Toronto West Block Est. 1928, The LakeShore, and The LakeFront | 130.75m | 41s | Choice Properties | a—A

DSC said:
Yes, but even if investors keep buying crap they will soon stop if 'real people' are subsequently unwilling to buy from them.
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When will that happen? The supply of housing is not meeting the demand for housing. This means that even the "crap" that developers are building will be bought.

Also quotation marks need to be placed around "crap" here - buyers (especially in this market) don't care about the exterior architecture or materials of the building so much as they do with building amenities and unit layouts (or location for that matter). If the developer is building what people want to buy and live in, and the cheapness/ugliness of exterior materials used on the building don't impede their ability to sell at the price-point determined by market comparables, then that is just how things are.
 
WislaHD said:
If the developer is building what people want to buy and live in, and the cheapness/ugliness of exterior materials used on the building don't impede their ability to sell at the price-point determined by market comparables, then that is just how things are.
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Unless and until the cheapness of the exterior materials becomes a public policy issue in the future, that is.

AoD
 
WislaHD said:
When will that happen? The supply of housing is not meeting the demand for housing. This means that even the "crap" that developers are building will be bought.

Also quotation marks need to be placed around "crap" here - buyers (especially in this market) don't care about the exterior architecture or materials of the building so much as they do with building amenities and unit layouts (or location for that matter). If the developer is building what people want to buy and live in, and the cheapness/ugliness of exterior materials used on the building don't impede their ability to sell at the price-point determined by market comparables, then that is just how things are.
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I don't think investors, especially foreign investors, care about anything but profits! They are in it for the quick buck and many of them will never even see the unit they buy. They don't care about architecture or materials or even condo layout. Let's get real, Toronto has a great many condos going to investors and architecture is not on their radar!
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
It doesn't necessarily require safety issues - see the BC leaky condo saga.

AoD
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To be fair, that was acted on because of the tangible concern of quality control and condo owners' investment's being destroyed. Personally, I don't think these window walls are as serious a problem as leaky condos...
 
Curtain wall raining on our streets is still a more immediate concern than the lifespan of unitized window wall panels. Poor installation of the all important waterproofing in window wall systems is documented and is without doubt a future concern. Condo owners will choose the cheapest band aid solutions over and over again instead of replacement. There's the precedence with apartment owners and condominiums covering deteriorating brick facades with god awful metal paneling or, more recently, acrylic stucco on a styrofoam or drywall underlayment. I would not put much hope in seeing ugly window wall replaced with fancy curtain-wall anytime in the near future.
 
Does anyone know if there is a contact email address for the guys building this?
I mean, the cheapness of the condo is really so over the line that I cannot imagine not sharing my negative sentiments with the people who designed it ... even if they don't care.
 
Lyphe said:
Does anyone know if there is a contact email address for the guys building this?
I mean, the cheapness of the condo is really so over the line that I cannot imagine not sharing my negative sentiments with the people who designed it ... even if they don't care.
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I could see your point but when it comes to looking at the condo part of the building. But the windows seem to have a mirrored look to it . And the podium is going to look real nice when they finish all that brick and stone work at the Podium level. Topped off with the dark glazed windows on top with fins to boot !
 
WislaHD said:
When will that happen? The supply of housing is not meeting the demand for housing. This means that even the "crap" that developers are building will be bought.

Also quotation marks need to be placed around "crap" here - buyers (especially in this market) don't care about the exterior architecture or materials of the building so much as they do with building amenities and unit layouts (or location for that matter). If the developer is building what people want to buy and live in, and the cheapness/ugliness of exterior materials used on the building don't impede their ability to sell at the price-point determined by market comparables, then that is just how things are.
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Completely agree! I purchased a 1 bedroom + den unit in this building, and I'm super excited for it - why? Here are the reasons:
- You cannot beat having a grocery store (virtually) in your lobby - having rented apartments in several cities around the world, one of the biggest annoyances was always carrying bags of groceries several blocks back home.
- The layout of the unit was awesome (in the unit I purchased, the Den is a sun-room, which I've never seen before - typically it's a cubby hole in the centre of the building with no windows)
- The finishes are nice (granite in the kitchen, marble in the bathroom) and the kitchen/appliances are nice (Bosch!)
- The price was good ($350k for 600 square feet on the 37th floor -- this is pre-sale about ~3 years ago).

