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CATHEDRAL SQUARE - fictional piazza concept

On the very same day that the Cathedral Square story ran in the POST ... in which Mr. Rae was kind enough to call me "abusive... demanding to see him" (after being blown off promised meeting etc. for 4 months)... look what ran in the Star.

Karma eh Kyle??

Why is an answer too much to ask?
TORY ZIMMERMAN/TORONTO STAR FILE PHOTO


Photo caption:
Kyle Rae, here joking around before Pride Week two years ago, is as rude to constituents as other politicians. Being openly gay doesn't mean he's open.


May 24, 2008 04:30 AM
Brent Ledger


Odd to think that people were excited when Kyle Rae became Toronto's first openly gay city councillor in 1991, almost as if we thought his gayness would make a difference. Oh, how our innocence has fled.

I've interviewed Rae a couple of times over the years but I had never approached him as a constituent until this winter, when I called his office to complain about some noise in his ward. Actually, I called four times over the space of three months. Three times, a message said someone would get back to me shortly. No one ever did.

Once, I even reached a real person and the real person assured me that he would look into the complaint and someone would get back to me. That was seven weeks ago. No one ever has.

The cynics among you may think this par for the course. We are, after all, talking about politicians, and who ever said they were there to serve the people who elected them?

But I've contacted lots of politicians over the years, from most political parties and all levels of government, and I have almost always received a reply and even sometimes – get this – some help.

In fact, it wasn't until a few years ago, when I found myself in the unlovely hands of Carolyn Bennett, the Liberal MP for St. Paul's, that I first encountered Rae-level indifference – an indifference bordering on contempt. I wrote (emailed) or called her three times and she never replied, until a friend who happens to be a well-connected Liberal dropped into her office and told her I was a journalist. Then she called back.

Political replies are usually something less than intimate expressions of personal concern and nobody understands that better than I.

Many years ago, I worked as a temp in the solicitor general's office churning out replies to irate voters about some now long-forgotten scandal and I vividly recall that the most difficult part of the task was not crafting the response (which was done elsewhere) but merging hundreds of names and addresses with the same bland reply.

Still, any reply is better than none, and at least it makes you feel heard.

Smart politicians know that and they work hard at maintaining contact with their constituents. David Miller, for instance, is no great shakes as a mayor. After almost five years in office, he's done – well, what has he done? The Gardiner is still standing, the waterfront has been clobbered by condos and the TTC is a ramshackle money pit. But to give the man credit, he's smart enough to hire good constituency people who keep him in touch with the grassroots.

Send his office an email and you usually get a response within the day.

It probably won't address your concerns directly, more likely wriggling off topic in the approved say-nothing political style. But you'll get the sense, however illusory, that you're part of a functioning democracy.

Voter turnout in this country is notoriously low, especially at the municipal level, and the pundits scrunch up their brows and wonder why. But, really, what's the surprise? Between obvious examples of democracy flouted (see the Bush-Gore election in the U.S. or civic amalgamation here) and active displays of political indifference, the wonder is that anyone shows up.

Democracy depends on a dialogue between voters and elected officials and, when either side shuts down, there's nothing much to encourage participation or debate.

Ignore people long enough and they'll eventually go away.

If politicians really want to engage the voters, they might try dialling back the contempt.

Brent Ledger appears every second Saturday. You can reach him at
living@thestar.ca.

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http://www.thestar.com/article/427928
 
“Architectural purists will hate this,” he says. “They’ll call it the worst kind of faux historicism. But on the scale I’m proposing, it’s a destination, and that’s why it will succeed.”

Though as mentioned before, I think it may be potentially more a matter of *heritage* purists hating certain elements as representing the worst kind of facadism. Something where architectural purists might ultimately find common cause, from their own opposite end.

Aside from the facade-reuse/reassembly element, when it comes to so-called architectural purism, details can be worked out...
 
Look at it this way, 3D, there's no such thing as bad publicity! Your idea's out there now and it looks like the media is taking your side. Whoever buys this site for development will know that, and if you're lucky they might like the idea.
 
Aside from the facade-reuse/reassembly element, when it comes to so-called architectural purism, details can be worked out...

Adam:
The facade graveyard was 42's idea, not mine. That idea was only discussed in this thread.

My scribble intended to hint at the feel of the lower levels of the massing of the square... namely well-mannered, historically inspired construction "that fits in" to the existing neighbourhood in the spirit of a Morgan on Spadina, a Market Square on Front, or more recently, a Mozo at Sherbourne/King.

I guess as usual, I don't understand your point if you've made one, even after consulting my ENGLISH TO ADMA pocket translator (twice).


head-scratching emoticon could go here ____.
 
I'm going to show this article to my friend at work tommorrow 3D. Great that your vision has made this big of an impression!!

Let's make it a reality.
 
