Chinatown

[Corisco]

It's a sad fact that many families that make it to the middle/upper middle class prefer that their children attend school with similar children. So we have Montessori schools springing up everywhere downtown and middle class parents fighting to get their kids in the few schools they've managed to monopolize (Jackman in the east, Old Orchard in the west).

Back to the topic at hand, Chinatown. There are very few Cantonese left except for the grandparents which will all be gone in another 15 years. If their grandchildren or children married Chinese, they moved to Markham. If they married someone from another culture, they're anywhere.

The Mandarin speaking Chinese will be here for an even shorter period. They are renting in the back streets of Chinatown and saving every penny to move elsewhere.

 

[Urban Shocker]

Several of my first year OCA friends lived in cheap rooming houses north of Dundas, west of McCaul, in the early '70s. But that area has gradually gentrified and trendified ( Baldwin Street! ) over the decades, and I think has also become less Chinese.

Many of the elderly Chinese property owners are from families that moved west when New City Hall was built in the '60s. Some have unreasonable expectations concerning how much they can sell their crumbling homes for, apparently. Charlie Pachter, who lives on Grange, told me he negotiated one such man down significantly in order to buy adjacent land to build his place.

 

[Mustapha]

Several of my first year OCA friends lived in cheap rooming houses north of Dundas, west of McCaul, in the early '70s. But that area has gradually gentrified and trendified ( Baldwin Street! ) over the decades, and I think has also become less Chinese.

Many of the elderly Chinese property owners are from families that moved west when New City Hall was built in the '60s. Some have unreasonable expectations concerning how much they can sell their crumbling homes for, apparently. Charlie Pachter, who lives on Grange, told me he negotiated one such man down significantly in order to buy adjacent land to build his place.

A jawdroppingly beautiful place he has there too.

I'm guessing even a vacant lot in the core is worth half a million, not a 'mewyon dolla'. Some of the old homes here still have these weird toilets that sit off in a corner by themselves in the basement - a holdover from Victorian days when a basement flusher was a BIG improvement over the outhouse.
This reminds me of the story my grandfather told me of the Eatons assembling land for their College street store - same situation.

 

[ducati0000]

I still see run down houses in Chinatown selling for over $450,000,and this is a smaller lot with one car parking.On the other hand there seems to be a few owners renovating the whole house with a nice stucco finish.I truly hope they are not spending that much money to rent it out to careless students.Its really sad to see chinatown is changing from a true family residence towards a rental mecca.Chinatown needs families to move in and not speculators and slum lords who is out for the money only.I lost count of how many times police was called because of rowdy parties at night,the renters does not create a neighborhood,families does.

 

[T-Squared]

I'm surprised this Chinatown has so much life left in it.

....

I suppose downtown urban Chinatowns will always be like this. Boston, New York, Los Angeles, Chicago; been to them all and a few more and they all exist despite repelling.

London UK strangely is kinda ok.

Alas, I still go and shop and eat; Pacific Mall is soulless.

I am surprised as well, and I think it's holding up pretty well compared to the Chinatown in Chicago, even New York City. Its the first thing I think of when I need to eat something when I am in the downtown area late at night.

Regarding real estate, I know I am refering to the condos in the back of Spadina, but a friend of a friend mentioned how its really difficult to sell their property now.

 

[Mustapha]

I am surprised as well, and I think it's holding up pretty well compared to the Chinatown in Chicago, even New York City. Its the first thing I think of when I need to eat something when I am in the downtown area late at night.

Regarding real estate, I know I am refering to the condos in the back of Spadina, but a friend of a friend mentioned how its really difficult to sell their property now.

Spadina Chinatown restaurants do get quite busy after 2am; it's quite the scene. As to selling difficulties, I suppose the downtown condo selection is huge now; so many choices.

Yesterdays lunch:

 

[CGM]

Now that`s good eating... Unfortunately it has lost a bit of what it used to be.. Kensington Market is not what it used to be a few years ago, and there are few more businesses that have closed down along Spadina recently... But it still has more character than any other GTA Chinatown

 

[Urban Shocker]

After seeing that picture I could kill for some har gow right now.

