GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[reaperexpress]

Let’s hope there’s no major TTC disruptions on this day: View attachment 512013

Truly a fantastic piece of graphic design. Conveys all the necessary information in a simple and intuitive way.
One note though - if you make diagrams using Metrolinx's style, you should clearly credit yourself as the creator, to avoid the graphic being misconstrued as an official Metrolinx document.

 

[Northern Light]

"No matter the difficulty" is a poor way to allocate public expenditure. The public benefits that a project brings should be weighed against the costs - namely the financial burden on citizens to pay for the construction and maintenance.

I agree.

But I think its important to illustrate for newcomers to the discussion why there is no easy solution here; or for that matter a moderately over-priced and less than effective one.

****

There is no underground connection available today, or easily buildable, even as a straight walking connection, never mind with movator (flat escalator/moving sidewalk)

There is no other practical way (sky bridge?) to make the connection any easier/quicker at really any cost, but certainly any vaguely reasonable one.

The best available option is really one of making sure there is adequate sidewalk width, some streetscaping, and maybe, at a push, some weather protection (canopy)

****

To truly make this connection more efficient; you need the two lines closer together; this is only achievable by either moving the GO Line(s) north, almost certainly underground, quite deeply.......or by pushing the subway tunnel south (with the small matter of the bus terminals current location).

To be clear, the above is absurdly costly...........and is unlikely to be worthwhile achieving, if not ever, then certainly in the near or medium terms.

***

PS @reaperexpress I know you know all of the above, I'm just putting it out there for those who do not.

 

[Sunnyside]

"No matter the difficulty" is a poor way to allocate public expenditure. The public benefits that a project brings should be weighed against the costs - namely the financial burden on citizens to pay for the construction and maintenance.

Ok, I’ll reword this. I meant it as hyperbole but I see it won’t read that way. Better to say it’s’ “worth more serious financial consideration” than it receives today.

 

[Sunnyside]

I agree.

But I think its important to illustrate for newcomers to the discussion why there is no easy solution here; or for that matter a moderately over-priced and less than effective one.

****

There is no underground connection available today, or easily buildable, even as a straight walking connection, never mind with movator (flat escalator/moving sidewalk)

There is no other practical way (sky bridge?) to make the connection any easier/quicker at really any cost, but certainly any vaguely reasonable one.

The best available option is really one of making sure there is adequate sidewalk width, some streetscaping, and maybe, at a push, some weather protection (canopy)

****

To truly make this connection more efficient; you need the two lines closer together; this is only achievable by either moving the GO Line(s) north, almost certainly underground, quite deeply.......or by pushing the subway tunnel south (with the small matter of the bus terminals current location).

To be clear, the above is absurdly costly...........and is unlikely to be worthwhile achieving, if not ever, then certainly in the near or medium terms.

***

PS @reaperexpress I know you know all of the above, I'm just putting it out there for those who do not.

I like the idea of an elevated walkway actually. The walk as it is isn’t exactly flat, although I’m not wholly familiar with the grading on a consistent-user basis. Most of what you’ve stated here is a given, my point is moreso that we seem to have accepted these kinds of costs for Dundas West-Bloor GO when this can serve the same functionality elsewhere. Shifting the tracks is a non-starter of course and so is an underground passageway unless a developer paid for it(?). And while It’s obviously a further transfer than Bloor GO, I don’t see why we should settle for the way Main-Danforth is today. The difference in cost between the two tracks the disparity in experience imo.

Nonetheless, there are evidently times when people are going to be encouraged to make this kind of transfer anyhow. There are likewise many subway-GO transfers we are deliberately improving. I think compared to what was needed at say Leslie-Oriole, an elevated walkway (no movator required in my books) is not a technical challenge as much as it is one of willpower. The key element is that you are telling people on a visual and experiential level, “this is a transfer you can make, and we’ve made it easy to navigate!” . So, I can easily forego grade desperation if we see anything on this front.

 

[rbt]

To truly make this connection more efficient; you need the two lines closer together; this is only achievable by either moving the GO Line(s) north, almost certainly underground, quite deeply.......or by pushing the subway tunnel south (with the small matter of the bus terminals current location).

To be clear, the above is absurdly costly...........and is unlikely to be worthwhile achieving, if not ever, then certainly in the near or medium terms.

We can get 60% of the benefit by adding a ramp/staircase and bus/tram stop on the west side for those heading to GO, and moving the existing 506/64/135 stops to a sheltered stop at the top of the existing ramp for those heading to the subway. The cost of doing this would be fairly low.

 

[Northern Light]

We can get 60% of the benefit by adding a staircase and bus/tram stop on the west side for those heading to GO, and moving the existing 506/64/135 stops to a sheltered stop at the top of the existing stairs for those heading to the subway. The cost of doing this would be a few hundred thousand.

You mean the ramp? The stairs to Danforth GO are locked/abandoned.

Placing a stop there for NB passengers (to Main Stn) would mean eliminating any stop at Main/Danforth, they're far too close to have 2 in such close proximity. Getting traffic to stop it an interesting question

***

There are no stairs or ramp on the the west side of the bridge.

 

[rbt]

You mean the ramp? The stairs to Danforth GO are locked/abandoned.