3D, I had no idea it was you in the paper! I rarely check this part of the forum (what a mistake on my part, lesson learned) so I had no idea this piazza project has been floating here for months now (do I ever feel dumb). In any case, when I was reading the Post yesterday I thought, "gee, what an amazing idea from someone who's doing it as a hobby and why are people with power and authority in this city and country so empty of good ideas?". As Caltrane has said, let's make your vision a reality. And there's no way in hell I'll be voting for Kyle Rae in the next election. Obviously it's time for him to get the boot and have somebody else instead who's hungry and respectful of constituents (I know, I'm dreaming).
 
Adam:
The facade graveyard was 42's idea, not mine. That idea was only discussed in this thread.

My scribble intended to hint at the feel of the lower levels of the massing of the square... namely well-mannered, historically inspired construction "that fits in" to the existing neighbourhood in the spirit of a Morgan on Spadina, a Market Square on Front, or more recently, a Mozo at Sherbourne/King.

I guess as usual, I don't understand your point if you've made one, even after consulting my ENGLISH TO ADMA pocket translator (twice).


head-scratching emoticon could go here ____.

The way I see it is that the plan of the square is what almost everyone loves. The height and positioning of the buildings is agreeable, but in time the design of the facades can be changed. Most important currently is that the fundamental plan gets the green light.

But perhaps the square with its historical nods is somehow appropriate. After all, the cathedral was inspired by English Gothic churches of centuries past.
 
I'm not married at all to the specific choices I've made for the facades/internal perimeter of the square. I wouldn't even position it as a "design". It's a sketch.

As I've mentioned many times, I was just trying to communicate the "feel" of the square and answer the question "would I want to be there?". The jumble of colours and textures I used around the square are intended to hint at my proposed recipe for success... fit into the neighbourhood, use welcoming materials (brick etc.), break up the scale into smaller elements, and look for as many indoor/outdoor weather solutions as possible to ensure animation for most of the year.

There are many other possible elements that professionals might bring to the table. For example, an indoor/outdoor colonnade might be deemed an important consideration for colder months to maintain pedestrian traffic.

The final ingredient for success, and the most compelling in terms of long-term health, is the quality of retail tenants. If a few terrific chefs/restauranteurs can be tempted, some one-of-a-kind retailers and the right mix of "basic needs" stores (small grocery etc.), then the retail component will make a significant contribution to on-going, healthy "animation" of the square.

Might be an interesting discussion... who exactly would you like to set up shop here?



Ultimately, as you've mentioned, it is all about the square and the opportunity to add something really exciting and inviting to the public realm... just a short hop east of Yonge. A once in a lifetime opportunity, if you will.
 
I have to say that I love the idea of a 'facade graveyard', and there may be a fundamentel difference between this and 'facadism' in general as practiced ad hoc on various buildings throughout the city. An honest and deliberate installation of historical facades (imagine facades as 'pictures' hanging on a background canvas of more minimal modernist structures), ones that would have been destined for the wrecking ball anyway, could be approached and ultimately interpreted in a more artful way, avoiding the line between it and mere disney-esque faux trickery.

Excellent project overall though and you have my support. When politicians stop listening something has to be done.
 
Thanks Cal... but why? Don't get what you are up to.

BTW... Tina. Is she not the hottest Toronto hybrid in the history of so-called "multiculturalism"??

Answer: yes she is.

Anyone who says Toronto isn't a gorgeous city, is clearly looking down at the sidewalks, not up at who's walking on them.
 
So, does Kyle Rae decide that anyone he has ignored is a stalker if they persist in trying to get him to keep a promised meeting? Bizarre behaviour really in this day and age when the "little people" you have smeared publicly have access to the media themselves, and yes, Ledger's article in the Star was utterly karmic.

Kyle, in my experience however, is not a bad guy, (it has been a while since I have dealt with him though), but it is possible that several years in a city council chair have made him a little too comfortable. Or maybe he's snapping from the stress of being overworked - City Councillors do have a ton on their plate. For certain local politicians do have to deal with actual nut cases, and while we know 3D is not one, maybe the extraordinary amount of work that 3D has put into this has set him apart in Rae's mind from the average constituent, and made Rae think 3D is a bit off. Whenever people put more than an average amount of thought into something, there is always the risk that they will be branded a bit crazy by others... Conversely, the average Joe who puts little thought into things rarely gets anything done though, does he?

42
 
Your post almost makes sense. BTW, I just sent you a PM slagging you for posting all over the place but not here. Then you posted. Ah well...

What's your point? I've reported that Kyle's "real brain" took another job. My final rant via email to him essentially said "you've taken a friend and turned him into an enemy". Abusive? Nope. Factoids.

FYI, I have never spoken to Kyle Rae in the past 10 years, not even a 30 second "hi", despite thinking his office was the perfect launch-pad for good ideas for the city. Needy? Perhaps. Stalker? I've never even made a noise complaint and he's my councillor.

It's a shame that Cath Sq will become a debate about K. Rae because he's had way too much attention already, without lifting an arm to help.

Cath Square might deserve it's own discussion.
 

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