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Blue Jays

You didn't answer his question. To you, who is the best pitcher in the game?

Since 2002 or 2003 the only other pitcher I put on par with Halladay is Sabathia. Mostly there have been one hit wonders like Cliff Lee last year, but no one other than those two have had the same consistency and dominance. I think Lincecum is on his way to that status if he continues to pitch like he does, but he's still pretty young, so it will take a few years. I'm not even convinced about Greinke. He's had a great year on a poor team, but one year doesn't cut it.
 
You didn't answer his question. To you, who is the best pitcher in the game?

Since 2002 or 2003 the only other pitcher I put on par with Halladay is Sabathia. Mostly there have been one hit wonders like Cliff Lee last year, but no one other than those two have had the same consistency and dominance. I think Lincecum is on his way to that status if he continues to pitch like he does, but he's still pretty young, so it will take a few years. I'm not even convinced about Greinke. He's had a great year on a poor team, but one year doesn't cut it.

I don't think I'd put Sabathia ahead of him, I would put Santana ahead of him though.
 
^ ya good call, I would put him in there as well. CC was just the first guy that came to my mind that I would put in the same sentence as Doc. I think I'd have more respect for Santana (not that I don't already respect him as a great pitcher) if he was in the AL, but he obviously proved his worth with Minnesota.
 
^ ya good call, I would put him in there as well. CC was just the first guy that came to my mind that I would put in the same sentence as Doc. I think I'd have more respect for Santana (not that I don't already respect him as a great pitcher) if he was in the AL, but he obviously proved his worth with Minnesota.

Aside from this current season, Roy Oswalt of Houston has been very consistent for the Houston Astros. I believe he is right up there with Halladay for most wins since 03', as well as having an exceptionally good ERA and WHIP.

Regarding this lacklustre attendance, it isn't surprising. There has been an extremely negative response to the team's demise after the red-hot start they put up through May. Toronto sports fans are extremely fair-weather, and seem to be very easily persuaded by the opinions of our city's sports reporters. (Richard Griffith anyone?)
 
ugh Richard Griffin...


I thought about Oswalt, but being in the NL, I don't know. I admit I don't get to see him play much at all because of where he plays. I know baseball reference compares Oswalt closest to Halladay, but I think the quality of opponent is like night and day and i just don't think Oswalt could put up the same numbers in the AL east. I'd give Oswalt top 10 status at least though. Maybe top 7.
 
ugh Richard Griffin...


I thought about Oswalt, but being in the NL, I don't know. I admit I don't get to see him play much at all because of where he plays. I know baseball reference compares Oswalt closest to Halladay, but I think the quality of opponent is like night and day and i just don't think Oswalt could put up the same numbers in the AL east. I'd give Oswalt top 10 status at least though. Maybe top 7.

Oswalt has been a very good pitcher. I don't think being in the NL should be held against him...having a DH isn't as much of a factor as everyone thinks it is.
 
Aside from this current season, Roy Oswalt of Houston has been very consistent for the Houston Astros. I believe he is right up there with Halladay for most wins since 03', as well as having an exceptionally good ERA and WHIP.

Regarding this lacklustre attendance, it isn't surprising. There has been an extremely negative response to the team's demise after the red-hot start they put up through May. Toronto sports fans are extremely fair-weather, and seem to be very easily persuaded by the opinions of our city's sports reporters. (Richard Griffith anyone?)

The team is bad. It's no surprise fans aren't coming, especially with a GM that has failed so miserably.
 
Oswalt has been a very good pitcher. I don't think being in the NL should be held against him...having a DH isn't as much of a factor as everyone thinks it is.

I think the DH is a huge difference. Really a DH should be one of your best hitters (if done properly). If in one league that position is your best hitter and in the other its equivalent is your worst, it's a big difference. 3 free outs per game can help depending on when and how they happen. Perhaps its based more on just the general opinion that the AL is better than the NL. I just think if two pitchers have identical stats (halladay and oswalt, let's say) that the one pitching in the AL (nevermind the AL east) is the better pitcher. I agree that Oswalt is a very good pitcher though. I just think he's more of a guy I think of in the top ten rather than top 2 or 3.
 
