Waterfront: Port Lands Consultation

[Admiral Beez]

the only line still there is the one that runs on north side of Lake Shore before going to the Ashbridges Bay water plant (this has one train a week) and the line that branches off this and runs past the Hearne and along Unwin to the Ports Toronto area just west of Cherry Beach.

Okay, but is the area still zoned industrial? I wanted to start up the Admiral's Widgets and Whatnots factory on Unwin could I order rail car service from CN?

 

[steveintoronto]

I'm not holding my breath; our planning department continues to approve plans for brand new neighbourhoods (West Donlands, East Bayfront) without essentially any consideration of cycle infrastructure, so this would be an unexpected yet welcoming change of course.

I go beyond that. It almost appears that they've gone out their way to make cycling through the West Donlands uninviting, indirect, and awkward at best. I can't help but think "WTF?" every time I cycle through there.

"World Class" it isn't, by any stretch.

 

[Admiral Beez]

I go beyond that. It almost appears that they've gone out their way to make cycling through the West Donlands uninviting, indirect, and awkward at best. I can't help but think "WTF?" every time I cycle through there.

"World Class" it isn't, by any stretch.

One thing I hate about cyclist on the West Donlands is you can't easily get there from Cabbagetown. There's no connection other than:

1) Riding down River St.
2) Riding down the hill at Riverdale Farm and across the sports fields and then down the stairs of the DVP foot bridge.
3) Pulling bike down Wellesley Park steps to Rosedale Valley Road, and then cycling dangerously close to traffic on Bayview.

 

[steveintoronto]

One thing I hate about cyclist on the West Donlands is you can't easily get there from Cabbagetown. There's no connection other than:

1) Riding down River St.
2) Riding down the hill at Riverdale Farm and across the sports fields and then down the stairs of the DVP foot bridge.
3) Pulling bike down Wellesley Park steps to Rosedale Valley Road, and then cycling dangerously close to traffic on Bayview.

Even through the park (whatever it's called, the one that results from the flood berm protection) itself you have to access a dirt rut to get from one obtuse circle of pavement to the one that gets you to the underpass under the tracks. When it's wet, it's pure mud and dangerous.

What in hell were they thinking? Yeah, "set up for athletes". Ozzie Rules Crocodile Wrestling...

 

[salsa]

One thing I hate about cyclist on the West Donlands is you can't easily get there from Cabbagetown. There's no connection other than:

1) Riding down River St.
2) Riding down the hill at Riverdale Farm and across the sports fields and then down the stairs of the DVP foot bridge.
3) Pulling bike down Wellesley Park steps to Rosedale Valley Road, and then cycling dangerously close to traffic on Bayview.

What's the problem with River St? I haven't yet had the chance to try it myself since the re-build.

 

[44 North]

One thing I hate about cyclist on the West Donlands is you can't easily get there from Cabbagetown. There's no connection other than:

1) Riding down River St.
2) Riding down the hill at Riverdale Farm and across the sports fields and then down the stairs of the DVP foot bridge.
3) Pulling bike down Wellesley Park steps to Rosedale Valley Road, and then cycling dangerously close to traffic on Bayview.

Ride down Sackville, then switch over to Sumach at Shuter where both streets switch directions. It's pretty direct from Cabbagetown.

 

[lenaitch]

Okay, but is the area still zoned industrial? I wanted to start up the Admiral's Widgets and Whatnots factory on Unwin could I order rail car service from CN?

Possibly if you set up shop really soon but I wouldn't hold my breath for long term service. TTR may be mandated to maintain a spur that touches water (a creaky line likely with significant load a clearance restrictions) but I would expect that won't be permanent and at some point they would be asking for subsides to maintain it. It would also not surprise me that when the plan evolves, 'industrial' will be dropped in favour of, hmmm, residential - developers have better lobbyists. Toronto doesn't want industry, certainly not the kind that is dependent on trains or ships. I'm frankly quite surprised Redpath and whatever other heavy industry that remains down there haven't already decamped. Toronto likes to call itself 'world class' and compare itself to, in particular, Chicago. What is forgotten is that the greater Chicago area is a major shipping and rail centre and has a significant amount of heavy industry including, ewww, stockyards. World class is more than bike paths and parks.

 

[Admiral Beez]

What's the problem with River St? I haven't yet had the chance to try it myself since the re-build.

Actually the new River St. lanes look good. But but it still perplexes me how you can't get onto the Don River bike trail from Cabbagetown without lugging you bike down stairs and through muddy and often busy sports fields.

 

[Admiral Beez]

This is neat

 

[Admiral Beez]

Toronto likes to call itself 'world class' and compare itself to, in particular, Chicago. What is forgotten is that the greater Chicago area is a major shipping and rail centre and has a significant amount of heavy industry including, ewww, stockyards. World class is more than bike paths and parks.

Toronto (well, GTA) is a major shipping centre, with two container yards.

IMO, it's a shame we never got a intermodal sea/lake port going.

https://www.portstoronto.com/port-of-toronto/about-us.aspx

 

[lenaitch]

Toronto (well, GTA) is a major shipping centre, with two container yards.

IMO, it's a shame we never got a intermodal sea/lake port going.

https://www.portstoronto.com/port-of-toronto/about-us.aspx

Point - although I imagine a large number of residents want them gone, and the proposed one in Milton is being fought tooth and nail. I got a kick out the link. Their reported tonnage speaks to more to the city's building boom rather than a regional shipping hub. My-oh-my, 50 whole acres.

It's not just Toronto. There aren't that many Ontario Great Lakes communities that have active commercial ports remaining, let alone with rail connections. I think it has very much to do with the de-industrialization of the economy but it also has something to do with communities actively promoting and accommodating it.

 

[Admiral Beez]

It's not just Toronto. There aren't that many Ontario Great Lakes communities that have active commercial ports remaining, let alone with rail connections.

True. I wonder how many of these listed ports are actually viable industrial operations http://www.marinedelivers.com/great-lakes-commercial-ports

It looks like Cleveland is one of the very few ports taking container cargo, with an Antwerp to Cleveland direct service started in 2015, https://www.joc.com/port-news/us-ports/cleveland-antwerp-container-service-takes-wing_20150713.html

You can see the container port on the right below.

http://www.portofcleveland.com/about-the-port/

As an aside, check out this link that shows where all the ships on the Seaway are http://www.greatlakes-seaway.com/en/navigating/map/index.html

 

[DSC]

I was cycling today along Unwin Avenue and, to my surprise, the PNR RailWorks crews were replacing ties and ballast along the section of rail that runs alongside it just east of Leslie St. As I note above, the lines was repaired quite significantly about 3 years ago but there have never been sightings or signs of any trains actually using it since. More TPLC waste or are they expecting to start running trains on that part of it?

 

[W. K. Lis]

Hopefully, the powers-that-be will use Rotterdam as a model to follow.

 

[Admiral Beez]

I was cycling today along Unwin Avenue and, to my surprise, the PNR RailWorks crews were replacing ties and ballast along the section of rail that runs alongside it just east of Leslie St. As I note above, the lines was repaired quite significantly about 3 years ago but there have never been sightings or signs of any trains actually using it since. More TPLC waste or are they expecting to start running trains on that part of it?

Maybe that rail bed will be used for future LRT in the eastern Portlands?