VIA Rail

[Urban Sky]

And the chances of the missing quadrant being (re) established? I am sure it could be messy given the number of owner operators.

They could add it on the Newmarket Sub. So instead of going up the Bala Sub go north on the Newmarket Sub to cross over to the York Sub eliminating the backup move.

Depends on which is cheaper. Also the Bala Sub south towards Oriole is only 35Mph which is not that fast.

It‘s not a matter of willingsness or cooperation. It‘s a matter of cost - and that is going to be substantial, as you‘d have to completely redesign the signalling and interlocking in the area. It can be done, but I doubt that anyone would be willing to pay for it, as it would only be used twice per week (Snider) or a few weekends per year (Doncaster)…

 

[Bordercollie]

It‘s not a matter of willingsness or cooperation. It‘s a matter of cost - and that is going to be substantial, as you‘d have to completely redesign the signalling and interlocking in the area. It can be done, but I doubt that anyone would be willing to pay for it, as it would only be used twice per week (Snider) or a few weekends per year (Doncaster)…

At least you wouldn't need to expropriate the park.

 

[smallspy]

At least you wouldn't need to expropriate the park.

Considering that neither CN nor Metrolinx own that park - yes, it would need to be expropriated.

Dan

 

[lenaitch]

At least you wouldn't need to expropriate the park.

The 'park' is at Doncaster (CN York-Bala). By the looks of curves on Google, it would be more than just the park.

CN Snider (York-Newmarket) has commercial properties on the s/e quadrant plus grade differences. Either way, expropriation.

 

[Urban Sky]

The 'park' is at Doncaster (CN York-Bala). By the looks of curves on Google, it would be more than just the park.

CN Snider (York-Newmarket) has commercial properties on the s/e quadrant plus grade differences. Either way, expropriation.

Correct, and as always: what is the pressing problem we are trying to fix here?

 

[lenaitch]

Correct, and as always: what is the pressing problem we are trying to fix here?

Beats me. Bordercollie seems to think it would be money well spent.

 

[reaperexpress]

Correct, and as always: what is the pressing problem we are trying to fix here?

It would avoid the time-consuming three-point turn that the Canadian needs to do, and allow Via trains toward Montreal/Ottawa to easily divert via the Newmarket sub if there is an issue on the Kingston sub, and the Richmond Hill line could easily divert via the Newmarket sub whenever the Bala sub is flooded.
But with only three trains per week during regular operations and a need to expropriate industrial properties, the cost-benefit ratio would be terrible.

 

[Urban Sky]

It would avoid the time-consuming three-point turn that the Canadian needs to do, and allow Via trains toward Montreal/Ottawa to easily divert via the Newmarket sub if there is an issue on the Kingston sub, and the Richmond Hill line could easily divert via the Newmarket sub whenever the Bala sub is flooded.
But with only three trains per week during regular operations and a need to expropriate industrial properties, the cost-benefit ratio would be terrible.

It would certainly be a „nice-to-have“, which would justify very modest capital investments (e.g. if it only required an additional crossover at an already planned major redesign/resignalling of the junction area), but it indeed doesn‘t justify the massive costs of triggering a major redesign/resignalling…

 

[roger1818]

It would avoid the time-consuming three-point turn that the Canadian needs to do, and allow Via trains toward Montreal/Ottawa to easily divert via the Newmarket sub if there is an issue on the Kingston sub, and the Richmond Hill line could easily divert via the Newmarket sub whenever the Bala sub is flooded.
But with only three trains per week during regular operations and a need to expropriate industrial properties, the cost-benefit ratio would be terrible.

I am not sure how the suggested connection through "the park" at Doncaster (CN York-Bala) would help the Canadian. As shown below, train 2 arrives straight into Toronto on the Bala Sub (crossing the York Sub) and is facing west in the station. Then when Train 1 leaves Toronto, it continues west to the Newmarket Sub, and wyes onto the York Sub.

A connection between Newmarket south and York east would work, but it would be useless for detours because of the increase in distance traveled on CN's busy York Sub (better to wye at Bala), and for the Canadian, its not worth it for only 2 trains a week, and only in one direction.

 

[Bordercollie]

Did we figure out how VIA HSR will get onto the Havelock Sub from Union?

 

[Allandale25]

Did we figure out how VIA HSR will get onto the Havelock Sub from Union?

I'm going to make a new guess. One direction up the Belleville/Don Spur, the other direction down the Stouffville Line to the LSE Line. I am happy to be wrong/misguided. cc @crs1026

 

[Bordercollie]

I'm going to make a new guess. One direction up the Belleville/Don Spur, the other direction down the Stouffville Line to the LSE Line. I am happy to be wrong/misguided. cc @crs1026

But to get from then Bellville sub to the Stouffville line you need to expropriate the building that is in the way.

 

[Urban Sky]

But to get from then Bellville sub to the Stouffville line you need to expropriate the building that is in the way.

Provided that there are clear benefits compared to other routing options, expropriation is by no means a showstopper…

 

[crs1026]

But to get from then Bellville sub to the Stouffville line you need to expropriate the building that is in the way.

Businesses and commercial building owners don't put up opposition the way residents do. They just name their price (making it good and high) and go from there.

- Paul

 

[crs1026]

I'm going to make a new guess. One direction up the Belleville/Don Spur, the other direction down the Stouffville Line to the LSE Line. I am happy to be wrong/misguided. cc @crs1026

Now that's an intriguing idea. I can see the merits in it because the impacts on both ML and CP are a lot more manageable. That way, VIA only needs one track from Tapscott to Leaside, possibly sharing part (the Don bridge, for instance) with CP... may be an easier sell if there is only one train per hour and all trains in a single direction (assume westward) .... and it can interleave with ML more easily going eastwards because there is little variability in departing eastward trains, whereas westward trains joining the GO flow will be less predictable.

The down side is, it doubles the construction cost since both routes would likely need new construction. And CP might demand flyover/unders instead of level crossovers to get VIA across its line. Possibly more $ to construct than if VIA picks one route and builds 2-way capacity. If it saved the cost of a new Don Bridge, I can see the appeal however.

- Paul