GO Transit: Construction Projects (Metrolinx, various)

[Markster]

Just took a look at a long range shot of Margaret St and it looks like there is enough clearance for 3 tracks now, depending on the clearance height under the overpass for the 3rd track. Long shot and close looks can two different things. High speed only surface in the last 6 month and well after any plan was drawn up for the replacement bridge. It maybe cheaper to lower the tracks than replace the new bridge if there is enough room for 3 tracks in the first place.

Current conditions are subject to change, as they will be building new support structures for the new bridge. Anything you see today would be an artifact of the old bridge.

You can read all about the Margaret replacement here.

Suprisingly to me, I see this passage:

• GO Transit's position is that the currently proposed bridge opening (2-track option) is
sufficient to meet their needs now and for the expansion to two-way all-day GO train service.
A copy of GO Transit's February 18, 2014 correspondence is included in Appendix B. This
position was confirmed in correspondence dated April 21, 2014 and June 12, 2014. It was
re-confirmed in teleconference with City staff on July 23, 2014.
• In recent discussions, GO Transit sees the current opening as having potential for three (3)
tracks. This would be accomplished by relaxing standards for horizontal clearances and
accepting any related impact to operability of the trains under the bridge.

Looks like 3-track operation is not entirely out of the question, even with the 2-track bridge.

 

[crs1026]

Just a random thought.

Every time I use a GO station I am struck by what desolate, anti-people places they are. A humble utilitarian building surrounded by a wasteland of parking lot, with every possible inch dedicated to parking. Why aren't they structured to be mini "town centers"?

Show me a European train station that doesn't have some sort of public square, as a place that people actually use 24/7 - with cafe or two, business offices, retail stores, etc etc. OK, some of the new TGV stops that are outside the urban areas are a bit austere, but at least they are architecturally impressive!

Maybe it starts with building it, and then they will come.....

- Paul

 

[TOareaFan]

Just a random thought.

Every time I use a GO station I am struck by what desolate, anti-people places they are. A humble utilitarian building surrounded by a wasteland of parking lot, with every possible inch dedicated to parking. Why aren't they structured to be mini "town centers"?

Show me a European train station that doesn't have some sort of public square, as a place that people actually use 24/7 - with cafe or two, business offices, retail stores, etc etc. OK, some of the new TGV stops that are outside the urban areas are a bit austere, but at least they are architecturally impressive!

Maybe it starts with building it, and then they will come.....

- Paul

While there are some town centre type stations in the network....most are as you describe....but it is more a function (IMO) of what the primary use was before GO came along combined with the network being built after the car revolution (whereas in Europe the passenger train service typically preceded the car).

 

[nfitz]

Show me a European train station that doesn't have some sort of public square, as a place that people actually use 24/7

How about Malvern Link - https://www.google.ca/maps/@52.1251...m4!1e1!3m2!1sreRKjL1s4mKQV23KSjra9g!2e0?hl=en (which I select based on my inability to find a public toilet - or even a store - anywhere nearby).

It has far more service than most GO stations, and no development after over 150 years of relatively continuous operations. (though it came to a stop the day my great-grandfather put his neck on the rail in front of the oncoming train ... but that's another story).

I'd think there are many similar stations throughout Europe. Heck, I've found some Paris RER stations disappointing!

Maybe it starts with building it, and then they will come.....

That is Metrolinx's plan. See www.metrolinx.com/en/projectsandprograms/mobilityhubs/mobility_hubs.aspx

 

[reaperexpress]

Just a random thought.

Every time I use a GO station I am struck by what desolate, anti-people places they are. A humble utilitarian building surrounded by a wasteland of parking lot, with every possible inch dedicated to parking. Why aren't they structured to be mini "town centers"?

Show me a European train station that doesn't have some sort of public square, as a place that people actually use 24/7 - with cafe or two, business offices, retail stores, etc etc. OK, some of the new TGV stops that are outside the urban areas are a bit austere, but at least they are architecturally impressive!

Maybe it starts with building it, and then they will come.....

Hamilton, Guelph, Brampton and Port Credit stations are all fairly person-friendly and well-integrated into their surroundings. But with the possible exception of Port Credit, they predate both GO Transit and mass motorization.

Yet there are signs of hope:
- The only example I can think of with an actual public square and shops is Mount Pleasant station, where the station and the community around it are both new.
- Hamilton's new James Street North station was explicitly designed with community integration as a primary goal. It will feature what Metrolinx describes as a square, though it got seriously watered down as such from the initial design
- Kitchener-Waterloo's new central station is also being designed as a key urban destination and landmark, with a square included in the plans IIRC. Its designers would like to see it integrated into a large mixed-use development, though they have yet to find an interested developer.

Community-friendly stations are not yet the norm, but that's definitely the direction Metrolinx is moving, supported by their Mobility Hub guidelines. The recent parking garage construction boom is a step in the right direction, creating the potential to repurpose parking lot space for more human-friendly uses.

That said, there is a place in our network for vast, desolate stations. They allow us to retain the well-proven park-and-ride model while we move to also develop the walk-in and transit-oriented models. For example, rather than spending immense amounts of money trying to provide person-friendly parking at a city centre station such as Kitchener, Burlington or Brampton, we can serve it at a park-and-ride station such as Breslau, Aldershot or Bramalea, respectively. This also reduces avoids creating a large car traffic generator in what we're trying to make a pleasant area.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Mount Pleasant is increasingly, well, pleasant as well.


Pickering does have an Office building TOD as well.

 

[muller877]

Just a random thought.

