EnviroTO
Senior Member
You mean Dentrobate don't you? Undying has a high likelihood of being Dentrobate. Do you log IP addresses?
|
|
|
U.S. Elections 2008
- Thread starter Admiral Beez
- Start date
You mean Dentrobate don't you? Undying has a high likelihood of being Dentrobate. Do you log IP addresses?
Prometheus The Supremo
►Member №41+⅜◄
Member Bio
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2007
- Messages
- 4,107
- Reaction score
- 5
- Location
- a strange reality, bizarro toronto
the dentro meme...
Not to nit-pick, but a IP address is an intangible, arbitrary number. It cannot be personified. If anything his internet skills brim through by the usage.
Not to nit-pick, but a IP address is an intangible, arbitrary number. It cannot be personified. If anything his internet skills brim through by the usage.
U
Undying42
Guest
Gosh, did you have to rat me out like this? I didn't mean it as an offensive or sexist statement, just an observation or stereotyping if you will, of why committed Democrats would suddenly support McCain, the Republican nominee, over Obama if Hilary isn't selected. You could of said I crossed the line without calling the mods attention. I'm just a little high-strung bordering Tourettes, but not so much so a little hint or indication that I've gone too far before taking things to the point of no return, would've been nice. I honestly didn't realize I was being sexist as I thought 'feminazi' was an alternative word for 'feminists'. Yikes, and I thought I was being over-sensitive about the use of the N-word to describe black people. You'd punish me yet give a free pass to racists, I see. Let's just calm down and focus on the topic discussion please. I only want to participate in forum topics, not deliberately offend people. Again I'm sorry!
unimaginative2
Senior Member
I understand that you don't mean to be malicious, and you're a very strong supporter of Obama, but the attitudes that you've expressed are pretty sexist and show a tremendous lack of respect for the large number of intelligent people who support Hillary Clinton. It would be a huge step forward for American society to have its first female President, just as it would be to have its first black President. I personally don't think that should be the deciding factor, though. And now that you know, "feminazi" really is not an acceptable term.
Now, I am quite astonished and baffled about where I've given a "free pass to racists." That's a pretty offensive accusation, too.
Oh, and I guess if you are Dentrobate, I might not have jumped quite so quickly on the mods. When it's one of the first posts of a new member, one tends to be a bit tougher.
Now, I am quite astonished and baffled about where I've given a "free pass to racists." That's a pretty offensive accusation, too.
Oh, and I guess if you are Dentrobate, I might not have jumped quite so quickly on the mods. When it's one of the first posts of a new member, one tends to be a bit tougher.
Brandon716
Senior Member
I may have a large bias due to being raised in "Red America" because I don't see how Obama can be elected.
If that is the case, that is the case, but Hillary is polling as if she can win several states Obama has no chance of winning. West Virginia, Tennessee, Arkansas, and Missouri are all states that Hillary looks at grabbing in the battleground arena.
I can't stand the idiotic gun toting redneck like anyone who isn't into that kind of culture, but you cannot ignore their vote. These people may be stupid, they may be moronic, but they do vote. If you do ignore them, you will be guaranteed a loss.
Maybe I'm just bitter? I don't know. All I know is that I can't fathom saying President McCain.
I will never call myself an American again if that is the case.
If you want that large nationwide poll, here it is, from SurveyUSA (one of the more respected polling firms):
Hillary and McCain:
http://www.surveyusa.com/index.php/2008/03/06/electoral-math-as-of-030608-clinton-276-mccain-262/
Obama and McCain:
http://www.surveyusa.com/index.php/2008/03/06/electoral-math-as-of-030608-obama-280-mccain-258/
I don't believe Hillary will lose Washington or Oregon, as polls after this poll show she would win, so I don't think the polling tells all. BUT, here are some key numbers:
http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=32b3487a-6bec-4a4c-a7f4-c57850828cd8
Arkansas
Hillary - 51%
McCain - 40%
These are free Electoral Votes in mostly Red America for all I'm concerned.
http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=8e86f07b-b4f0-4c7d-846e-ba4f0223f35b
Tennessee
McCain - 46%
Hillary - 46%
I have to say I'm quite humbled by these results. TN is a slightly more moderate southern state, and its where I grew up, but I say Hillary has a fighting chance here. She isn't hated as much and the Clinton name has value here. Another possible Red pickup for Hillary.
http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=a8387b97-af37-4abb-8240-b9968105c78c
West Virginia
McCain - 42%
Hillary - 47%
Another battleground in favor of Hillary. The Conservatives in West Virginia love government programs, they are just into the whole Jesus fundamentalism thing. Easy loss for McCain.
http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=9a499429-a388-4e22-99fb-e668dcc23958
Missouri
McCain - 48%
Hillary - 44%
Okay, big hit for Hillary. But then again other polls, even more recent ones from SurveyUSA, shows her ahead.
