Chinatown

[prosperegal]

When I was in high school (in the 90s), my parents wouldn't let me walk around Chinatown myself like I was allowed to do in, say, Markham. They said that Chinatown was dangerous and full of gangs.

As for schools: I think the parents aren't against diversity, but are worried that the standards are lower at schools where kids are new to the country. I mean, look at all the Chinese and South Asian families who're putting their kids in old line (read: historically VERY WASPY...but not WASPY anymore (at least not since the 80s)) independent schools.

 

[wyliepoon]

Signs of the times in Chinatown... three shops on the south side of Dundas Street west between Huron and Berkeley are having closing sales, and one more has already shut down.

 

[Towered]

Can't say I'll miss any of these tacky junk peddlers. Hopefully it will open the door to some mild gentrification (mild as in no corporate chains but rather interesting independent businesses).

 

[College Park]

Signs of the times in Chinatown... three shops on the south side of Dundas Street west between Huron and Berkeley are having closing sales, and one more has already shut down.

The picture of Cawaii makes me wonder - a gift store on Granby and Yonge has been advertising "going out of business" for five years using a mix of good quality printed signs and bristol board posters. I've heard a couple people exclaiming their good fortune at saving 90% - lol. Closing down signs can be good for stimulating a little extra business.

 

[T-Squared]

Spacing's blog is running a series on Cities for People, projects by OCAD students on different neighbourhoods in Toronto. First off, Chinatown at Gerrard East:

http://spacing.ca/wire/2009/07/08/cities-for-people-the-melancholy-of-east-chinatown/

What I found equally interesting were the comments posted, one commenter mentioned how in the current context, 'East Chinatown' is a misnomer, as it does not necessarily help connect the area to its surroundings.

 

[Cast_Member]

I don't think Chinatown totally gone downhill especially on Spadina. The only part of Chinatown that gone downhill is on eastern part Dunads St. I think it has to do with the Spadina LRT.

 

[confusion]

I don't think Chinatown totally gone downhill especially on Spadina. The only part of Chinatown that gone downhill is on eastern part Dunads St. I think it has to do with the Spadina LRT.

The eastern part between the AGO and Spadina is more lively than it ever has been. The western part right after Spadina is a ghost shell though, likely because of the 'project' housing there.

*edit* Just realized, are you talking about Chinatown east now? Maybe I just don't understand.

 

[Torontovibe]

I've heard the merchants in Chinatown complain that Chinatown is losing it's customers but even on a Wednesday afternoon with the windchill at -12, it still was pretty busy. I made a time-laps video of the Spadina/Dundas intersection. I couldn't believe how many streetcars go through that intersection in such a short amount span of time.

[video=youtube;u-9jkWwlhMQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-9jkWwlhMQ[/video]

 

[King of Kensington]

City councillor for Trinity-Spadina, Adam Vaughan commends the BIA’s initiatives to target illegal laneway dumping and rodent infestation, issues which have contributed to Chinatown’s sometimes less-than-savoury reputation.

“No other BIA has taken responsibility and seized obligations with more consistency, vigour and discipline.”

However, he concedes that these changes, while welcomed by many, risk changing the profile of the neighbourhood. “You don’t want [Chinatown]to grow disproportionately, so that it leaves people behind. You want to make sure low-income families still have a place to shop and find employment. At the same time, you want to make sure the people running those businesses succeed.”

Dr. Lucia Lo is a professor of geography at York University, whose research includes Chinese immigration in Toronto.

Ms. Lo says that of all individuals living in Chinatown, about 40 to 50 per cent are likely low-income, estimating that individual annual income in the area falls between $30,000 and $35,000.

“Some people have to live in Chinatown in boarding houses or very crowded conditions. If serious gentrification goes on, then obviously these people will be displaced.”

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/t...-clean-up-shop/article2234230/?service=mobile

 

[Cast2]

I don't see anything has changed in regards of illegal dumping. If businesses clean up their properties by picking up litter and wash off garbage juices at their lane ways, then it should not be a problem.

 

[balenciaga]

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/t...-clean-up-shop/article2234230/?service=mobile

Chinatown should undoubtedly transform. Not necessarily "gentrifying", but change is necessary.

The restaurants should cater to people of different income levels. Currently it is hard to find a nice, clean restaurants to dine in in order to have a pleasant time. The Chinese restaurants in Markham don't look like those. The Chinese restaurants in Beijing or Shanghai don't look like those either. If put in a present Chinese city, nobody will even walk into those restaurants.

The stores should provide diversified products, not mainly 99cent stores and $5 for 3 T-shirts. And they shouldn't be allowed to put all the tacky T-shirts on the sidewalk. Where are people supposed to walk on a busy Sunday?

Too many buildings are in dire condition and require better care.

There is no reason Chinatown can't be neat, clean and orderly while at the same time maintain its own distinct personality. I know many Torontonians would like say "no gentrification. Keep things as they are. Chinatown is fine with all its interesting mess". I think it is pure selflishness. Yes it is interesting but I guess you will never consider living in a hood like that? The entire city and the entire China have progressed. Why should Chinatown be stuck in the 1970s so that you can always see what it looked like 20 years ago? We all say neighbourhoods should be mixed-income, but why should Chinatown always gear toward lower income? The Chinese in Toronto probably have a higher family income than the average, and Spadina/Dundas definitely doesn't reflect that.

