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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

The excruciating car-by-car reports of deliveries that we monitored back when the fleet was first arriving is likely not required with this second order... once we see cars arriving at a reasonable frequency, all will be well.

It remains to be seen if this order will actually prove useful - or will the continued construction on the various lines force bustitutions to a degree that cars are idle all the time.

- Paul
 
Is the storage expansion at Hillcrest a given? Or will these be stored at improvised locations like Exhibition Loop? Tons of tall here about this years back but I don’t recall a clear resolution.
 
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Is the storage expansion at Hillcrest a given? Or will these be stored at improvised locations like Exhibition Loop? Tons of too here about this years back but I don’t recall a clear resolution.
They are currently upgrading the Queen Street (Russell) Barns so they can service the new streetcars and, last I heard, the plans to created a new carhouse at Hillcrest are still 'on hold' but the Plan is done. @smallspy probably knows much more!
 
They are currently upgrading the Queen Street (Russell) Barns so they can service the new streetcars and, last I heard, the plans to created a new carhouse at Hillcrest are still 'on hold' but the Plan is done. @smallspy probably knows much more!
In other words "deferring" in hopes that we'll forget about it.
 
Is the storage expansion at Hillcrest a given? Or will these be stored at improvised locations like Exhibition Loop? Tons of too here about this years back but I don’t recall a clear resolution.
If memory serves, 264 is the total number of parking spaces available at Russell, Roncesvalles, and Leslie.

There may be some leeway present with the fact that there's always at least a little bit of the fleet out in service at any point, and you may also get away with parking a few cars on tracks around Hillcrest and around the network, but, in theory, should you need to recall the entire fleet to the yards at the same time, you are restricted to the 264.

In the future it would be a further concern as retiring Flexitys will be mingling side by side with new cars that are supposed to be replacing them. In 2018-2019, the 3 or 4 westernmost tracks at Russell were packed with dead cars as they were being pulled from service faster than they could be decommissioned and hauled off to scrap, so you'd definitely want the additional storage space then.
 
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If memory serves, 264 is the total number of parking spaces available at Russell, Roncesvalles, and Leslie.

There may be some leeway present with the fact that there's always at least a little bit of the fleet out in service at any point, and you may also get away with parking a few cars on tracks around Hillcrest and around the network, but, in theory, should you need to recall the entire fleet to the yards at the same time, you are restricted to the 264.

In the future it would be a further concern as retiring Flexitys will be mingling side by side with new cars that are supposed to be replacing them. In 2018-2019, the 3 or 4 westernmost tracks at Russell were packed with dead cars as they were being pulled from service faster than they could be decommissioned and hauled off to scrap, so you'd definitely want the additional storage space then.
The 512 St. Clair needs 20 streetcars (with 6 on standby). The 511 Bathurst needs 11. The 510 Spadina needs 14. The 509 Harbourfront needs 8. Totalling 59+ streetcars, which could be allocated to Hillcrest.

From link, dated April 18, 2023 by Steve Munro.
 
Right, but the maintenance facility at Hillcrest does not yet exist, hence the discussion.
Actually, the Hillcrest facility was built as the most of the maintenance work on the system's surface vehicles (Peter Witts, PCCs, CLRVS), including heavy overhauls, repairs, and repainting.

From link.
In 1922, the TTC purchased the Hillcrest Race Track to use its land for the new shop complex to replace smaller facilities inherited from the Toronto Railway Company. The TTC opened Hillcrest Complex on March 13, 1924, replacing the TRC's carshops, motor shops and stores building located at or near at Front and Frederick Streets. On June 9, the School of Instruction moved into Hillcrest.

From link.
streetcar-4304-04.jpg



The Hillcrest facility has helped the TTC rebuild and maintain its entire fleet of streetcars and buses for over seventy-five years.

From link.
The maintenance facilities at the Hillcrest Facility (Harvey Shops) within the Hillcrest Complex, as at the two carhouses (Roncesvalles & Russell), are designed for cars with underfloor equipment and maintenance access from pits under the vehicles. The Flexity streetcars have their equipment on the roof, and require a different shop layout for maintenance. Another problem at the Harvey Shops is that most of the service bays can only be accessed by a transfer table that is only 15 metres (49 ft) long while the Flexity cars are 30 metres (98 ft) long. Thus, Hillcrest facility is unsuitable for the new fleet
urbantoronto-6737-22183.jpg
From link.

Since the maintenance of the Flexity Outlook streetcars are done at Leslie, only the retired Peter Witts, PCCs, and CLRVs need to be maintained at Hillcrest.
 
I am aware of Hillcrest's history, and the scope of work done there, yes.

If its current configuration met the criteria for a Flexity maintenance and storage facility, why isn't it being used as such immediately, and cutting down on the number of redundant kilometres cars on the 511 and 512 have to run?

It's because the facility is set up to do heavy maintenance, overhauls, heavy accident repairs, etc. It is NOT, at present, appropriately configured for day to day maintenance of a tram fleet.

Hence, the discussion.
 
4604 arrived on August 9th according to https://stevemunro.ca/2023/08/10/ttc-hillcrest-changes-for-new-streetcars/

It's apparently still got a pantograph so I guess that spec hasn't been changed. Oh well, I guess it means they could park it at Russell since it hasn't fully changed over.
that trolley pole is a symbol of the ineptness of TTC to sort their system and actually update their spec properly. we as a tax payer just wasted hundreds of thousands of dollars on ordering these necessary poles and will waste hundreds of thousands more just to remove them in the near future...SHAME. first of all the conversion to panto shouldve been done YEARS ago. second, is even if its not converted they could easily have diverted the current cars to Russell instead... but of course...less work for more pay is the mantra these days...
 
but of course...less work for more pay is the mantra these days...
Is it? I don't know any employer where this is true. One person doing the work of 4-5 people and getting the pay of 60% of a person seems to be the flavour of the age.

At any rate, the people who will be removing the trolley poles are not the ones who made the decision to keep the poles on this new order. You think they couldn't find anything more constructive to do if these cars had come with pantographs only?
 

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