Here is a poll from 3/19:
http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReportEmail.aspx?g=8d367ce2-f928-4f60-b2a1-ce2b97ad6144
Missouri
McCain - 48%
Hillary - 46%
BUT:
McCain - 53%
Obama - 39%
Makes me VERY nervous. Missouri is one of those "so goes MO, so goes the nation" states. Obama is polling very bad here. I cannot stand seeing McCain lead both of them.
Who really knows? I don't know, but I'm going to continue sipping this Pepsi and Vodka and watch the rest of Celebrity Apprentice. LOL
Maybe I'm worried about nothing? Who knows.
Brandon716
Senior Member
I'm only going to say this once more. I like both Obama and Hillary.
This isn't about Super Delegates electing Hillary.
What I'd like to see is this:
*MI and FL work out some kind of arrangement and get MI to at least revote if nothing else. Get these states involved, because Democrats Abroad and territories like Puerto Rico currently have more of a say than two of our largest states. BOTH campaigns adhered to the rules and didn't campaign at all in January when they had the elections. Now the time has passed and we can hold another election or at least have the super delegates take into consideration these voters.
*Once the Primary season is totally complete, then whoever has the most votes and most delegates should rightfully get the nomination. As it stands today, Hillary would be ahead if MI and FL counted, and yes I'm aware of what happened. But she won those states and their voices are totally being disregarded. Is it right for super delegates to ignore these people? Two of the largest US states whose population is close to 25 million?
Again, I hate to be repetitive, but Obama stands to lose more of the Democratic base than Hillary. Its been proven in multiple polls from the Pew Center to Rasmussen to others.
In a primary and caucus season, if more people in the party will leave when Obama is the nominee, what is this "will of the people" argument that keeps getting thrown around?
The race is tight, and Hillary might not even win MI or FL in a revote. It will LEGITIMIZE whoever becomes the nominee and ultimately lower that 20-30% that is considering McCain.
I doubt this will happen, but its my hope whoever becomes the nominee is legitimized by a revote.
Something that seems to be forgotten is that if Obama is the nominee, I will support him 110% after he's decided. This isn't a partisan issue between Hillary or Obama for me, I just want us to win.
I prefer Hillary. I don't think she's an outstandingly better human being than Obama, nor do I think she has ran the best campaign. I can't believe some of the screwups of the Clinton campaign. How any campaign can even come close to making statements that appear semi-racist, when I know the Clintons and have seen their work such as the Clinton Foundation's work to significantly reduce the poor African and Caribbean nations of HIV infection in his post presidency, and her legislative support of such proposals, I don't understand. Hillary's campaign has been less than professionally ran, and I don't know why what is happening is happening.
But as an observer, I still think she's the stronger candidate. But I'll support Obama if he's the nominee (as it looks like he may be).
unimaginative2
Senior Member
You make very good points, but a few other interesting bits: in that SurveyUSA poll, Obama was only 1% behind McCain in Texas. That shows he has real potential for a significant, realigning victory. I don't think you have to worry about the Democratic base this election. They're excited enough about finally getting rid of the Republicans that they'll vote for either candidate. A lot of the Republican base, on the other hand, is less than eager to vote for McCain and might be willing to consider other options or at least stay home. Just a thought. On the other hand, you're right about Clinton's campaigining. I think she'll be more able to stand up to the relentless Republican attacks. Of course, many of their attack dogs are sitting this one out because of hostility to McCain. I don't know. it's hard to say. you've obviously done a lot of reading!
Brandon716
Senior Member
It says a lot for a political junkie like myself to be burned out on this election. LOL
U
Undying42
Guest
Okay, no hard feelings. In other forum message boards I've participated in, the dialogue has been far more abrasive and uninhibited, where posters get a kick out of hearing eachother's radicalist viewpoints. I'll be more careful to keep it PC from now on.