What, exactly, is the problem with Richard Griffin?

Well first, he has an immense grudge against Ricciardi that stems more from JP's attitude towards the Toronto media (as in, he's willing to talk to bigtime american media but thinks Toronto media are small town) rather than his actual managerial decisions. He's made some bad decisions lately, but he's also a GM grasping at straws and this grudge goes back prior to this season. I think it's horribly unprofessional for personal grudges to play out in the way Griffin writes.

Second, the guy refuses to acknowledge the growth in statistics that have helped people better understand the game. The guy is all about Wins and RBIs, stats that don't tell you anything really and he has openly admitted that he dislikes even the next tier of stats like WHIPs, nevermind stats like OPS+ that involve some formulas that he probably can't wrap his head around. Ya, stats aren't everything, but in a game like baseball where the game is static and repetitive they tell a lot of the story. To refuse to acknowledge that is a bit absurd I think.

Finally i just don't think he's a good baseball mind. For a Jays beat writer he knows very little about prospects including saying things like "Snider has recently struggled in Vegas" when the guy was actually on the DL with a back injury. Of course he was struggling, he wasn't playing! I think if you're a beat writer for any team you need to know the organization. If everyday fans know what is going on in Vegas or New Hampshire with those teams and those prospects, there's no excuse for a guy who is paid to do it to not know what's going on.

He's just never impressed me, and I find I get more from the hardcore fans in terms of real news than anything Griffin ever provides.
 
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I think the DH is a huge difference. Really a DH should be one of your best hitters (if done properly). If in one league that position is your best hitter and in the other its equivalent is your worst, it's a big difference. 3 free outs per game can help depending on when and how they happen. Perhaps its based more on just the general opinion that the AL is better than the NL. I just think if two pitchers have identical stats (halladay and oswalt, let's say) that the one pitching in the AL (nevermind the AL east) is the better pitcher. I agree that Oswalt is a very good pitcher though. I just think he's more of a guy I think of in the top ten rather than top 2 or 3.

That isn't really true though. Offense is the most important thing a player (aside from pitchers) can provide. The DH is not equivalent to a pitcher hitting. For example, do you think if Adam Lind was in the NL he would be sat for the pitcher? No. They'd find a position for him to play and sit their worst hitter.

As for Oswalt, I couldn't fault someone for picking him over Halladay. Aside from this year, he has had an excellent career.
 
Well first, he has an immense grudge against Ricciardi that stems more from JP's attitude towards the Toronto media (as in, he's willing to talk to bigtime american media but thinks Toronto media are small town) rather than his actual managerial decisions. He's made some bad decisions lately, but he's also a GM grasping at straws and this grudge goes back prior to this season. I think it's horribly unprofessional for personal grudges to play out in the way Griffin writes.

Second, the guy refuses to acknowledge the growth in statistics that have helped people better understand the game. The guy is all about Wins and RBIs, stats that don't tell you anything really and he has openly admitted that he dislikes even the next tier of stats like WHIPs, nevermind stats like OPS+ that involve some formulas that he probably can't wrap his head around. Ya, stats aren't everything, but in a game like baseball where the game is static and repetitive they tell a lot of the story. To refuse to acknowledge that is a bit absurd I think.

Finally i just don't think he's a good baseball mind. For a Jays beat writer he knows very little about prospects including saying things like "Snider has recently struggled in Vegas" when the guy was actually on the DL with a back injury. Of course he was struggling, he wasn't playing! I think if you're a beat writer for any team you need to know the organization. If everyday fans know what is going on in Vegas or New Hampshire with those teams and those prospects, there's no excuse for a guy who is paid to do it to not know what's going on.

He's just never impressed me, and I find I get more from the hardcore fans in terms of real news than anything Griffin ever provides.

I don't always agree with Griffin, but his take on Ricciardi is pretty accurate for the most part. He is the worst GM in Jays history...he's actually one of the worst GMs in Toronto sports history.
 

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