TTC: New Fare Gate Installation

[WillTo]

Last time I went to CNE, if you had a Presto card you had to show it to the guard at the gate. Then tap on the streetcar.

The whole point is to speed up boarding, but as a secondary benefit it controls the number of people on the platform.

Would be nice if they could keep doing the same thing in the Presto-only world with a temporary tapper. No need to worry about programming proper transfers once time-based transfers become policy.

 

[Streety McCarface]

I think that once time based transfers are introduced, all loops (ie Exhibition, Dufferin Gate, Humber, Long Branch, High park, Neville Park, Humber, Gunns, and even Fleet) should have fare paid areas and gates. It will really help speed up boarding in the future with an influx of riders and they don't have to be manned since the lines are POP and people are more inclined to pay when there are barriers. It would also be interesting if lines like St Clair and Eglinton had all stops operate this way, with platforms being fare paid areas.

 

[DSC]

And what happens with people who don't have Presto and need to pay some other way? There's probably a lot more of them during the CNE because of the tourist attractions there.

Because everyone will need PRESTO cards by this time next year. This month's CEO report notes these goals for next year.
"... two hour time-based transfer on PRESTO and limited use paper PRESTO card • Stop selling and stop accepting TTC tickets, tokens and passes."

 

[Leo_Chan]

I think that once time based transfers are introduced, all loops (ie Exhibition, Dufferin Gate, Humber, Long Branch, High park, Neville Park, Humber, Gunns, and even Fleet) should have fare paid areas and gates. It will really help speed up boarding in the future with an influx of riders and they don't have to be manned since the lines are POP and people are more inclined to pay when there are barriers. It would also be interesting if lines like St Clair and Eglinton had all stops operate this way, with platforms being fare paid areas.

So like Viva’s “Fare Paid Zones” past the black line, but with actual gates?

 

[DSC]

I think that once time based transfers are introduced, all loops (ie Exhibition, Dufferin Gate, Humber, Long Branch, High park, Neville Park, Humber, Gunns, and even Fleet) should have fare paid areas and gates. It will really help speed up boarding in the future with an influx of riders and they don't have to be manned since the lines are POP and people are more inclined to pay when there are barriers. It would also be interesting if lines like St Clair and Eglinton had all stops operate this way, with platforms being fare paid areas.

Not sure why one needs gates and fences or how having them would 'speed up boarding'. They plan to install fare purchase machines at busy stops (like, some, loops) and as the streetcars are POP one should be able to control things ON the streetcars

 

[Richard White]

Not sure why one needs gates and fences or how having them would 'speed up boarding'. They plan to install fare purchase machines at busy stops (like, some, loops) and as the streetcars are POP one should be able to control things ON the streetcars

Some loops however are less used than others. Bingham Loop and Long Branch are not a fare paid area but are heavily used and would benefit from a fare vending machine. Other loops like McCaul, High Park and Neville Park are there because they need to be in order to turn cars around.

Dufferin is a special case along with Exhibition East. They are only fare paid when MAJOR events are going on at Exhibition Place like the Honda Indy or the CNE, otherwise they are POP. Both those loops are swarmed with people during those events and benefit from the crowd control measures that come with being a fare paid area. There is no need for a fare vending machine here as they are only heavily used 4 weeks out of the year. Why put a vending machine there when nobody will really use it? It will be a waste of money.

 

[DSC]

Some loops however are less used than others. Bingham Loop and Long Branch are not a fare paid area but are heavily used and would benefit from a fare vending machine. Other loops like McCaul, High Park and Neville Park are there because they need to be in order to turn cars around.

Dufferin is a special case along with Exhibition East. They are only fare paid when MAJOR events are going on at Exhibition Place like the Honda Indy or the CNE, otherwise they are POP. Both those loops are swarmed with people during those events and benefit from the crowd control measures that come with being a fare paid area. There is no need for a fare vending machine here as they are only heavily used 4 weeks out of the year. Why put a vending machine there when nobody will really use it? It will be a waste of money.

Surely one can have portable fare vdnding machines for exactly this kind if situation. I agree they are not needed 52 weeks a year.

 

[Richard White]

Surely one can have portable fare vdnding machines for exactly this kind if situation. I agree they are not needed 52 weeks a year.

Perhaps. I wonder if they could use a modified version of one hooked up to an electrical outlet? There is the control tower at Dufferin Loop to store it however at Exhibition East they may actually benefit from a permanent machine given how it is the more well used of the two loops. Exhibition east is used quite often for Exhibition Place staff, people going to Ontario Place, BMO field and other various events at Exhibition Place).

 

[nfitz]

Surely one can have portable fare vdnding machines for exactly this kind if situation. I agree they are not needed 52 weeks a year.

They used to ...

 

[Megaton327]

I just want to take a moment here and apologize for my insanely wrong comments saying the delay on the faregates is minimal/unnoticeable/problematic when the rest of you were complaining about it. I guess my first couple of tries during the initial deployment at a couple of stations had me either getting lucky with good gates, or I was just so pleased with the other benefits of the gates that I was going slower and I overlooked it.

I've been using the TYSSE heavily of late and good lord the delay on the gates is ridiculous. When I'm in a rush, walking at my top speed, I tap my presto card and have to come to a sudden halt right as I gently bump into the doors then it still takes the gate a full second to open. Worse on entry than exit but exit is still a good 0.5-0.8 seconds I'd say. You'd think I'd learn better after so many of these incidents but decades of experience with the turnstiles is quite difficult to unlearn in a month.

They need to fix this. The only saving grace is that so many of them are broken that they're stuck open so at least on exit you can find one of those to rush through.

 

[Kyle Campbell]

I'll have to pay closer attention to our gates in Ottawa to see if they have the same delay. I haven't noticed it, but the only times I go through them are with kids in tow to ride the O-train so I haven't been moving fast. I know we have different software, and with only 4 stations having them at the moment we don't have the scale issue that seems to be part of the problem with the TTCs software. I thought the delay was getting worse as they install more and more gates. However the exit speed should be the same, so it might also be a problem with the gates themselves.

 

[RadioTech]

I had been considering finally adding Metropass to the Presto card I use for GO travel, but exiting at Spadina west side this morning, I noted that the only functioning lanes were those with Metropass readers on them. I'll stick to the separate card for now - they'll need substantially better 'up time' on these machines before I consider making the switch.

 

[Neutrino]

Echoing @Megaton327, my friend observed people going through the gates at Kipling without paying. They don't wait for the gates to close (and open slowly again) so they just sneak through after the person ahead has paid.

 

[Kyle Campbell]

I paid attention to the gates today in Ottawa, and they are also slow . The Presto reader is about the same speed as on OCTranspo buses, but it still means you pretty much have to come to a rolling stop for it to register. A QR Code ticket registers slightly faster than Presto. With a crowd coming off the O-Train, quite a number of people bumped into the gates on exiting. They may be German made, but I guess Europeans move a bit more leisurely than we do.

If you're curious, the gates here show the Presto balance and time remaining (on first tap, not on re-entry), or just time remaining for a paper ticket.

 

[DSC]

Most of first phase of new gates at Union are in place but not yet active.