Eglinton East LRT | Metrolinx

[BurlOak]

One fact is traffic is not getting better in the future. Second fact is we can't afford subway everywhere. Third fact is transit isn't just for people to take between home and downtown.

A combination of sparsely spaced electrified railway and LRT network is better than a subway network that tries to accomodate for both local travel and downtown bound trips. I don't see that removing the HOV lane for a LRT lane is even a problem. The lane was designed for buses instead in which will be replaced by the LRT. This should actual speed up transit as buses are removed from live traffic. Grade separated transit doesn't contribute to higher ridership but instead makes it easier to drive around. The city should put an end to trying to accommodate cars knowing there is no future for them.

in an analogy, a smart phone = bus, a tablet = LRT, a laptop (or desktop) = subway.

If I want quick and convenient service, I use the phone, much as a bus is able to get close to peoples origins and destinations.
If you have a lot of work to do, the laptop/desktop provides maximum functionality, much as a subway is able to provide fast and reliable service.
The tablet, is the worst of both words. It's screen is marginally larger than a phone, but still not something I would stare at for long periods of time. Without a keyboard, it lack the functionality to do the things I need to do. The same way, the LRT with stops 1/2 kilometre to 1/2 mile apart are too far to be convenient to reach my origin/destination. The lack of grade-separation lacks the reliable functionality that I need.
The best transit plan for Toronto would have been one with Zero on-street LRT.

 

[smallspy]

in an analogy, a smart phone = bus, a tablet = LRT, a laptop (or desktop) = subway.

If I want quick and convenient service, I use the phone, much as a bus is able to get close to peoples origins and destinations.
If you have a lot of work to do, the laptop/desktop provides maximum functionality, much as a subway is able to provide fast and reliable service.
The tablet, is the worst of both words. It's screen is marginally larger than a phone, but still not something I would stare at for long periods of time. Without a keyboard, it lack the functionality to do the things I need to do. The same way, the LRT with stops 1/2 kilometre to 1/2 mile apart are too far to be convenient to reach my origin/destination. The lack of grade-separation lacks the reliable functionality that I need.
The best transit plan for Toronto would have been one with Zero on-street LRT.

You forgot to factor in the most important part of your analogy - cost.

A laptop or desktop machine is generally the best - but what if you don't have the money to pay for it? Do you forgo getting anything at all?

Dan

 

[Neutrino]

Not a good analogy only because smart phones are extremely overpriced nowadays, costing more than many tablets and even laptops lol

 

[Rainforest]

in an analogy, a smart phone = bus, a tablet = LRT, a laptop (or desktop) = subway.

If I want quick and convenient service, I use the phone, much as a bus is able to get close to peoples origins and destinations.
If you have a lot of work to do, the laptop/desktop provides maximum functionality, much as a subway is able to provide fast and reliable service.
The tablet, is the worst of both words. It's screen is marginally larger than a phone, but still not something I would stare at for long periods of time. Without a keyboard, it lack the functionality to do the things I need to do. The same way, the LRT with stops 1/2 kilometre to 1/2 mile apart are too far to be convenient to reach my origin/destination. The lack of grade-separation lacks the reliable functionality that I need.
The best transit plan for Toronto would have been one with Zero on-street LRT.

This analogy doesn't really work. While buses will remain in service on the majority of routes, the busiest routes have already reached demand that cannot be efficiently served by buses. Light rail is the way to handle demand that has become too big for buses, if a subway isn't deemed affordable in the given corridor.

A network of trunk subway lines is needed, with the busiest feeder routes served by light rail.

 

[Amare]

Now I wouldn't go that far but I do definitely think and agree the City needs to stop putting Cars on a pedestal when it comes to urban planning. We need to be designing our communities for people not cars. It honestly feels like "Transit Users" are considered second class to car owners and that needs to change sooner, rather then later. We need to take a European/Asian approach to urban planning, not an American one. There is a time and place for cars to be included in planning however they should never be the 1st priority unless we're planning something specifically designed for cars (i.e. Highways).

I couldnt agree more but the problem is that Toronto, and Canada more importantly has an inferiority complex and we're always looking to what the U.S thinks about us, so much so that we follow lock in step with 80% of what they do.

 

[OneCity]

As someone who lives in the area, the community is more supportive of this then the Scarborough Subway. The EELRT is community building for the most neglected part of the city, while I do agree, section of the EELRT has to be grade separated (lawrence and morningside). Residents who need to get to downtown for work are better off taking the GO, getting around scarborough better off with network of LRT and BRT. Scarborough is way to spread out for a Subway to be effective for most riders and has been co opted as a slogan by politicians to appeals to residents who are misinformed and think LRT means there cars will be blocked by street car. Scarborough just doesn't need better transit but a better approach to city building, I think the golden mile tranformation will be a catalyst and hopefully change people's minds before we screw over scarborough for another generation.

Subway (or what could have been connected LRT) is only one part of the necessary network of many modes needed for the future. The 'LRT only' crowd are the tone deaf ones and sadly either misinformed or just knowing choose to carry on with a divisive, ignorant agenda. First this line should have never been pitted against a properly connected centre. Whether the RT was replaced with LRT or heavy rail It wasn't the technology that was the main issue. It was the piss-poor design of the past and then taken another level with Transit City which irresponsibly hacked a new transfer on Sheppard blanket approach. Even back when this line itself was the extremely irresponsibly designed by removing car lanes with no grade separation whatsoever as the SMLRT the 'LRT only' crowd was blaming others as misinformed. Enough of this crap.

