GO Transit: Construction Projects (Metrolinx, various)

[Woodbridge_Heights]

Even that I'd disagree with. But I was responding more to the first part of the statement, "RER exists not to serve people living by the subway commuting throughout Toronto", which, even taking into account the second part, is a pretty strong and inaccurate statement.

Of the 12 new stations being built (13 if you count Park Lawn), only 4 are outside Toronto. Yes, that story is almost two years old now but the point is the same. GO has historically been suburb-focused but one of the main reasons for its expansion is to vastly increase its relevance to Toronto itself.

Very inaccurate. That would mean that Kennedy GO is a wasted stations since it is right by a subway. When in reality it should be seen as a more efficient way of getting to the downtown core, while freeing up capacity on that portion of the subway for shorter travels.

 

[Streety McCarface]

Very inaccurate. That would mean that Kennedy GO is a wasted stations since it is right by a subway. When in reality it should be seen as a more efficient way of getting to the downtown core, while freeing up capacity on that portion of the subway for shorter travels.

I've gone over this before: Kennedy GO is only useful if you plan on going to Union, or another station along the RER network. Kennedy to Bloor-Yonge is only 25 minutes, while Kennedy to Union Station is 20 minutes (without additional stations), but you have to factor in additional wait time (due to lower frequencies), and larger transfer time.

Sure, I can run between the TTC and GO platforms in about 3 minutes, but generally, it's a 5-minute walk, longer if I have to check platform numbers. It's still the faster option if you're going to the financial district, but not for anything north of Dundas St.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

I've gone over this before: Kennedy GO is only useful if you plan on going to Union, or another station along the RER network. Kennedy to Bloor-Yonge is only 25 minutes, while Kennedy to Union Station is 20 minutes (without additional stations), but you have to factor in additional wait time (due to lower frequencies), and larger transfer time.

Sure, I can run between the TTC and GO platforms in about 3 minutes, but generally, it's a 5-minute walk, longer if I have to check platform numbers. It's still the faster option if you're going to the financial district, but not for anything north of Dundas St.

And therefore functioning exactly as intended. Improved frequencies will make that choice even easier

 

[asher__jo]

I've gone over this before: Kennedy GO is only useful if you plan on going to Union, or another station along the RER network. Kennedy to Bloor-Yonge is only 25 minutes, while Kennedy to Union Station is 20 minutes (without additional stations), but you have to factor in additional wait time (due to lower frequencies), and larger transfer time.

Sure, I can run between the TTC and GO platforms in about 3 minutes, but generally, it's a 5-minute walk, longer if I have to check platform numbers. It's still the faster option if you're going to the financial district, but not for anything north of Dundas St.

On the note of Kennedy, I hope to see intensification of development to make it a transit hub where people live.

 

[Richard White]

I've gone over this before: Kennedy GO is only useful if you plan on going to Union, or another station along the RER network. Kennedy to Bloor-Yonge is only 25 minutes, while Kennedy to Union Station is 20 minutes (without additional stations), but you have to factor in additional wait time (due to lower frequencies), and larger transfer time.

That's why I go from Union to Kennedy every night. If I take the subway it will be almost 45 minutes when you factor in transfers and waiting for trains. Half the time on the GO train.

 

[MisterF]

"Living by the subway"

The vast majority of those stations exist to either serve people from suburban stations, or people who do not already live near a subway station. Oddly enough, that does include liberty village, since the nearest subway station is still a good 20-30 minutes away depending on the route and traffic.

Most of the new stations will be interchanges with other rapid transit lines, like Line 2, the Eglinton LRT, and the Ontario Line. They will serve people coming in from the suburbs, people from the neighbourhoods where they're located, and people riding other rapid transit lines. It doesn't have to be primarily about one thing at the expense of another.

Very inaccurate. That would mean that Kennedy GO is a wasted stations since it is right by a subway. When in reality it should be seen as a more efficient way of getting to the downtown core, while freeing up capacity on that portion of the subway for shorter travels.

What's very inaccurate? How does Kennedy being on a subway line mean it's wasted? Yes, the Stouffville Line is an efficient way of getting downtown, and Kennedy will also be a major transfer hub, much more so than it is today.

I've gone over this before: Kennedy GO is only useful if you plan on going to Union, or another station along the RER network.

So what you're really saying is that Kennedy GO is only useful if you plan on going to Union, Danforth, Gerrard, East Harbour, Liberty Village, Bloor, St. Clair-Old Weston, Mount Dennis, Weston, Etobicoke North.....or onto one of the other transit lines that you can transfer to at one of these stations. RER will open up huge parts of the city to faster rapid transit that currently exists.

Kennedy to Bloor-Yonge is only 25 minutes, while Kennedy to Union Station is 20 minutes (without additional stations), but you have to factor in additional wait time (due to lower frequencies), and larger transfer time.

Sure, I can run between the TTC and GO platforms in about 3 minutes, but generally, it's a 5-minute walk, longer if I have to check platform numbers. It's still the faster option if you're going to the financial district, but not for anything north of Dundas St.

