GO Transit Electrification | Metrolinx

[innsertnamehere]

It's been 10 years since McGuinty promised 2WAD on all corridors. It will be another 10 before we see it.

RER really launched in 2015. Even then the original 2025 date was deemed aggressive.

Agreed construction has been slow.. but we are less than a year out from contract close now on OnCorr, the main contract, and there are a lot of smaller contracts that have been underway for a while.

The way IO contracts work too is that they take forever to get started but once the contract closes things absolutely fly. It's not like standard procurement where construction moves at the rate of government cash flow - the private financing means the money flows quickly to get construction done as quickly as possible.

Prior to the pandemic Metrolinx was really starting to ramp up service improvements for GO as well. That has understandably been on hold for the last bit but it will return with a vengeance as Metrolinx now has ground to recover in terms of service improvements. I'm hopeful we'll start seeing some "net new" trips being added again before the end of the year.

 

[robmausser]

Prior to the pandemic Metrolinx was really starting to ramp up service improvements for GO as well. That has understandably been on hold for the last bit but it will return with a vengeance as Metrolinx now has ground to recover in terms of service improvements. I'm hopeful we'll start seeing some "net new" trips being added again before the end of the year.

This has been almost painful, since the Stouffville line basically has double track all the way to Unionville now and COULD theoretically support very frequent service, but doesnt because of COVID.

 

[crs1026]

This has been almost painful, since the Stouffville line basically has double track all the way to Unionville now and COULD theoretically support very frequent service, but doesnt because of COVID.

Actually, the double track meant nothing with the stations contract having come later. At Milliken, some recently laid track actually was torn up when the stations work started.

ML is far from effective at sequencing work. And it allows the spec to change as more pieces get rethought. .

There’s no doubt that private sector constructors use money better. Doing half the project earlier than necessary, while some other piece plods along, is not good money management.

- Paul

 

[Rainforest]

This has been almost painful, since the Stouffville line basically has double track all the way to Unionville now and COULD theoretically support very frequent service, but doesnt because of COVID.

Scarborough Junction (not grade separated) might limit the possible frequency, as well as the single track section just north of the junction.

 

[crs1026]

Scarborough Junction (not grade separated) might limit the possible frequency, as well as the single track section just north of the junction.

The grade separated junction struck me as a very wise bit of future proofing. I hope that ML’s subsequent analysis is objective and not just motivatedby theneed to put money elsewhere.

We will see whether it proves to be necessary as VIA HFR , Stouffville 2WAD, and Bowmanville 2WAD are delivered.

I’m sure Mr Verster will have received his gold watch and made a triumphant exit before that problem comes back to bite ML.

- Paul

 

[ShonTron]

I was feeling acute wanderlust recently, so I took a trip last week on the Kitchener Line to Mount Pleasant. The trains are still mostly empty, so it's pretty safe to ride. (Passenger behaviour on GO is usually much better than the TTC, anyway.) I saw a lot work going on. I feel like I should do a tour of the Barrie Line sometime soon too.

A lot of additional work has started or is about to start on the inner portion of the Kitchener Line - a new station at Bramalea is mostly complete, a new station track at Malton, additional platform at Weston, new station at Mount Dennis and the 401 tunnels are well underway. Track expansion at Bloor Station and to the south will start soon, along with the Railpath extension.

Woodbine Station and the closure of Etobicoke North, the capacity improvement through Brampton (the pieces are coming together for that major project), the new track through Guelph, and improvements around Georgetown are also well underway.

The Barrie Line is also getting some significant upgrades: the Davenport Diamond flyover, double tracking, and the new Rutherford Station and overpass are also going on.

Metrolinx could do a better job communicating the work completed, started, or in development along its rail corridors and explaining the short and long term benefits of that work will bring.

 

[Rainforest]

The grade separated junction struck me as a very wise bit of future proofing. I hope that ML’s subsequent analysis is objective and not just motivatedby theneed to put money elsewhere.

I'd love to share that hope. Unfortunately, prior actions of our public transit agencies don't provide many examples of a great foresight.

Perhaps this time is different, and Metrolinx is perfect

 

[ssiguy2]

Actually, the double track meant nothing with the stations contract having come later. At Milliken, some recently laid track actually was torn up when the stations work started.

ML is far from effective at sequencing work. And it allows the spec to change as more pieces get rethought. .

There’s no doubt that private sector constructors use money better. Doing half the project earlier than necessary, while some other piece plods along, is not good money management.

- Paul

This is what happens when you put out a tender for a massive transit project but don't put any specifications on the project to begin with.

After 7 years of construction and talk, Torontonians still don't know what kind of trains they are getting, the technology they will use, or the fares they'll pay.

 

[Coolstar]

the technology they will use,

We know they're using overhead catenary to electrify the system though...

 

[mdu]

We know they're using overhead catenary to electrify the system though...

What ssiguy2 really means is that they haven't announced a pivot to the one and only true electrification system (at least according to him), battery trains.

 

[ssiguy2]

Listen kids, in 2014 Metrolinx announced the RER system and it's service will be each-way, all-day, 15 minute service. Now, 7 years later can any of you say you have been given any updates as to what that pertains?

 

[MrGoose]

Err yes

Listen kids, in 2014 Metrolinx announced the RER system and it's service will be each-way, all-day, 15 minute service. Now, 7 years later can any of you say you have been given any updates as to what that pertains?

There’s a whole business plan detailing the headways and frequencies, including the costs and projected riderships.

It has been basically confirmed that the system will be canatary wires, the specific train set isn’t set yet, but that’s something that can come later.

A ton of preliminary works to prepare the tracks for 2way all day service have been started with many more yet to start. Stations have and are being rebuilt, and grade separations are happening across the system.

The electrification contract is due to be handed out later this year.

So yes , I can generally tell you what Metrolinx means when they say 2 way All day 15 minute service.

 

[kEiThZ]

So yes , I can generally tell you what Metrolinx means when they say 2 way All day 15 minute service.

Moreover, who the hell cares what the trains look like? Does anybody decide to ride a train based on propulsion type?

Railfans maybe.

But most regular people just care about the service. And that's exactly what Metrolinx is working towards improving. And a lot of that will happen before electrification.

 

[crs1026]

^It is curious how a disproportionate part of the discussion revolves around the brand of trains -and then, inevitably about the painting of the trains - as if that matters. For the customer, it’s more about the interior layout, the seats, and whether there is room for luggage and bikes. For ML, the selection process is a spreadsheet exercise.

Would anyone like to start a discussion about what brand of power supply transformers and switchgear Ml should buy for the system? Westinghouse? Siemens? Should the components come in grey, or dark olive?

No? I didn’t think so.

- Paul

 

[kEiThZ]

For the customer, it’s more about the interior layout, the seats, and whether there is room for luggage and bikes.

That's important. But I would argue that schedule and cost/fare come before that. And of those, schedule is by far the most important.

From a customer perspective, electrification is almost irrelevant. A slightly smoother and faster ride is a bonus. Not a pre-requisite. Electrification is more about allowing an operator to keep operating costs low while delivering much more frequent service.