We now have a far better connected plan to move forward. Since we can get the subway designs underway with no relevant outside opposition hammering out the old poorly designed LRT rhetoric which caused unnecessary political chaos the City we can now focus on sprucing up the local lines surrounding the main arteries hereafter. It will be much easier to focus solely on funding in the future now that the desire to selfishly cut corners on other areas is removed. This toxic mentality became acceptable to some in this City and was actually the biggest issue preventing progress. Thankfully the Province has taken over and the Golden Mile revitalization isn't going to change anyones views on less transfers and a connected Centre these were a couple of the key design issues which were previously ignored and worse fought against in the greater plan.

And yes of course some people in our area only want this line over subway in other areas. Sadly this Scarborough minority was being propped up by a bunch of Downtown politicians creating a sense that they should have a bigger voice then they really should have. Otherwise we'd be much further along with a plan for all areas of the City. The support to do better from all stripes in all of Scarborough, at all levels and City leadership is overwhelming. This nonsense of outside politicians propping up the 1% Scarborough politician creating a false sense of something being more relevant than it is won't happen again. This extremely divisive planning and pitting of projects in other areas was clearly not healthy whatsoever for City building and should never be acceptable for any future decisions.

 

[Rainforest]

I couldnt agree more but the problem is that Toronto, and Canada more importantly has an inferiority complex and we're always looking to what the U.S thinks about us, so much so that we follow lock in step with 80% of what they do.

When it comes to transit building, Canadians make no effort at all to emulate the U.S.

In fact, several cities in the U.S. made very substantial transit enhancements over the last 15 years. TTC might still be ahead of those cities, but the gap is closing.

 

[nfitz]

The 'LRT only' crowd are the tone deaf ones and sadly misinformed.

The 'LRT-only' crowd don't exist. You've made up that straw-man.

This has been pointed out to you before - but you keep repeating blatant lies. Stop it.

 

[Amare]

When it comes to transit building, Canadians make no effort at all to emulate the U.S.

In fact, several cities in the U.S. made very substantial transit enhancements over the last 15 years. TTC might still be ahead of those cities, but the gap is closing.

This is also true; i'd go as far as saying that Canada makes very little to no effort at all in building transit infrastructure in comparison to virtually every other developed nation.

 

[OneCity]

The 'LRT-only' crowd don't exist. You've made up that straw-man.

This has been pointed out to you before - but you keep repeating blatant lies. Stop it.

Actually nothing said was a lie in my post. But I know you love to be condescending as an attempt to discredit matters whenever Transit City is discussed for it's many design flaws. So not shocked by this repsonse.

'LRT only' or 'blanket LRT' is a reference to that bunch promoting one technology In new infrastructure for Scarborough only.

I likely didnt need to explain as you probably knew what I meant already. But to prevent confusing you further ill help by using 'poorly designed LRT only' or 'Transit City defenders' going forward.

 

[Adjei]

I couldnt agree more but the problem is that Toronto, and Canada more importantly has an inferiority complex and we're always looking to what the U.S thinks about us, so much so that we follow lock in step with 80% of what they do.

Yes that is one thing that frustrates me about Canada. Every metric is measured against the US and as long as we are doing better than them, everything is ok. This holds us back.

 

[nfitz]

Actually nothing said was a lie in my post. But I know you love to be condescending as an attempt to discredit matters whenever Transit City is discussed for it's many design flaws. So not shocked by this repsonse.

Transit City has nothing to do with this, or my reaction. Besides, you weren't even here when Transit City was ongoing - it ended many years before your arrival here! You seem quite ignorant of the plan, that promoted multiple technologies, bus, LRT, and grade-separated rapid transit - even in Scarborough. You clearly don't understand the project - which would have been completed by now.

 

[micheal_can]

One of the biggest problem is people don't want to see their taxes go up, yet want more services.

What if for each new Streetcar, LRT or subway line the city bumped up the property taxes? I bet most would be up in arms.

 

[OneCity]

Transit City has nothing to do with this, or my reaction. Besides, you weren't even here when Transit City was ongoing - it ended many years before your arrival here! You seem quite ignorant of the plan, that promoted multiple technologies, bus, LRT, and grade-separated rapid transit - even in Scarborough. You clearly don't understand the project - which would have been completed by now.

Transit City has a direct connection to this current line and my initial post prior to your response.

Also, I understand this project better then you know, I'm also an end user (which I don't believe you are). Since were critiquing ill add one thing I've observed in your responses over the years is your struggle understanding the many design shortcomings that left Transit City it on fragile grounds to be (thankfully) overturned, why the SMLRT needed to be improved as the EELRT, and why we have the politics we do today which have moved far away from this type of divisive planning and ignorance.

Congrats on your UT forum seniority! FWIW?

 

[nfitz]

Transit City has a direct connection to this current line and my initial post prior to your response.

Then why the blatant lies about "LRT-only". Besides - who is proposing anything more than LRT for this line? Name one politician? How is it even relevant to this project?