That's a pretty specific scenario you're constructing there. Why would you have to check platform numbers on a line that only goes two directions? The reality is that people will be using Kennedy Station to go to and from the Stouffville line, subway, LRT, and buses. It will be a busy hub with people going in all different directions. The transfer to and from a GO train will be no better or worse than a transfer to and from the subway.

Of course it's not going to be faster if you're going north of Dundas. A line can't be all things to all people. But it will be faster if you're going to the financial district or the waterfront or the west end or transferring to the Ontario line. Wait time is overstated. Remember, 15 minute frequencies will be the minimum and trains could be more frequent. And future RER improvements will happen once people realize what a game changer it is.

 

[torontocolin]

Metrolinx is finally being honest about Caledonia GO station, as this page must have been updated in the past week or so. Unless the Crosstown opening date is delayed to 2023, Caledonia GO won't be opening in time for it. It's truly bizarre why Metrolinx waited for so long to tender. They've had 8 years since construction on the Crosstown started.

Progress

"Great news! Caledonia GO Station is moving ahead!
The new station will be directly integrated with connections to the Eglinton Crosstown LRT and will have heated platform shelters, bicycle parking, pedestrian connections to Bowie Avenue, Carnarvan Street, and complete accessibility enhancements.

Customers will experience a seamless transition between GO Transit services on the Barrie GO Line and the Crosstown, giving them more options for getting around.

Caledonia GO Station is currently in the design phase, the tender process will be initiated in spring 2020, with construction scheduled to begin in spring 2021 and completed by approximately spring 2023."

Why was this not just included in the Crosstown/Crosslinx contract to begin with? They're both being built by Metrolinx to be owned by Metrolinx. Why are they building two stations side by side instead of one integrated station serving two different lines? To me, this is akin to them finding a different contractor to build the bus terminal at Science Centre station two years after the line opens. Is Mount Dennis GO also its own project?

 

[crs1026]

The commitment to a GO station at Caledonia only emerged in 2015, long after the LRT was well under way. I suspect that it took the RER concept before anyone got serious. The Crosstown always spoke to a “potential” GO station, but was not within the scope of the original EA.
It's very interesting reading to start at page #1 of the Crosstown thread and revisit ancient history.

- Paul

 

[TransitBart]

My own view is that in addition to the point that @crs1026 made, the Davenport diamond overpass and other needed infrastructure improvements like double tracking through the city will not be complete until around 2023. The corridor is far from ready for a bunch of new stations which will be underused for the expense until the infrastructure allowing greater frequencies is upgraded.

 

[dowlingm]

Why was this not just included in the Crosstown/Crosslinx contract to begin with? They're both being built by Metrolinx to be owned by Metrolinx. Why are they building two stations side by side instead of one integrated station serving two different lines? To me, this is akin to them finding a different contractor to build the bus terminal at Science Centre station two years after the line opens. Is Mount Dennis GO also its own project?

Assuming East Bayfront and STC Subway stations ever gets built, no doubt the same issues will arise.

 

[Krypto98]

Bramalea Go today January 6th 2020

 

[Hieberrr]

Admittedly I haven't traveled to many stations on the GO network, but for those that I have gone to tend to be so far away from "town". Is there a reason why these stations aren't more central or there isn't a lot of commercial development in the area?

I always envision our GO network to be more like Japan's, but behold it's the opposite.

 

[torontocolin]

The GO lines pretty well all originated as freight lines, not passenger rail. The freight lines were built to serve industrial areas (or industrial areas sprung up around the freight lines), not urban centres, which generally do not want freight trains passing through. Most of the GTA's municipalities also grew up in the post-war boom, and so they were built around cars and highways, not rail.

 

[smallspy]

The GO lines pretty well all originated as freight lines, not passenger rail. The freight lines were built to serve industrial areas (or industrial areas sprung up around the freight lines), not urban centres, which generally do not want freight trains passing through. Most of the GTA's municipalities also grew up in the post-war boom, and so they were built around cars and highways, not rail.

On top of that GO has long prioritized automotive access to its stations, often to the detriment of public transit or active transportation. This has required stations located on large tracts of land allowing them to build massive parking lots.

Dan

 

[robmausser]

The GO lines pretty well all originated as freight lines, not passenger rail. The freight lines were built to serve industrial areas (or industrial areas sprung up around the freight lines), not urban centres, which generally do not want freight trains passing through. Most of the GTA's municipalities also grew up in the post-war boom, and so they were built around cars and highways, not rail.

Wow this is demonstrably false.

While some parts of the lines do go through industrial areas, like a portion of the Georgetown South line, many GO train stations serve downtown and areas like Brampton, Hamilton, Kitchener, Aurora, Langstaff, Bradford, Guelph, Richmond Hill, and not to mention residential areas.

Passenger rail was just as important as freight in the 19th century when the rail network was built, and many towns still have these downtown areas situated around a train station that has now been converted to a GO train station. (or one nearby)