Every time I use a GO station I am struck by what desolate, anti-people places they are. A humble utilitarian building surrounded by a wasteland of parking lot, with every possible inch dedicated to parking. Why aren't they structured to be mini "town centers"?

Show me a European train station that doesn't have some sort of public square, as a place that people actually use 24/7 - with cafe or two, business offices, retail stores, etc etc. OK, some of the new TGV stops that are outside the urban areas are a bit austere, but at least they are architecturally impressive!

Maybe it starts with building it, and then they will come.....

- Paul

Let's look at a SW train line out of London to Southampton (beyond the M25 .... a ring road). This was built a long time ago so you can't argue it was built as part of car culture.

West Byfleet - almost never stops here. An office tower and a dozen parking spots
Woking - a parking lot and a couple of condos.
Brookwood - a parking lot
Farnborough - a parking lot and an office or condo
Fleet - a parking lot
Winchfield - a parking lot
Hook - a parking lot and a Tesco superstore
Basingstoke (a junction point) - parking lot, an outdoor mall that leads to an indoor mall....the private developers have spent the money and is very walkable for shopping.
Andover - a very small parking lot and a small village
Winchester - a parking lot. A 15 min walk to the cathederal
Shawford - a whistle stop and a very small parking lot
Eastleigh - massive parking lots/garages with a couple of stores. Also a large rail yard. 2 blocks to a shopping centre
Southampton Airport - the BEST connection to an airport I've seen! about 150M walk outdoors from the main train line to an airport that reminds me of the Island
Swaythling - nothing
St Denys - a whistle stop with not much there
Southhampton Central - first parking, then box stores then a mall


The parking is mainly where siding use to be (or where industrial was beside the train tracks).

And all the stations almost look identical! ...very old and cool but when built they were just cookie cutter in the day

So on one train line I can find 1 station that is interconnected (you don't first walk through a parking lot before coming to shopping or a public square which looks secondary to parking)...and that's because it was done so because of a private developer of a mall.

 

[TOareaFan]

Mount Pleasant is increasingly, well, pleasant as well.

I am a bit torn on that station. On the north side (by track 1) where it meets the "Mt. Pleasant Village" area it is a very interesting take on how an area can be built to integrate with GO transit and you definitely get a bit of a modern town centre/village feel and you can see that the station becomes walkable....and you actually see people walking to the station.

Track 1, however, is the least used of the tracks by GO.

The south side of the station ...where the station building is really just looks like a traditional suburban GO station. There are some unused lands there and it will be interesting to see if they do something with those that makes an effort to bring some of that north side charm to the other side of the track.

The way it sits now, I bet the vast majority of the people arriving and departing from that station don't see it as any different than most of the suburban GO network....and that is a bit of a shame.

 

[innsertnamehere]

That is probably the model to go with in terms of development around stations, honestly. One side of the tracks should be urban and walkable, and one can deal with bus transfers and park and riders. Park and ride users will always constitute a significant amount of GO users, and we have to accommodate them somehow.

 

[flyinggoats]

At one point, the rail lines mainly served industry, so the tracks go through many industrial zones. We now have a shift in planning so that the railways serve passengers, and this shift will result in population density along the rail lines. Indeed Metrolinx is focusing on this with their mobility hubs, but the change from industrial to residential / mixed-use will not happen overnight.

 

[salsa]

How about Malvern Link - https://www.google.ca/maps/@52.1251...m4!1e1!3m2!1sreRKjL1s4mKQV23KSjra9g!2e0?hl=en (which I select based on my inability to find a public toilet - or even a store - anywhere nearby).

It has far more service than most GO stations, and no development after over 150 years of relatively continuous operations. (though it came to a stop the day my great-grandfather put his neck on the rail in front of the oncoming train ... but that's another story).

That doesn't look bad at all, compared to many GO stations like Meadovale, or Etobicoke North. To me the area looks much more attractive than the usual suburbia that we always see. Look at how tiny the parking lot is. No road is wider than 2 lanes. There are even some apartment buildings within walking distance. It looks nothing this this:

 

[innsertnamehere]

These are GO stations..

 

[junctionist]

They did a great job with the blocks surrounding Mount Pleasant GO Station (seen in the first photo) in Brampton. It's new urbanism done right. There are stores along the street in front of the station with residences on top and a library and public square. However, if you go a few blocks further, it's standard suburbia. On the other side of the station, there's also a huge parking lot. Baby steps are crucial though--it's how we learn to walk.

 

[TOareaFan]

They did a great job with the blocks surrounding Mount Pleasant GO Station (seen in the first photo) in Brampton. It's new urbanism done right. There are stores along the street in front of the station with residences on top and a library and public square. However, if you go a few blocks further, it's standard suburbia. On the other side of the station, there's also a huge parking lot. Baby steps are crucial though--it's how we learn to walk.

That's what I was referring to a few posts ago......the two sides of Mt. Pleasant is like the before and after pics in a diet pill commercial.

 

[gweed123]

Baby steps, IMO, would be something as simple as including small retail in the ground floor of new parking structures. Take Burlington Station for example. They completed the parking structure, which is directly adjacent to the bus loop and the station entrance, a couple years ago. That side that faces the loop would be a perfect spot for a small Tim Horton's location, and an LCBO express.

That Timmies would be packed every morning, and I know that I would find it very convenient if, on my way home, there was a place that I could quickly walk into and pick up a bottle of wine or a few beers for dinner. I'm not talking Wal Mart sized retail here, but Union Station-sized kiosks that offer a small retail convenience.