Placing a stop there for NB passengers (to Main Stn) would mean eliminating any stop at Main/Danforth, they're far too close to have 2 in such close proximity. Getting traffic to stop it an interesting question

***

There are no stairs or ramp on the the west side of the bridge.

Yeah, that was my point. Building a west side ramp/staircase is the missing piece to make a bus/tram stop useful for those who can't make the 300m walk to the station without added protection.

 

[Northern Light]

Yeah, that was my point. Building a west side ramp/staircase is the missing piece to make a bus/tram stop useful for those who can't make the 300m walk to the station without added protection.

A west side staircase doesn't actually shorten the trip, except, perhaps, if you're in the first car of a WB or last car of an EB GO train.

Its the same trip north along Main.

It does make the GO Station easier to access if you're coming from west of Main, but it does nothing if you're coming from Main Station itself (which is on the east side of Main).

 

[nfitz]

We can get 60% of the benefit by adding a ramp/staircase and bus/tram stop on the west side for those heading to GO, and moving the existing 506/64/135 stops to a sheltered stop at the top of the existing ramp for those heading to the subway. The cost of doing this would be fairly low.

The previous stop at the top of the east stairs at Danforth GO was removed for safety reasons, and the stairs were fenced off. I don't see them adding another one on the west!

It's a 4-minute walk from Danforth GO to Main Street station. Obviously no one is moving tracks. Building a 300-metre long tunnel from the TTC concourse to the GO station is the best hope. And could be faster than many existing underground connections, with a moving sidewalk.

Is it that different than the 200-metre tunnel from the Line 1 platform to Line 2 platform at Spadina station? Or the 250-metre one at Kipling station from the GO Bus platforms to the subway platform?

The tunnel from the Vaughan Centre bus platform to the VIVA platform is 300 metres! Possibly over 400 metres walk if your bus drops you off at the north end of the bus terminal!

 

[reaperexpress]

It's a 4-minute walk from Danforth GO to Main Street station. Obviously no one is moving tracks. Building a 300-metre long tunnel from the TTC concourse to the GO station is the best hope. And could be faster than many existing underground connections, with a moving sidewalk.

Is it that different than the 200-metre tunnel from the Line 1 platform to Line 2 platform at Spadina station? Or the 250-metre one at Kipling station from the GO Bus platforms to the subway platform?

The tunnel from the Vaughan Centre bus platform to the VIVA platform is 300 metres! Possibly over 400 metres walk if your bus drops you off at the north end of the bus terminal!

The transfers you listed are among the worst in the system. Achieving that level of connection doesn't seem like much of an accomplishment. Remember that the longer it takes to transfer, the less likely it is that making the transfer will be the fastest option for people's trip. Even with a tunnel, it would not be a very attractive connection and not that many people would transfer between GO and the subway there.

The effect of building a Main Street pedestrian tunnel is that transferring passengers wouldn't have to go up and down as far, assuming it connects directly from GO platform level to TTC concourse level (the TTC faregates would need to be relocated to the concourse where they originally were). It also saves the time of waiting for the pedestrian signal at Danforth, and reduces the number of pedestrians conflicting with buses turning left on to Danforth, potentially reducing delays. These are tangible benefits, so if the tunnel could be built built affordably it could be a good decision. But if it's going to cost a ton of money, there are probably better places we could be investing in infrastructure.

 

[Amare]

Metrolinx theoretically could've added a provision for a future tunnel when they sold off the land adjacent to Danforth GO, but instead they sold it for a quick buck without any community benefits whatsoever, in potentially one of the most shortsighted selling of a piece of land we have witnessed in recent times.

There's now a development proposal for Main Square where the city could theoretically work with the developer to secure such a provision, but it doesnt really make much sense anymore since Metrolinx dropped the ball on their end. Unfortunately that was pretty much the last "affordable" option to create any logical connection between Main Street station and Danforth GO, so I dont see the connection ever being improved between the two.

 

[Willybru21]

Truly a fantastic piece of graphic design. Conveys all the necessary information in a simple and intuitive way.

One note though - if you make diagrams using Metrolinx's style, you should clearly credit yourself as the creator, to avoid the graphic being misconstrued as an official Metrolinx document.

Thanks! Yeah I try to copy Metrolinx’s style but with improvements, I find the current disruption maps provide little to no information on what to do, and they’re just made poorly in general:

I’ll definitely look into watermarking my maps, not sure how to do it though.

 

[Bordercollie]

Let’s hope there’s no major TTC disruptions on this day: View attachment 512013

Why on a Monday?

 

[Bordercollie]

Truly a fantastic piece of graphic design. Conveys all the necessary information in a simple and intuitive way.

Thanks! Yeah I try to copy Metrolinx’s style but with improvements, I find the current disruption maps provide little to no information on what to do, and they’re just made poorly in general: View attachment 512226

I’ll definitely look into watermarking my maps, not sure how to do it though.

Are they going to connect it to the main line?

 

[reaperexpress]

Truly a fantastic piece of graphic design. Conveys all the necessary information in a simple and intuitive way.

Thanks! Yeah I try to copy Metrolinx’s style but with improvements, I find the current disruption maps provide little to no information on what to do, and they’re just made poorly in general: View attachment 512226

I’ll definitely look into watermarking my maps, not sure how to do it though.

I love how the only part they translated to French was "route", which is already a French word.