 

[T-Squared]

In terms of character, I prefer the the Chinatown at Gerrard, I think it has more of a mom and pop business feel to it, or at the very least what I gather from it. The street is narrower and the signage of stores more in-your-face. I still remember when my mom brought me to a small aquarium store on Gerrard where we bought an upside down catfish for our tropical aquarium.....ah, childhood memories. Sadly, the aquarium is no longer there.

.....anyway, I understand why many would bash places like Pacific Mall when compared to Spadina/Dundas and Gerrard, but they both provide a distinct character (both good and bad)...in places like Pacific Mall, it is (ok...maybe I am stretching this) an unapologetic heavily commmercialized indoor street market resembling the excess of Hong Kong capitalism (which is good to have examples of in T.O). In the Spadina Chinatown, its success lies in creating a working class asian street market serving as a community for all.

 

[Mustapha]

In terms of character, I prefer the the Chinatown at Gerrard, I think it has more of a mom and pop business feel to it, or at the very least what I gather from it. The street is narrower and the signage of stores more in-your-face. I still remember when my mom brought me to a small aquarium store on Gerrard where we bought an upside down catfish for our tropical aquarium.....ah, childhood memories. Sadly, the aquarium is no longer there.

.....anyway, I understand why many would bash places like Pacific Mall when compared to Spadina/Dundas and Gerrard, but they both provide a distinct character (both good and bad)...in places like Pacific Mall, it is (ok...maybe I am stretching this) an unapologetic heavily commmercialized indoor street market resembling the excess of Hong Kong capitalism (which is good to have examples of in T.O). In the Spadina Chinatown, its success lies in creating a working class asian street market serving as a community for all.

I agree on all your points. I posted earlier that Pacific Mall has 'no soul' - it does actually; and is just a different experience. The Gerrard Chinatown has also stood the test of time; nether expanding or dying; I suppose the nearby cheap housing stock supports it.

One of my fantasies is to see a Chinese BBQ house complete with dangling pig in my north Toronto nabe but the wasps up here would recoil.

 

[Urban Shocker]

I live near the Gerrard and Broadview Chinatown and it has been declining for years, unfortunately. As with the downtown Chinatown starting some 20 years ago, Vietnamese have taken over quite a few of the stores. The big restaurant on the south side used to be packed on weekends for dim sum, with a queue outside to get in, but that's a distant memory.

 

[urbandreamer]

The other day on Spadina (Chinatown) I picked up 5 100% cotton colourful T-shirts for $10. I'm happy. Anywhere else in Toronto you can get such deals?

 

[T-Squared]

I agree on all your points. I posted earlier that Pacific Mall has 'no soul' - it does actually; and is just a different experience. The Gerrard Chinatown has also stood the test of time; nether expanding or dying; I suppose the nearby cheap housing stock supports it.

One of my fantasies is to see a Chinese BBQ house complete with dangling pig in my north Toronto nabe but the wasps up here would recoil.

Thanks Mustapha, I live relatively close to Pacific Mall, and despite my initial hate towards the place, I do appreciate how it has evolved over the years.

Ha. Funny how when I see dangling pig, I think of crispy pork belly heaven, not...the massacre of Wilbur the pig!

 

[King of Kensington]

Prof. Jon Caulfield on "Southeast Spadina"

http://www.chbooks.com/archives/online_books/eastwest/113.html

 

[androiduk]

It's a sad fact that many families that make it to the middle/upper middle class prefer that their children attend school with similar children. So we have Montessori schools springing up everywhere downtown and middle class parents fighting to get their kids in the few schools they've managed to monopolize (Jackman in the east, Old Orchard in the west).

Back to the topic at hand, Chinatown. There are very few Cantonese left except for the grandparents which will all be gone in another 15 years. If their grandchildren or children married Chinese, they moved to Markham. If they married someone from another culture, they're anywhere.

The Mandarin speaking Chinese will be here for an even shorter period. They are renting in the back streets of Chinatown and saving every penny to move elsewhere.

Those parents are doing their children a great disservice. My children are caucasian and I made sure the school they went to had a healthy mix of cultures that reflects the city they're growing up in. In fact, I think they are the only caucasian kids in the whole class.