I'm a hybrid investor/owner. ~40ish couple with kids that lives 1 hour outside Toronto - I've always wanted to live downtown Toronto and experience the nightlife (dinner, shows, events, etc) so I see this place as hotel-room for personal use, or possibly as a rental property if I'm not in a position to pay the mortgage just to have a place to stay in Toronto. Also saw it as a backup plan career wise as it opens up options in downtown Toronto.

Net/net - for all the positives, I don't really care what the outside of my building looks like - as long as it isn't leaking (some of the points raised on this are concerning to me - but I suppose only time will tell if this is really going to be an issue with this building). Eagerly looking forward to occupancy!
 
@ExcitedForTO you make fair points about this building but your post raises several questions that merit some discussion. While having a grocery store 'on site' is certainly good it is not a deal-breaker for many as long as you are not in a 'food desert'. Good Unit layout is vital as are decent Unit finishes . You note you bought "as hotel-room for personal use, or possibly as a rental property". Fair enough, but you will need to look at the condo documents about rentals. Most condo corporation have prohibitions about short-term rentals (usually less than 6 months are forbidden) so you will probably need to decide if you can afford it as a personal hotel or if you want to become a landlord. Despite what you say, many people DO care about what the exterior of their building looks like and, unfortunately, the outside of yours (which may or may not be well built) is seen by many as dreadful and rather cheap looking. This will undoubtedly discourage some future purchasers or renters.
 
DSC said:
@ExcitedForTO you make fair points about this building but your post raises several questions that merit some discussion. While having a grocery store 'on site' is certainly good it is not a deal-breaker for many as long as you are not in a 'food desert'. Good Unit layout is vital as are decent Unit finishes . You note you bought "as hotel-room for personal use, or possibly as a rental property". Fair enough, but you will need to look at the condo documents about rentals. Most condo corporation have prohibitions about short-term rentals (usually less than 6 months are forbidden) so you will probably need to decide if you can afford it as a personal hotel or if you want to become a landlord. Despite what you say, many people DO care about what the exterior of their building looks like and, unfortunately, the outside of yours (which may or may not be well built) is seen by many as dreadful and rather cheap looking. This will undoubtedly discourage some future purchasers or renters.
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Fair points - and I am aware of the short term rental restrictions - when they were selling these units (one of those 'VIP' sales events) they were actually offering 2 year rental guarantee option (this specific unit is guaranteed at $2k/month) ... so we will decide at time of closing if we're going to use it ourselves or take them up on that 2 year option. And to be clear - I'm not disagreeing that the outside finish isn't sexy - seeing the preliminary pictures and driving by, I'm a bit disappointed it's not something sexier - but for the price we paid, the location, and the other positives - I'm still quite happy/excited about it overall. If it's exterior looks alone (not some type of quality/leak issue), I don't think it's as bad as some here are making it seem (however - I get it - this crowd is passionate about buildings ... so to each their own :)
 
DSC said:
@ExcitedForTO you make fair points about this building but your post raises several questions that merit some discussion. While having a grocery store 'on site' is certainly good it is not a deal-breaker for many as long as you are not in a 'food desert'. Good Unit layout is vital as are decent Unit finishes . You note you bought "as hotel-room for personal use, or possibly as a rental property". Fair enough, but you will need to look at the condo documents about rentals. Most condo corporation have prohibitions about short-term rentals (usually less than 6 months are forbidden) so you will probably need to decide if you can afford it as a personal hotel or if you want to become a landlord. Despite what you say, many people DO care about what the exterior of their building looks like and, unfortunately, the outside of yours (which may or may not be well built) is seen by many as dreadful and rather cheap looking. This will undoubtedly discourage some future purchasers or renters.
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I have to disagree. If you live downtown - as many of you like to point out - you don't need a car. This is great until it's time to lug the groceries home on a streetcar or bus. Having a grocery store - and in this case a pretty darn nice grocery store - in your building is a huge advantage.
 
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