News   Nov 22, 2024
National Housing Day: City of Toronto and Riverdale Co-op Open Affordable Homes
 642     1 
News   Nov 22, 2024
Bauhaus Condos Rising in Toronto's Old Town
 1.1K     5 
News   Nov 22, 2024
49-Storey Waterfront Tower Proposed at Spadina and Queens Quay
 3K     8 

GO Transit Electrification | Metrolinx

Reecemartin said:
The NDP cutting transit seems unthinkable.
Click to expand...
So many things that have happened seem unthinkable - I didn't think I'd ever having to take far-right populists, nationalists and neo-nazis seriously in my lifetime - but here we are.

The NDP cuts to transit the last time they were elected caught me by surprise - it certainly wasn't what they campaigned on - and I voted for Peterson (though ironically I voted for Rae when Peterson won previously)!. In particular cancelling the plans for the Downtown Relief Line (because they didn't want more jobs downtown - Jack Layton was instrumental in cancelling that) and deferring the planned suburban rapid transit for about 4 years were particularly odious. If we go on track record, the PCs have been better in most transitions on continuing transit than the NDP!

The bottom line, is the NDP weren't very experienced ... they got in power in 1990, and didn't handle it well. Like a deer in headlights. I suppose now if they got into power again, they've at least got all the experienced MPPs that they had last time to provide behind-the-scenes advice. What are Bob Rae and Giorgio Mammoliti doing these days? :)

Reecemartin said:
Nonetheless most of these points have been clarified if you dig into the announcements and technical documentation.
Click to expand...
Have they? Versta seemed to be saying in the press conference that it wouldn't necessarily be electrified. Do we have a transcript? A lot of the technical documentation dates from the initial RFQ under the previous document. It will be interesting to see what's in the RFQ.
 
Neutrino said:
Every time nfitz opens his mouth I face palm.
Click to expand...
Are you saying that I'm wrong, and that the NDP didn't cut back GO service and delay TTC expansion the last time we elected them, setting back transit for years? (not as bad as the PCs did 5 years later though).
 
No, your ridiculous comment about neo nazis. I'm no fan of the NDP as you may have gathered.
 
Neutrino said:
No, your ridiculous comment about neo nazis.
Click to expand...
Completely off-topic here ... but have you seen some of the extremists in Europe affiliated with parties like Golden Dawn and Magyar Gárda? Fortunately, such extremism doesn't seem to have caught on here much ... and even the New Constitution Party of Canada office on Main Street seems to have closed (ironically replaced by a flower store) but there's been the odd rally here too ... not to mention Proud Boys. I don't think they are getting much traction ... but it seemed unthinkable not many years ago - at least to me. Not sure why you think acknowledging that is ridiculous. And then there's Mongolia ... is the Guardian ridiculous - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/aug/02/mongolia-far-right
 
Last edited:
I really hope they don't go with bi-levels as I think they will regret it. They are the vastly superior choice for commuter systems where people get on and then nearly everyone heads to one major station ie Union. Passenger flow is not an issue but rather one of sheer capacity due to operating at jus peak rush hour times and by those metrics, bi-levels are great.

The whole point of RER however is that it takes GO from being just a commuter service to a far more suburban subway/Metro-lite one. That means vastly more trains running off-peak with most riders NOT going to Union but rather getting on/off for more medium distance travel. That requires trains that allow for excellent passenger flows and that is bi-levels greatest challenge. The doors are too thin, the entry ways too crowded, and there are notoriously bad for people with strollers or mobility issues.

Logically, the entry areas should be reserved for such areas and everyone else walks up/down to get a seat but people don't act logically. When people are going shorter distances they tend to stand and do so up against the nearest door. This makes dwell times far longer, more cumbersome, wheelchair unfriendly, and hence makes the system less accessible and slower with lower potential frequency.
 
Even with full blown RER in place, most people will still be getting on and off and Union, even off peak. The exact percentage may decline a bit, but there won't be a major shift away from Union in the foreseeable future.
 
nfitz said:
Completely off-topic here ... but have you seen some of the extremists in Europe affiliated with parties like Golden Dawn and Magyar Gárda? Fortunately, such extremism doesn't seem to have caught on here much ... and even the New Constitution Party of Canada office on Main Street seems to have closed (ironically replaced by a flower store) but there's been the odd rally here too ... not to mention Proud Boys. I don't think they are getting much traction ... but it seemed unthinkable not many years ago - at least to me. Not sure why you think acknowledging that is ridiculous. And then there's Mongolia ... is the Guardian ridiculous - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/aug/02/mongolia-far-right
Click to expand...