Many downtown Chinese residents hardly shop at Chinatown because there is nothing there for them. The restaurants are dirty and subpar and the stores are tacky. Let's not say "They can go to Markham" as Markham for one is a different city, for two many downtowner don't have a car, and for three Markham is mostly suburban malls where you can't actually walk on smaller streets in the sun enjoying an urban life.

 

[Ahsun]

Dragon Condos

I'm surprised that this hasn't been mentioned in this thread.

from dragoncondos.com

from http://www.buzzbuzzhome.com/the-dragon-condos

If this goes through, it would be great for the neighbourhood. There really hasn't been any new development here since Chinatown Centre was constructed something like 15-20 years ago.

This building would replace an old theatre that's been closed for roughly 10 years.

Units look very small, none seem to have a dining room.

There is also the planned redevelopment of the Atkinson Co-op area.

 

[AlbertC]

http://www.thestar.com/entertainmen...gendary_rock_club_el_mocambo_up_for_sale.html

Legendary rock club El Mocambo up for sale

The Spadina Ave. landmark is on the market for $3.95 million and could be redeveloped for residential or retail use.

“I’d love to keep it as a music venue, but I think there’s other options for it as well,” said real estate agent Neil Warshafsky, a broker with Royal LePage.
Warshafsky said the building is zoned for a higher density, so the open-air rooftop deck on the third floor could be covered and turned into a full floor. A fourth storey could potentially be added, to serve as residential units for students given the property’s proximity to the University of Toronto.
The ground floor could be overhauled for retail or restaurant space, or even a fitness club, Warshafsky said.

 

[James]

http://www.thestar.com/entertainmen...gendary_rock_club_el_mocambo_up_for_sale.html

Legendary rock club El Mocambo up for sale

The Spadina Ave. landmark is on the market for $3.95 million and could be redeveloped for residential or retail use.

I'll certainly be interested in seeing how this develops.

And, on another note, I fully agree with balenciaga's post about the state of the Spadina Chinatown. As much as many individuals want to resist change and want to keep Chinatown the way it is for its "character", you simply can't keep it the way it is and expect it to flourish. New development like at the El Mocambo will be a huge catalyst for new growth in the neighborhood.

Chinatown should undoubtedly transform. Not necessarily "gentrifying", but change is necessary.

The restaurants should cater to people of different income levels. Currently it is hard to find a nice, clean restaurants to dine in in order to have a pleasant time. The Chinese restaurants in Markham don't look like those. The Chinese restaurants in Beijing or Shanghai don't look like those either. If put in a present Chinese city, nobody will even walk into those restaurants.

The stores should provide diversified products, not mainly 99cent stores and $5 for 3 T-shirts. And they shouldn't be allowed to put all the tacky T-shirts on the sidewalk. Where are people supposed to walk on a busy Sunday?

Too many buildings are in dire condition and require better care.

There is no reason Chinatown can't be neat, clean and orderly while at the same time maintain its own distinct personality. I know many Torontonians would like say "no gentrification. Keep things as they are. Chinatown is fine with all its interesting mess". I think it is pure selflishness. Yes it is interesting but I guess you will never consider living in a hood like that? The entire city and the entire China have progressed. Why should Chinatown be stuck in the 1970s so that you can always see what it looked like 20 years ago? We all say neighbourhoods should be mixed-income, but why should Chinatown always gear toward lower income? The Chinese in Toronto probably have a higher family income than the average, and Spadina/Dundas definitely doesn't reflect that.

Many downtown Chinese residents hardly shop at Chinatown because there is nothing there for them. The restaurants are dirty and subpar and the stores are tacky. Let's not say "They can go to Markham" as Markham for one is a different city, for two many downtowner don't have a car, and for three Markham is mostly suburban malls where you can't actually walk on smaller streets in the sun enjoying an urban life.

 

[chloe22]

Chinatown should undoubtedly transform. Not necessarily "gentrifying", but change is necessary.

The restaurants should cater to people of different income levels. Currently it is hard to find a nice, clean restaurants to dine in in order to have a pleasant time. The Chinese restaurants in Markham don't look like those. The Chinese restaurants in Beijing or Shanghai don't look like those either. If put in a present Chinese city, nobody will even walk into those restaurants.

The stores should provide diversified products, not mainly 99cent stores and $5 for 3 T-shirts. And they shouldn't be allowed to put all the tacky T-shirts on the sidewalk. Where are people supposed to walk on a busy Sunday?

Too many buildings are in dire condition and require better care.

There is no reason Chinatown can't be neat, clean and orderly while at the same time maintain its own distinct personality. I know many Torontonians would like say "no gentrification. Keep things as they are. Chinatown is fine with all its interesting mess". I think it is pure selflishness. Yes it is interesting but I guess you will never consider living in a hood like that? The entire city and the entire China have progressed. Why should Chinatown be stuck in the 1970s so that you can always see what it looked like 20 years ago? We all say neighbourhoods should be mixed-income, but why should Chinatown always gear toward lower income? The Chinese in Toronto probably have a higher family income than the average, and Spadina/Dundas definitely doesn't reflect that.

Many downtown Chinese residents hardly shop at Chinatown because there is nothing there for them. The restaurants are dirty and subpar and the stores are tacky. Let's not say "They can go to Markham" as Markham for one is a different city, for two many downtowner don't have a car, and for three Markham is mostly suburban malls where you can't actually walk on smaller streets in the sun enjoying an urban life.

I agree with you Bal. But how do you envision this happening? It is the asian that fuel the change and when chinatown lifestyle does nto meet the consumers needs they move to markham - they don't change the area.