus or rail operator determines what the new schedule plan (routes, frequency, timings) will be. Then someone (often a combination of management and union reps at this point) convert that to a detailed plan of each "piece of work" - when each individual job starts, ends, where the breaks are, when and where the changeoffs are, etc. That whole document (it's huge) gets posted and each worker bids on which job they would like to fill (usually by seniority).

So yes, every time there is a board period, there is an advance insight into what the runs are and how often they run. If it takes more people to run the new schedule, there will be more jobs to bid on.

The process is internal to the operator and their workers, but it happens well in advance of the start of the schedule, so word may trickle out. The political level hates this, because the grapevine may be talking before the politician has held their photo op to take all the credit. People in the planning and scheduling offices actually have to sign non-disclosure agreements around this, especially when GO is changing schedules and the local transit operators are trying to coordinate to these.

- Paul

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

The process is - the bus or rail operator determines what the new schedule plan (routes, frequency, timings) will be. Then someone (often a combination of management and union reps at this point) convert that to a detailed plan of each "piece of work" - when each individual job starts, ends, where the breaks are, when and where the changeoffs are, etc. That whole document (it's huge) gets posted and each worker bids on which job they would like to fill (usually by seniority).

So yes, every time there is a board period, there is an advance insight into what the runs are and how often they run. If it takes more people to run the new schedule, there will be more jobs to bid on.

The process is internal to the operator and their workers, but it happens well in advance of the start of the schedule, so word may trickle out. The political level hates this, because the grapevine may be talking before the politician has held their photo op to take all the credit. People in the planning and scheduling offices actually have to sign non-disclosure agreements around this, especially when GO is changing schedules and the local transit operators are trying to coordinate to these.

- Paul

Ok. So it's a waiting game at this point then. End of the month. Fingers crossed for extra service!