Toronto Waterlink at Pier 27 | 43.89m | 14s | Cityzen | a—A


Plus wasn't this plan approved in its current state? A little too late now to try and derail it. I don't see what the big fuss is anyway. Its an empty parking lot right now.
these were posted by thryve over at SSC...what a beautiful project....




There seems to be a certain level of opposition to this project - I am not included in this bunch at all...I think this will be a fantastic addition to the waterfront. I'm happy they aren't proposing something huge here - the scale of Pier27 is one of the best things about it.

Good stuff comin'!
You'll find most of the opposition isn't towards the design of these buildings, its the land use of the ground floors and site plan. I think most of us think its just a waste having private residences on the main floor while this area could be reserved for fantastic patios and restaurants and retail.
You'll find most of the opposition isn't towards the design of these buildings, its the land use of the ground floors and site plan. I think most of us think its just a waste having private residences on the main floor while this area could be reserved for fantastic patios and restaurants and retail.

Completely agree with you there - there would be some great views and breezes for outdoor dining.
maybe the city could 'ask' them to provide a restaurant or two, at least on the water-side....? Is this fully approved? ...these renderings are for phase 1 I think...
This development is the worst thing to happen to the rejuvenation of the Waterfront in a long time. Worse even than the power plant.

The design of the building itself isn't the problem, it's the layout of the building which is all wrong. It's like they've plopped this building in the middle of a large space by the lake. There appears to be an airport strip leading to the entrance. No street wall along the Quay, which means the building won't add feel to the area. No shops, restaurants or anything in the building itself, which means there is no real reason to go there, unless you live there.

How long before we start calling this the misktake by the lake?

Good design doesn't make up for a horrible layout. Just another reason not to visit the waterfront.
The city owns the parcel of land fronting Queens Quay so who's to say that Waterfront Toronto doesn't build something that compliments this building but includes public uses such as restaurants and store fronts?

Toronto also owns the strip of land that follows Yonge along the lake where Captain John's is now stationed.

There are lots of opportunities to put something significant here. The city just needs to be creative in how it uses the space it does own.
As an entrepreneur would you open a shop on the waterfront at this location? Other than the residents of this building (95%--my guess--of whom will have cars) and the local Tate and Lyle workers and a few stray dog walkers/joggers--who would support a viable Four Season's shop? Other than a Tim Horton's I can't think of much.

These things take time. Even Dundas West from Bathurst to Bloor West can't support many viable businesses--and yet it's in a mature relatively dense area of town. Many people are being impatient; I believe the current fixation with the waterfront that many younger Torontonians have is misguided and short sighted; by the time the waterfront is a viable happening continuous streetwall of trendy shops, four season activity etc all of us posting on this forum will be in our graves for decades! Even Montreal's "waterfront" strip--a lovely old-fashioned gorgeous boulevard--is dead 8 months of the year and many locals avoid the area except on St Jean Baptiste Day and the Summer Saturday night promenades that make Montreal so special. There's Vancouver's strip as well--almost completely devoid of retail yet it still "works." Toronto is no different and the current group of buildings down there is merely the first of many "layers" that will result in a vibrant waterfront--sometime before 2207.

There you have it, the city owns that parking lot fronting Queens Quay. There is plenty that can be done on the plot of land.

In Pier 27's rendering, that plot is a big lawn which makes it feel like a tower in the park. In reality, I doubt the city would leave it like that. There will at most be 10 to 15 meters around this building so it will indeed feel more urban than the renderings make it out to be.

Pier27 can do what they want on their plot, but they have to leave a berm on the waterfront. Because the city also owns the harbour, they can extend the berm with their own boardwalk which is what's planned.

I think this project can live well with our waterfront ambitions. The question is, will the city come up with something for their parking lot land that compliments the beauty of the architecture set with Pier27?

I think that lot is owned by Waterfrontoronto - judging from the quality their work so far, I wouldn't worry too much about it.

The sense of entitlement by the I-Can-Sit-And-Eat-A-Meal-And-Buy-Stuff-In-The-Lobby-Of-Any-Private-Residence-I-Want crowd is quite breathtaking.
^Yeah these Gen Y-ers really are spoilt little brats imho. Would they like it if the public demanded their posh suburban homes had cafes on the ground floor, that Rosedale and Forest Hill mansions had public accessible front yards, shops in the coach house, etc?

A double standard. People are paying good money to live in these gorgeous Pier-27 buildings. If I was dropping $1 million+ and had the stressful job that gives me that kind of salary, the last thing I'd want is some noisy suburbanites or ugly badly dressed people (why is it the waterfront joggers are so ugly and badly dressed?) hanging around my doorstep.

Of course a few little cafes or Dark Horse Expresso bars would be nice--but this is early days for the waterfront. It needs density and layers to reach that level.
Yes, that's exactly right. And that's why this site will be closed off as much as possible from all but the ultra-privileged few. I really do feel the pain of the people who can afford $1-million+ condos(oh! the pain of watching the poorly dressed. I really do feel for them) but that's exactly why the most symbolic and important site on the waterfront shouldn't be given over just to them.