At least in the North American context, talk of "neo nazis" is vastly, vastly overblown, as you acknowledge. Much of the extremist "right wing" stuff is a reaction to extreme tendencies on the other side. This is what we're seeing in both Europe and North America. It's a reaction to people perceiving self serving governments and corporations not meeting their needs. Doesn't make either of those currents right, but it's understandable where they're coming from. Extremism of any stripe is bad, as you also acknowledged previously. My point is that in the North American context, claims of neo nazism are vastly overstated.
 
Neutrino said:
At least in the North American context, talk of "neo nazis" is vastly, vastly overblown, as you acknowledge. Much of the extremist "right wing" stuff is a reaction to extreme tendencies on the other side.
Click to expand...
I wasn't particularly thinking, or mentioned, North America ... though there are some odd things that go on in in the old south. I still don't know me being surprised that we'd see a rise of extremism (of any variety honestly) in western society is ridiculous - surely it's far worse to ridicule others for not sharing your position!

Extreme tendencies on the other side? Extremism of any form is a nightmare ... but what other side in Canada and the USA? We don't see far-left communism or Marxism anywhere these days - I don't even see the Marxist newspapers you used to see in the 1970s and 1980s. Even the NDP tout fiscal conservatism these days, and had the lowest projected deficits in the last Ontario election, with the PCs the highest. No one proposes the 90% tax rate for the very rich that the right-wing was in favour after the war. And surely the reaction to self-serving corporations shouldn't be to support the conservative or even centrist parties!

To go back on topic ... I don't think the NDP again cutting back on transit expansion for fiscal reasons is unthinkable - partly because they seem much more sensitive as looking though they are running deficits than the other two parties.

Neutrino said:
Even with full blown RER in place, most people will still be getting on and off and Union, even off peak. The exact percentage may decline a bit, but there won't be a major shift away from Union in the foreseeable future.
Click to expand...
If they do open full-blown interchange stations with a relief line at Exhibition and Broadview/Eastern, they could put a significant dent in it. Though I doubt Union will ever not be the busiest station - at least this century.
 
You see a lot of far left extremism seeping into and from the universities and other public sector organizations. All the equity/equality of outcome stuff? That's a major part of it and driven by university grads taught by an increasingly politically homogeneous group of instructors. Take it from me who's seen it up close in the university the last few years. Many university faculties and programs, particularly in the humanities, have become bastions of leftist indoctrination. Brainwashed grads go out into the workforce and implement their hare brained ideas in the public and private sectors. This is particularly strong in the field of education (which I've worked in). Education grads bring their ideas to bear on public schools. Under their influence, high school students adopt similar political positions and pursue similar programs in universities; the cycle continues. Also see the work of Jonathan Haidt from NYU who has documented this process in the United States with many similarities to how its occurred in Canada over the last 30 years.


Anyway, back on topic.
 
Last edited:
Neutrino said:
You see a lot of far left extremism seeping into and from the universities and other public sector organizations.
Click to expand...
It always was in the universities ... but hang on .. extreme left? There's no evidence of that. Equality and equity aren't even far left let alone extreme left! The article doesn't even mention socialists, just liberals ... which are very centrist, and are at best (worst) slightly left!

But to go back on topic - do you think the NDP wouldn't cancel transit expansion again, or are you simply trying to troll by changing the subject, and taking what was said out of context?
 
Last edited:
The Stadler KISS units (Caltrain) are Alternate FRA compliant, right? Have those regs been adopted by TC? I have been wondering what standard the Stadlers Rocky got were built to.
 
nfitz said:
It always was in the universities ... but hang on .. extreme left? There's no evidence of that. Equality and equity aren't even far left let alone extreme left! The article doesn't even mention socialists, just liberals ... which are very centrist, and are at best (worst) slightly left!

But to go back on topic - do you think the NDP wouldn't cancel transit expansion again, or are you simply trying to troll by changing the subject, and taking what was said out of context?
Click to expand...
Not at all, and also this isn't really the right thread to debate communist/facist ideas.
 
You must log in or register to post here.

Back
Top