VIA Rail

[roger1818]

I’m already assuming that HFR will get approved, just as seems to be the mood at VIA HQ, but I can’t say to which degree this feeling is based on actual signals from the government or merely the notion that if this plan doesn’t get approved, then there just is nothing which could ever make the government and its bureaucrats approve the creation of a dedicated passenger infrastructure...

Fair.

First, the Corridor already recovers more than 130% of its variable costs (how the Annual Report allocates the overheads - like my own salary - remains an accounting exercise which doesn’t change that the Corridor operations already decrease rather than increase VIA’s subsidy need today).

Second, it’s striking that certain people here still seem to believe that VIA’s operational subsidy is a fixed amount rather than the amount by which operating expenses exceed revenues. Actually, it has already been explained to him so many times, yet he keeps suggesting that it might be possible to re-allocate it towards his daydreams of daily passenger trains in Western Canada, so please don’t get him excited...

Of course the person you were replying to has not made it a secret that he has blocked you, so he won't hear the facts.

 

[roger1818]

It would be nice if VIA was given extra money that it could use (or save towards) infrastructure. This could be upgrading or replacing existing infrastructure (including their fleet) or buying ROWs of value to them when they become available. Currently they are so shoestrung that every time they want to buy anything, they have to go back to the government and ask for more money and justify how every penny will be spent.

 

[crs1026]

The amount of money generated is not so important as the difference in attitude that will prevail once the reality of running in the black is accepted by pubic and by Bay Street. Especially since I assume that as a CIB funded business, HFR will be servicing its debt. It puts proposals to go further with HFR or even HSR in a whole different light. And it muzzles critics (who probably should have fallen out of influence long ago, but life is seldom rational or fair).

Presumably VIA’s Board will look at any retained earnings and consider whether to reinvest in the business, or pay a dividend to its shareholder... as any Board does. I doubt Ottawa looks on VIA the way, say, Queens Park looks on the LCBO.... ie VIa isn’t a cash cow. But VIA’s value as a government asset will change immesurably.

PS - I trust the appointment of the new Deputy Minister for Finance is a good sign for HFR also.

- Paul

 

[crs1026]

^Thinking about this a touch further, once VIA has a business running in the black, the question of appropriate debt leverage will take more profile.

It’s not much different than a young couple scraping together enough cash to buy their first home. Sure, by borrowing from parents etc it may be possible to secure a mortgage on a very small amount of equity. But hiw much debt is it wise to carry? When that young couple gets this year’s tax return, are they able to take a vacation.... or should they be using the money to pay down their mortgage?

I suspect VIA will want to boost its equity before using HFR‘s earning power to go looking for more debt.

- Paul

 

[Allandale25]

The amount of money generated is not so important as the difference in attitude that will prevail once the reality of running in the black is accepted by pubic and by Bay Street. Especially since I assume that as a CIB funded business, HFR will be servicing its debt. It puts proposals to go further with HFR or even HSR in a whole different light. And it muzzles critics (who probably should have fallen out of influence long ago, but life is seldom rational or fair).

Presumably VIA’s Board will look at any retained earnings and consider whether to reinvest in the business, or pay a dividend to its shareholder... as any Board does. I doubt Ottawa looks on VIA the way, say, Queens Park looks on the LCBO.... ie VIa isn’t a cash cow. But VIA’s value as a government asset will change immesurably.

PS - I trust the appointment of the new Deputy Minister for Finance is a good sign for HFR also.

- Paul

Sorry, can you remind me how the new Deputy Mini for Finance could be helpful for HFR?

 

[crs1026]

Sabia was the Caisse CEO who put together the REM deal, and was then CEO of the CIB. If anybody knows what HFR is about, and understands the role of government in funding infrastructure, it’s him.

Opinion: Michael Sabia’s infrastructure vision: Build it and they will come

Canada’s new deputy finance minister has a history of insisting that major projects stimulate growth by creating a virtuous circle of economic activity around them

www.theglobeandmail.com

- Paul

 

[Northern Light]

Sorry, can you remind me how the new Deputy Mini for Finance could be helpful for HFR?

This article has some clues:

Michael Sabia's sure going to do something - Macleans.ca

Paul Wells: The new DM of Finance intends to do great things. The Prime Minister intends for him to do great things. Now, will they actually happen?

www.macleans.ca

From same, a look at his CV:

He’s had four big jobs in his life, which is three or four more than most people get. He basically spent the ’80s in the public service, the ’90s at CN Rail, the ’00s at BCE and the ’10s running the Caisse de dépôt.

He's also a key architect of the Infrastructure Bank (and its most recent chair) ; its chief client as head of the Caisse, pushing the REM project in Montreal.

Further, he's a proponent of getting more of its money out the door, as per this article:

Infrastructure bank to invest $10 billion in priority areas for pandemic recovery

OTTAWA - The Liberal government is promising to finally spend $10 billion that has sat in the accounts of its infrastructure financing agency for year...

www.thestar.com

 

[kEiThZ]

^Thinking about this a touch further, once VIA has a business running in the black, the question of appropriate debt leverage will take more profile.

It’s not much different than a young couple scraping together enough cash to buy their first home. Sure, by borrowing from parents etc it may be possible to secure a mortgage on a very small amount of equity. But hiw much debt is it wise to carry? When that young couple gets this year’s tax return, are they able to take a vacation.... or should they be using the money to pay down their mortgage?

