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VIA Rail

Reminder for those who invoke Brightline as a comparator to our situation. The FECR created Brightline (All Aboard Florida).

BL are not some plucky upstart who used Jack Donaghy tactics and railfan forum wishful thinking to outwit the ogres of the freight company and get an operations deal beyond the dreams of VIA Rail’s dull bureaucracy.
 
dowlingm said:
Reminder for those who invoke Brightline as a comparator to our situation. The FECR created Brightline (All Aboard Florida).

BL are not some plucky upstart who used Jack Donaghy tactics and railfan forum wishful thinking to outwit the ogres of the freight company and get an operations deal beyond the dreams of VIA Rail’s dull bureaucracy.
Click to expand...
It should also be reminded that they got billions of dollars in public funds through subsidies, government loans, property tax deferrals, etc. to build and upgrade their "private" railway.

Dan
 
dowlingm said:
Reminder for those who invoke Brightline as a comparator to our situation. The FECR created Brightline (All Aboard Florida).

BL are not some plucky upstart who used Jack Donaghy tactics and railfan forum wishful thinking to outwit the ogres of the freight company and get an operations deal beyond the dreams of VIA Rail’s dull bureaucracy.
Click to expand...
Brightline was indeed created by Florida East Coast Industries (FECI), the parent company of the Florida East Coast Railway (FECR) but in 2017 the FECR was sold to GrupoMexico so it is no longer part of the same company as Brightline.
smallspy said:
It should also be reminded that they got billions of dollars in public funds through subsidies, government loans, property tax deferrals, etc. to build and upgrade their "private" railway.

Dan
Click to expand...
CN also got billions of dollars in public funds to upgrade and maintain their "private" railway in the name of Via Rail. This is not a relevant distinction between Via and Brightline.
 
reaperexpress said:
Brightline was indeed created by Florida East Coast Industries (FECI), the parent company of the Florida East Coast Railway (FECR) but in 2017 the FECR was sold to GrupoMexico so it is no longer part of the same company as Brightline.
Click to expand...

Presumably FECI made sure contracts were in place to ensure appropriate contracts were in place to ensure Brightline’s priority when FECR was sold. Something it appears as if the Canadian government didn’t ensure when they sold CN (or asked CP if they could take over their passenger rail services).

reaperexpress said:
CN also got billions of dollars in public funds to upgrade and maintain their "private" railway in the name of Via Rail. This is not a relevant distinction between Via and Brightline.
Click to expand...

Was it billions? I’m only aware of the one project since the privatization of CN, to triple track a small portion of the Kingston Sub, which has allowed an historic number of trains between Toronto and Ottawa (the “glory days” only had a couple trains a day).
 
reaperexpress said:
CN also got billions of dollars in public funds to upgrade and maintain their "private" railway in the name of Via Rail. This is not a relevant distinction between Via and Brightline.
Click to expand...
But there is.

Brightline is advertised and is loudly branded as a "private operation". The one line that it owns - as opposed to the line that it shares - was built using various highway grants, easements, tax deferrals, etc. in spite of that fact.

VIA is not private, and has never, ever tried to portray itself as such.

Dan
 
lenaitch said:
Regardless of where their fan club is, no federal party will get the keys to the kingdom without winning Ontario and Quebec which have 2/3 of all ridings.
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Urban Sky said:
The CPC is pro-infrastructure, pro-investment and anti-spending. As long as the private sector is willing to cough up the necessary capital funding for HFR, the CPC certainly has no incentive to nix it. And there certainly is no way for any party to win anything close to a super-majority while catering only to “western and rural voters”.
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All debatable. They are not being elected because of HFR. And if they scrapped it with since excuse, there's unlikely to be substantial consequences. And let's not ignore the party's immature revanchist and venegful streak where they just want to undo everything, because Trudeau.
 
kEiThZ said:
Bids closed. They got three.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1816210011351310522
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So all 3 rfqd bidders submitted rfp's

