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GO Transit Electrification | Metrolinx

I think we will eventually end up with a hybrid system of high and low level platforms mainly due to the cost of rebuilding. A lot of European system operate both on high level and low level platforms and I don’t think it’s hinder them much, Db and SNCF will of course have experience one way or another.

Googling around, I did come across some photos of Austria’s Westbahn Stadler KISS at both a high level and low level platform. Doesn’t seem to be a problem for them.

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There is an new alternative that satisfies both the needs of easy passenger flow and higher capacity double decker for longer distance riders................The new Paris RER NG {new generation} Alstom trains. They are fully articulated trains but every other car is completely single level entry/exit leading to the double level cars. Essentially they are standard subway type entry cars connected to double decker ones. Single level--DD-SL-DD etc.

Paris RER was suffering from the problem of most DD trains............the dwell times were slowing them down and accessibility was a problem for people with mobility issues which will only grow as the population ages. It takes the front entry doors of DD from being walk-in closets to full Metro accessibility. Basically they are a hybrid train that services the needs of both short and medium distance suburban travelers. They are well into testing and the first delivery is later this year and will be deployed on 3 lines and Paris expects almost all their new order from here on in will be this format for their RER system while her commuter system {Translien} will continue with double deckers.

Single level Metro for short trips, single & double decker for suburban, and double decker for commuter. Different train types for different riders.

As I said earlier there is no "one size fits all" trains because there is no such thing as a "one size fits all" rider and Paris has acknowledge that and so should ML.
 
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I don't think there is any issue with GO using double decked trains for RER. There are many factors that affect dwell time such as scheduling, crew change, vertical access at the station, passenger load, number of doors and width of the doors on the train, level boarding, and obstacles to reaching the door. But there are also factors that will limit the capacity of the line including the length of the train, the number of decks, the number of seats vs standees, obstacles on the train, and frequency of trains on the route which ties into track availability. With all that in mind there are situations where double decked trains will make sense in an RER context. If passengers know that the doors aren't going to hang open while they pack their things on the second deck, then those passengers are going to learn to move to the lower deck before reaching the station at which point the fact it is two floors becomes irrelevant.
 
One thing that is needed for DD cars is a platform that meet the current car floor or new cars that meet the existing platform with a gap plate filler at the doors.

The KISS DD that I have been on as well seeing them in various countries along with other trains have a sliding gap plate at all doors regardless if they have high or low platforms. This applies to newer equipment less than 25 year old.

I have seen Austria’s Westbahn Stadler KISS first hand with videos and photos going back to 2012.

Metrolinx own track system stations with no freight traffic can be one level only platform to allow accessibility community to be able to use any car regardless if it electrify or not.

Regardless if the line is electrify or not, dwell time is based on ridership, size of platform, but most of all the ability to exit the platform. Union Station is still a choke point with only 3 stairs off it with 1,000-2, 000 trying to get off when 1 or 2 trains arrive at the same time. Any centre platform with only one exit will slow down the dwell time regardless if the train is single level or DD. Riders themselves also slow down the dwell time.

Electrifying the line will help to deal with the dwell time with a faster departure.
 
ssiguy2 said:
There is an new alternative that satisfies both the needs of easy passenger flow and higher capacity double decker for longer distance riders................The new Paris RER NG {new generation} Alstom trains. They are fully articulated trains but every other car is completely single level ntry/exit leading to the double level cars. Essentially they are standard subway type entry cars connected to double decker ones. Single level--DD-SL-DD etc.
Click to expand...
You're confusing two different types of equipment.

The RER NG trains are not yet in service, and being built by both Alstom and Bombardier. They are are oriented of single-level power cab cars and mix of double-deck intermediate unpowered and powered coaches.

The trains that you are describing are the Bombardier Omneo sets which were originally built for inter-regional and longer-distance travel, but have been pressed into service on RER Line E. These ones will be replaced - and shifted elsewhere to replace older stock - on the non-RER regional Parisian lines by the RER NG trainsets.

ssiguy2 said:
Paris RER was suffering from the problem of most DD trains............the dwell times were slowing them down and accessibility was a problem for people with mobility issues which will only grow as the population ages. It takes the front entry doors of DD from being walk-in closets to full Metro accessibility. Basically they are a hybrid train that services the needs of both short and medium distance suburban travelers. They are well into testing and the first delivery is later this year and will be deployed on 3 lines and Paris expects almost all their new order from here on in will be this format for their RER system while her commuter system {Translien} will continue with double deckers.
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While station dwells seem to be a concern, they are still quite happy with their double-deck Atléo/MI2N design which they've been using on the most heavily used line for the last 25 years. This equipment is not up for replacement any time soon, and in fact they will likely build more of it - or at least updated versions - when the time comes.

ssiguy2 said:
Single level Metro for short trips, single & double decker for suburban, and double decker for commuter. Different train types for different riders.
Click to expand...
Except that's not what's happening in Paris. The RER is absolutely used for short-distance trips in some parts of Paris, and Lines A uses double-deck stock. The lesser used lines use older single-level cars.

Keep in mind too, that the equipment RER uses is for the most case not the same as the equipment used on the suburban lines, even though they run to many of the same places.

Dan
 
I agree with all of you about rolling stock, specificaly parisian stocks.
When I read what you've written I think that Parisian RER System is the good model for Toronto, a mix of subway et commuter trains (crossing downtown).
 
drum118 said:
One thing that is needed for DD cars is a platform that meet the current car floor or new cars that meet the existing platform with a gap plate filler at the doors.

The KISS DD that I have been on as well seeing them in various countries along with other trains have a sliding gap plate at all doors regardless if they have high or low platforms. This applies to newer equipment less than 25 year old.

I have seen Austria’s Westbahn Stadler KISS first hand with videos and photos going back to 2012.

Metrolinx own track system stations with no freight traffic can be one level only platform to allow accessibility community to be able to use any car regardless if it electrify or not.

Regardless if the line is electrify or not, dwell time is based on ridership, size of platform, but most of all the ability to exit the platform. Union Station is still a choke point with only 3 stairs off it with 1,000-2, 000 trying to get off when 1 or 2 trains arrive at the same time. Any centre platform with only one exit will slow down the dwell time regardless if the train is single level or DD. Riders themselves also slow down the dwell time.

Electrifying the line will help to deal with the dwell time with a faster departure.
Click to expand...
Any company can implement gap fillers
 
Latest update. Capital Projects Group report for the February 17, 2022 Metrolinx Board meeting.

• On November 30, bids closed on the GO Expansion On-Corridor Works package following a multi-year procurement process. The successful proponent team will be responsible for delivering 15-minute-or-better, all-day service on our core lines. This works package includes implementing overhead electrification, upgrading train control systems, and expanding tracks and structures along the corridors to allow for over 6,000 weekly train trips. Two proponent teams, EnTransit and ONxpress Transportation Partners, have submitted their proposals. Each team brings together international firms with extensive experience building and running frequent electric regional rail networks outside North America with local partners. Infrastructure Ontario and Metrolinx will evaluate the proposals and announce the winning team in Spring 2022. There will be a 24-month development phase after the contract is awarded, where Metrolinx and the successful proponent will work collaboratively on design, early investigations, schedule optimization, and key initial construction work. Construction is expected to start in late 2022 or early 2023
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