I suspect VIA will want to boost its equity before using HFR‘s earning power to go looking for more debt.

- Paul

They are borrowing to build HFR (theoretically). So they'll be leveraged from day one. The only question is how much profitable operation of HFR will allow for expansion of that borrowing. Hopefully, enough to pay for a second phase of extension (Union-Pearson-Kitcener-London). Beyond that, the decisions are probably going to be much more financially challenging.

 

[kEiThZ]

Sabia was the Caisse CEO who put together the REM deal, and was then CEO of the CIB. If anybody knows what HFR is about, and understands the role of government in funding infrastructure, it’s him.

Opinion: Michael Sabia’s infrastructure vision: Build it and they will come

Canada’s new deputy finance minister has a history of insisting that major projects stimulate growth by creating a virtuous circle of economic activity around them

www.theglobeandmail.com

- Paul

Yep. This is probably the closest VIA has come to truly having an ally in the upper ranks of the bureaucracy. The only question is now what can be done before the the inevitable election and whether both HFR and the CIB survive an election.

 

[SaugeenJunction]

I know we previously had some questions about how closely Metrolinx and VIA were coordinating on infrastructure planning for HFR, and this answer on Metrolinx Engage seems to clarify that they’re talking, which is good.

 

[kingkam]

This is just a general comment and I'll post in other threads too as some of these comments are not relevant here...and I just want to vent.

The passenger rail service is dying in Canada.There is just too many significant flaws with the way we run our systems.The pandemic is going to amplify this even more. Especially with GO/VIA service.

We need High Speed Electrified Rail linking major business centers together like Kitchener, London, Windsor, Hamilton, Kingston, Ottawa and MTL.(will never happen just be talked about for the next 15-20 years)
We need to offer price points that actually make sense for people to ditch their car and take rail service to places like above
We need a mid town corridor running through the GTA parallel to the 407 or 401
We need to significantly reduce the travel time linking the above cities by at least half.

As an example I would love to take the train from let's say Whitby to Burlington/Oakville but that takes 2+ hours by GO. Or I would love to take the train from Union to Niagara but that's another 2 hours again. So we need passenger trains that can travel 200 + KM/H that don't get delayed by freight or ROW's. This makes me just want to use my vehicle even if it means it's more taxing on my body.

We have an opportunity to significantly invest in our economy right now and we should take advantage in the post pandemic world. Having high speed trains opens up where people can live/work/play and links our province together. I know it will never happen but one can dream. The passenger rail service will take years to recover unless we invest and actually make it a faster/cheaper viable option within our option to use.

Someone smarter than me prove me wrong or am I correct?

 

[micheal_can]

This is just a general comment and I'll post in other threads too as some of these comments are not relevant here...and I just want to vent.

The passenger rail service is dying in Canada.There is just too many significant flaws with the way we run our systems.The pandemic is going to amplify this even more. Especially with GO/VIA service.

We need High Speed Electrified Rail linking major business centers together like Kitchener, London, Windsor, Hamilton, Kingston, Ottawa and MTL.(will never happen just be talked about for the next 15-20 years)
We need to offer price points that actually make sense for people to ditch their car and take rail service to places like above
We need a mid town corridor running through the GTA parallel to the 407 or 401
We need to significantly reduce the travel time linking the above cities by at least half.

As an example I would love to take the train from let's say Whitby to Burlington/Oakville but that takes 2+ hours by GO. Or I would love to take the train from Union to Niagara but that's another 2 hours again. So we need passenger trains that can travel 200 + KM/H that don't get delayed by freight or ROW's. This makes me just want to use my vehicle even if it means it's more taxing on my body.

We have an opportunity to significantly invest in our economy right now and we should take advantage in the post pandemic world. Having high speed trains opens up where people can live/work/play and links our province together. I know it will never happen but one can dream. The passenger rail service will take years to recover unless we invest and actually make it a faster/cheaper viable option within our option to use.

Someone smarter than me prove me wrong or am I correct?

The problem with GO is that they generally stop at all stations, where as, Via only stops at a handful of stations along the same route. If I were you, I'd take the GO to Oshawa, Then take Via to Toronto, and then take Via to Niagara Falls, if it were running.

 

[Urban Sky]

Someone smarter than me prove me wrong or am I correct?

It’s good to have dreams, but it’s better to have a strategic vision of how to achieve it. Everything you describe should happen eventually at some point in the future, but HFR is the indispensable first step in that direction...

 

[SaugeenJunction]

It’s good to have dreams, but it’s better to have a strategic vision of how to achieve it. Everything you describe should happen eventually at some point in the future, but HFR is the indispensable first step in that direction...

HFR is excellent because it will create a consistent and frequent service which will help grow ridership in big ways. Once the train culture and ridership is there, then it will be politically palatable to drop the big bucks on HSR. I am all for high speed rail but I think that for Canada, baby steps is the best strategy.

 

[Allandale25]

I know we previously had some questions about how closely Metrolinx and VIA were coordinating on infrastructure planning for HFR, and this answer on Metrolinx Engage seems to clarify that they’re talking, which is good.

View attachment 287850

Maybe this is just a wording issue but I'm not why they are saying the JPO "is" being established. Hasn't it been up and running since it was announced in January 2020? What's the link for that response location?