As a reminder, theese are the bidders:

  • Cadence — CDPQ Infra, AtkinsRealis (formerly SNC-Lavalin), Systra Canada, Keolis Canada
  • Intercity Rail Developers — Intercity Development Partners, Meridiam, Kilmer Transportation, First Rail Holdings, Jacobs, Hatch, CIMA+, RATP Dev Canada, First Group, Renfe Operadora
  • Partenaires Ferroviaires QCONNEXION Rail Partners — Fengate, John Laing, Bechtel, WSP, Deutsche Bahn.
 
roger1818 said:
Presumably FECI made sure contracts were in place to ensure appropriate contracts were in place to ensure Brightline’s priority when FECR was sold. Something it appears as if the Canadian government didn’t ensure when they sold CN (or asked CP if they could take over their passenger rail services).
Click to expand...

FEC is a rare and nonstandard railway line - small, tightly scheduled, built to high quality, and not that many freight trains. So its right of way is somewhat more passenger friendly, especially with the upgrades that were added. So the passenger aspect is not impacting operations, and is contributing to the bottom line, as opposed to seeking entry at lowest possible cost.

- Paul
 
smallspy said:
But there is.

Brightline is advertised and is loudly branded as a "private operation". The one line that it owns - as opposed to the line that it shares - was built using various highway grants, easements, tax deferrals, etc. in spite of that fact.

VIA is not private, and has never, ever tried to portray itself as such.
Click to expand...
Okay... but what does that have to do with this discussion? Nobody here is claiming that Brightline was built without government expenditure.

We are debating whether it is possible for a passenger train operating company to make an arrangement with a freight railway that enables them to reliably operate over their tracks.
 
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reaperexpress said:
Okay... but what does that have to do with this discussion? Nobody here is claiming that Brightline was built without government expenditure.

We are debating whether it is possible for a passenger train operating company to make an arrangement with a freight railway that enables them to reliably operate over their tracks.
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We have one in Canada - Rocky Mountaineer.However, they are not a passenger service in the sense of it being used primarily for transporting passengers.
 
roger1818 said:
Presumably FECI made sure contracts were in place to ensure appropriate contracts were in place to ensure Brightline’s priority when FECR was sold. Something it appears as if the Canadian government didn’t ensure when they sold CN (or asked CP if they could take over their passenger rail services).
Click to expand...
I suspect you're right and they made sure to secure agreements before the companies separated.

It would definitely be a much bigger challenge with CN which has been separate from the government for decades already, but it does at least demonstrate that it is theoretically possible for a freight railway and a passenger train operating company to come to a mutually beneficial agreement if they can somehow be convinced to think collaboratively.

roger1818 said:
Was it billions? I’m only aware of the one project since the privatization of CN, to triple track a small portion of the Kingston Sub, which has allowed an historic number of trains between Toronto and Ottawa (the “glory days” only had a couple trains a day).
Click to expand...
That project was a billion dollars on its own, and from what I've heard, Via or the Feds pay CN to maintain the Kingston Subdivision at a 95mph standard rather than the lower speeds they'd design for if left to their own devices. I figure that 40 years of those payments is not a small sum.
 
Allandale25 said:
canada.constructconnect.com

Proposal deadline looms for high frequency rail bidders - Daily Commercial News

At close to 1,000 kilometres it’s the world’s largest train project, and in just a few months Canadians will begin to receive answers to some of the basic questions associated with the massive federal high-frequency rail project that will serve the Toront
canada.constructconnect.com canada.constructconnect.com
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There has been no timetable established for commissioning of the trains, nor a budget, given that there is still so much be determined, Imbleau and Hampshire said. Hampshire said the best guess he could offer was that passengers would be riding HSR sometime in the 2030s.

“Can passenger railways be profitable? Yes, they can,” said Hampshire, citing examples. “We’ve got a project objective that the revenues must cover the operating costs, and preferably the long-run renewals costs.”
Click to expand...
 
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