The race comment stems from another thread where I appear to be running contrary to concensus that the N-word is harmless and engenders no bad feelings, quite unlike the reaction to my use of the F-word, which got my rationale miscontrued.
Oh and I'm not Dentrobate but given his abrupt departure from UT and me happening to share some of his ideas, it's not surprising how you'd get the two mixed up. However in stark contrast I'm repentant for what ill-wills I've committed. Plus would Dentrobate ever get along so well with Steve D who constantly belittled him and fiercely campaigned to ban him? I haven't been an active member for very long but I've been analyzing the day-to-day going-ons of this forum for months now. Quite an eclectic group of people you all comprise I must say
!
detroitbootybass
Active Member
I haven't heard anyone in Michigan, my home state, clamor for a revote - except Hillary supporters (and very few at that). We all knew that the votes wouldn't count and all of the Democratic candidates, save for two, weren't even on the ballot.
As far as current polls, especially national ones, are concerned... we are, what, eight months away from the election? That is a very long time in politics. You can't even begin to get a semi-accurate snapshot of voter intentions when the two sides (Donkeys and Elephants) aren't even engaging one another. Polls will be more relevant once the nominees are set on each side and they start debating/running directly against each other's platforms in the General. Add to that the economy (McCain's and the Republican's biggest weakness) & Iraq and you can maybe start to see some trends that have meaning. But as I stated earlier, that is a long way off.
As far as current polls, especially national ones, are concerned... we are, what, eight months away from the election? That is a very long time in politics. You can't even begin to get a semi-accurate snapshot of voter intentions when the two sides (Donkeys and Elephants) aren't even engaging one another. Polls will be more relevant once the nominees are set on each side and they start debating/running directly against each other's platforms in the General. Add to that the economy (McCain's and the Republican's biggest weakness) & Iraq and you can maybe start to see some trends that have meaning. But as I stated earlier, that is a long way off.
EnviroTO
Senior Member
Use have to understand though that I try to incorporate alot of the terms I've learned in university to the discussion. I like to think of UT as a clever, deductive set that can figure their way through even enigmatic language.
Who said the N-word was harmless and engenders no bad feelings? Show me a quote. I agreed that a-hole and the n-word are bad words meant to insult. Insults are obviously meant to hurt someone emotionally. You and Dentrobate (if you are actually different people) have problems understanding the words on the screen in front of you. It seems that your sensitivity to the topic is inhibiting your ability to understand what is being said.
junction_parents
Active Member
I like Obama
Roy G Biv
Senior Member
Roy G Biv
Senior Member
Ok, back to this post.
First of all, there is no reason to believe that Hillary will win Florida. She's still the underdog there against McCain, even if she could somehow win the nomination without destroying the party (which she can't). She also could lose Ohio.
Secondly, it isn't just about "big states", as much as Hillary would like to push that.
Iowa - 7
Missouri - 11
Nevada - 5
New Mexico - 5
Virginia - 13
Colorado - 9
These states are worth more than Ohio and Florida. Obama has more ways to win - he isn't betting everything on Florida and Ohio like Kerry did, and lost, and like Hillary would do. All he has to do is hold Kerry's states and win 19 electoral votes - there are many ways to do this - Hillary will end up betting it all on Ohio and Florida.
Furthermore, in addition to the Democrats playing "offence" in states that went Republican, they also have to play defence, especially against McCain.
Wisconsin - 10
Minnesota - 10
Oregon - 7
New Hampshire - 4
Obama is the much better choice for these states.
Finally, it isn't just about getting 270 electoral votes. It is also about turning out votes in all 50 states, to get downstream Democrats elected to the House and Senate. In terms of where the Senate seats are up for grabs this year, they tend to be in regions where Obama is more popular than Hillary.
U
Undying42
Guest
I'm really tired of the media reporting where Obama stands on the issues and so many saying he doesn't have a policy so I've attached in PDF format Blue Print for Change for all of you who can't seem to find his campaign site but want to put words in his mouth. If this document gets cut off because of group settings go to www.barackobama.com. I think a trip there will be a "YES WE CAN" visit !
www.yeswecansong.com
!www.yeswecansong.com