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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

EastYorkTTCFan said:
I love how everyone likes to say bombardier is a joke of a company all because of this one order. Don't forget we had them deliver both the T1's and Toronto Rockets. They are working on new cars, refurbishing old cars for Metrolinx/ Go transit. They are also presumably working on the LRTs for Ion in Kitchener. Yes they should have had more streetcars her in Toronto by now but calling them a joke or a snake oil salesmen will not get them her faster.
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TRs had serious problems e.g. gaps for wheelchair users, door problems. There is also no indication that the LRVs for Ion/Eglinton/etc. will be on time given the delays for the streetcars.
 
Amare said:
But the thing is, they are a joke of a company the way things are being operated right now. They've had issues with the Flexities, TR's, London Underground Signal contract, C Series, supply management, etc... All this within the past 4 years and I haven't even mentioned the other issues plaguing the company at the moment. I'll put it this way, 5 years ago if anyone told you Bombardier would consider selling it's Transportation division they would think that you're crazy and have no idea what you're talking about. Now it's come to the point that people are not only expecting it, they are wondering how much they'll sell off.

Many things can change in 1 years, let alone 15 years (the date the last T1 was delivered to the TTC). The Flexities are an example of just some of the problems that are plaguing the company.
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Bombardiers various divisions have been bailed out so many times by different levels of government in Canada that they absolutely are a joke.
 
Megaton327 said:
TRs had serious problems e.g. gaps for wheelchair users, door problems. There is also no indication that the LRVs for Ion/Eglinton/etc. will be on time given the delays for the streetcars.
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Yes there were problems with them in the beginning heck there are problems with everything in the beginning. Most of the gap problems for wheelchairs have more to do with the platforms themselves than the trains. That being said how many problems with them are there now thath they are in service. If ther wer continued problems with them would we still be adding them to the system?

People complaining on a message board about Bombardier an the problems with the delivery of the Flexis isn't going to do anything to get the TTC or city council to change their mind on waiting out the contract or ending it early. It is THEIR decision not OURS.

Also people tend to over exaggerate thing anyway. I' herd someone say thath there's a problem with the ramp on one of the new streetcars dally after I had to get off one that had problems and held up the Spadina line for a couple of minutes until the driver dumped us out at a stop.
 
robmausser said:
Bombardiers various divisions have been bailed out so many times by different levels of government in Canada that they absolutely are a joke.
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So have GM, Chrysler and Ford in the US. Lots of companies get bailed out by governments to keep them in their countries. If we don't keep Bombardier heer we lose out on the jobs they create. Thunder Bay would likely be a ghost town if it wasn't for Bamoabried being there.
 
Megaton327 said:
TRs had serious problems e.g. gaps for wheelchair users, door problems. There is also no indication that the LRVs for Ion/Eglinton/etc. will be on time given the delays for the streetcars.
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It's taken Bombardier nearly 4 years to deliver 15 of our TTC LFLRVs. They were supposed to have more than 60 delivered by now.

The ION LRT is planned to open end of 2017. The first of the 14 LRVs is "scheduled" to arrive fall of 2016. Obviously I have zero faith in Bombardier's ability to deliver 14 LRVs in 1 year.

If they delivered ION LRV at the same rate they've been delivering the TTC LRVs, the ION LRT wouldn't open until 2019/2020. Sounds crazy, but if in 2012 someone told me they would deliver only 14 LRVs in 4 years, I would've laughed them out the room.
 
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Bombardier has been having a number of missteps lately but while I would like to know that the TTC is going to hold Bombardier to the fire to fix their problems, it is my hope that the end result is a functional Bombardier, not another Nortel, Blackberry, Corel, ATI, etc story of a Canadian company that once was. Besides a few initial hiccups the Toronto Rocket order was delivered on a reasonable timeframe with a quality product. The whole subway fleet is Bombardier and there is no major reliability issues. The entire GO coach bilevel fleet had been delivered without issue. Bombardier has transportation equipment that has been delivered around the world and for the most part there was no issue. While the signal contact in London seems to have been a fiasco, there has been no issue with their Underground fleet or the numerous regional rail fleets in the UK that Bombardier has delivered. So, missteps as of late... Absolutely. An embarrassing company that should exist no more... No way.
 
EastYorkTTCFan said:
Yes there were problems with them in the beginning heck there are problems with everything in the beginning. Most of the gap problems for wheelchairs have more to do with the platforms themselves than the trains. That being said how many problems with them are there now thath they are in service. If ther wer continued problems with them would we still be adding them to the system?
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Interesting that you mention reliability. If I recall correctly, the TTC's LFLRV contract specifies a MDBF (mean distance between failures) of 35,000km; the flexities are currently getting 12,000km on average (sorry if these numbers are slightly off, but if I recall correctly from the CEO reports, if these are not the exact numbers they are close and the relative difference between them is on the order of such). A gap which can possibly be attributed to the TTC's platforms rather than the trains (which I don't believe was actually the case, but for the sake of argument let's go with that) is one thing, 12000km vs 35000km MDBF is entirely another.
 
Megaton327 said:
TRs had serious problems e.g. gaps for wheelchair users, door problems. There is also no indication that the LRVs for Ion/Eglinton/etc. will be on time given the delays for the streetcars.
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Although TRs had initial problems, their availability once those were fixed has been light years ahead of any subway cars the TTC has previously had. Same thing with the LRVs, after final acceptance of new vehicles.
 
Megaton327 said:
Interesting that you mention reliability. If I recall correctly, the TTC's LFLRV contract specifies a MDBF (mean distance between failures) of 35,000km; the flexities are currently getting 12,000km on average (sorry if these numbers are slightly off, but if I recall correctly from the CEO reports, if these are not the exact numbers they are close and the relative difference between them is on the order of such). A gap which can possibly be attributed to the TTC's platforms rather than the trains (which I don't believe was actually the case, but for the sake of argument let's go with that) is one thing, 12000km vs 35000km MDBF is entirely another.
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The contract specifies that 35,000km MDBF must be reached by the delivery of the 60th streetcar.
 
By the time all their streetcars arrive, they'll be obsolete and will require replacement with a new generation. Might as well initiate the order for 2035 now - Bombardier might actually have the ability to meet such a timeline!
 
Ottawan said:
According to this article in the Globe & Mail, Bombardier is protesting the award of a contract in Chicago to CSR : http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...hicago-over-railcar-contract/article29615612/
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TTC wanted work done in Toronto, but no deal.

Boston has done the same thing with a plant being built in Springfield.

$226 million saving is money that can be use else where.

The issue with TTC order and the C plane has everyone on edge and they are prepare to look else where than having BBD doing the work.
 
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