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407 Rail Freight Bypass/The Missing Link

Thank you for the thorough response! Much appreciated.

Something I was thinking of w/the issue of infrastructure costs triggered by longer trains, was sidings.

Clearly many haven't been expanded due to longer trains, I'm guessing its not that much of an operational impediment?

I was thinking at some point the thought that sidings that were only good for 6,000ft trains might have to be doubled in length, and in some cases that might require new grade-separated crossings, might have posed a real cost-barrier to longer trains, but I'm gathering that's not the case.

It's a huge impediment, but railways are incredibly frugal. The railways have a very hardnosed approach to gaining efficiencies.

Ten years ago CN's Bala Sub from Doncaster to South Parry - 130 miles - had 11 sidings all roughly 6300-6700 feet long. There was a small amount of double track south of Elgin (Richmond Hill) which GO paid for. Today, there are only two long sidings, one at Brechin East and one at Medora, each roughly 13,ooo feet. The others are mostly still there but the longer trains can't use them.

Across Northern Ontario, there are only nine long sidings between Transcona East and Sudbury, with a little bit of double track around Hornepayne and on the east approach to Winnipeg. There were roughly 100 "short" sidings of 6000-7000 feet, which again still exist and see some use but don't help with the long trains.

That's a huge reduction in how many trains can use the line at one time, and it's a huge reduction in the ability to add even one additional train to the route. (As recent experience with VIA shows). But running only half as many trains to move the same volume (hence reducing labour and other costs) for an expense of only that little amount of siding extension has proved extremely good for the bottom line.

How do they manage operationally? They time the meets very carefully. Rather than have one train sitting in the siding blocking crossings while waiting for the other train to arrive, they coordinate so that trains "hang back" where there is room on the mainline until the opposing train gets close to the meeting point. Or, they have one long train leave half its train in one siding and half in the next. When the opposing train has passed, the first train has to backtrack to pick up its tail end. That's hugely inefficient, but it beats investing capital. (Between 2009 and 2016, CN did add around 52 miles of double track to its Winnipeg-Edmonton line, because the growth in traffic is so heavy and can be depended on for the required payback period.)

That meet-when-it's-convenient approach works with freight, but it won't work with a GO train.

It's no surprise that the one GO expansion project that has been rocketing along is the additional double tracking from Elgin up to Quaker (where the new layover yard was built) and now further north to Setter (near Bloomington). GO will only run a few trains a day on that line - the rest of the day, the added track is available to CN for its freights. The benefit to CN is huge, and GO is paying for it. So CN is making it happen. I would bet CP would be happy to do the same to Cambridge, especially for just a couple of peak GO trains. The problem is when you put the cost of those projects next to the cost of things like LSE and Kitchener expansion, and consider cost per rider gained.

- Paul
 
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The issue of track capacity Milton-Cambridge is significant, and it stems from today's much longer trains...
Yes and no. Transport Canada has issued temporary maximum train lengths on specific lines in specific cases...
Very educational information about longer trains.
Thank you crs1026 and smallspy!

I seem to remember seeing past (temporary) rules about car counts, and some numbers that popped up (here or elsewhere in the world) included 80 cars, and in other cases the number 150 or 160 popped up.

In addition to length standards, are there car-count standards -- or as temporary rules, guidelines -- either here or in the states?

I would bet CP would be happy to do the same to Cambridge, especially for just a couple of peak GO trains. The problem is when you put the cost of those projects next to the cost of things like LSE and Kitchener expansion, and consider cost per rider gained.
In other words, not nearly as much economic benefit as the Freight Bypass (for all Kitchener passenger traffic & eventually Milton GO trains).

I guess it sounds like the Kitchener HSR train + Cambridge LRT (ION Stage 2) is far more likely to happen -- for cheaper per Cambridge commuter time given what I read in this thread and what it will take for the economics to be worth it for Cambridge GO.

Which means for Cambridge commuters, the roundabount HSR + LRT might take similar or less commute time for less capital buildout, at an earlier political timeline (2030s-2040s) if I am reading you correctly -- versus a plodding Cambridge GO train. If there is no solution.
 
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I seem to remember seeing past (temporary) rules about car counts, and some numbers that popped up (here or elsewhere in the world) included 80 cars, and in other cases the number 150 or 160 popped up.

In addition to length standards, are there car-count standards -- or as temporary rules, guidelines -- either here or in the states?

You will see limits expressed, but they will be situational. For example, grain trains to a particular terminal may be limited to X cars, but that may be because of the capacity of the terminal, not the physical capability of the train. Potash trains on the same route may be limited to a different number of cars.....different terminal, different routing, different car weight and train handling dynamics, different cars.

For the Galt Sub, many of the longer trains are automotive cars, which are 85 feet long, rather than the more conventional cars which are 50-60 feet long. A hundred auto cars is not the same as a hundred coal cars. On the transcontinental route, there are many more double stack container trains, where the cars are semipermanently coupled into units of 3 or 5, and the number of axles is different again thanks to semiarticulated car design. So you have apples and oranges. And pears.

The overriding rule is often hp/ton, or basically if the locomotives can pull more cars, then more are added, to the limits of its capacity.

At the end of the day, footage is footage. ;-)

- Paul
 
Wasn't that RER?
Bramalea-Unionville RER and SmartTrack are the same thing. Shiny new GO EMUs for the Bramalea-Unionville route.

Operationally, it has to be the same, for the trains used in that corridor anyway. It is likely 3 out of 4 will short-turn at Unionville (15 min south of Unionville, 60 mins north of Unionville). So whatever trains are chosen to run the SmartTrack route of GO RER's network, will likely be the same train that continues the Mt. Joy hourly.

Metrolinx already defacto confirms GO RER and SmartTrack are being essentially unified into the same enhanced GO RER plan (above original GO RER plan).

This may even be what the train looks like for the SmartTrack routing of GO RER:

upload_2018-1-29_16-16-45.png


Doesn't look like a classic GO train anymore. A frequent metro-like electric surface subway train, 15-min-or-better. Sounds more like SmartTrack. Or vice versa. You pick.

IMHO, doesn't matter what they call it, just build it, soon.
At least City and Province is cooperating on transit more than they did 20 years ago, naming shenanigans aside.

To be on topic, this might even be the same train that continues onwards (hourly) to Kitchener once the Missing Link is built & electrified to Kitchener.
 

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markham better not get in the way of this important project. as for uptown go line I would leave that line to CP (they need to have their trains go through somewhere) and rely on the 407 transitway to service that area which it would do much better because of all the points of interest not directly located on the line (york u, humber college, unionville). there wont be demand for trains there for a while and buses are way more flexible in terms of the possible services they could offer.
 

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