Toronto Union Station Revitalization | ?m | ?s | City of Toronto | NORR

[nfitz]

The benefits of being first to board is that you get earlier access to the luggage racks and the overheard storage, or to grab a seat if it's one of the few trains that don't have assigned seating

Which VIA trains out of Union still don't have assigned seating? Seems to be on the Kitchener and Montreal/Ottawa trains I've ridden recently. Presumably the Canadian is assigned. Windsor?

I was on a full train to Montreal a couple of weeks ago. Lots of empty luggage space in the racks - which seem more extensive than they used to be. And the huge overhead bins were very underutilized.

In the many years it was unassigned, I never had a problem. Though boarding at Central and Union, there's always lots of space for those who get on at Guildwood/Oshawa or Dorval.

Compared to a plane, there's huge quantities of excess space everywhere! No one should get the impression that they need to be getting there early and lining up to fit stuff in.

 

[kotsy]

That absolute impulse to line up for assigned seating - it’s as if everyone is a newbie to VIA, or afraid they’ll fall asleep in the waiting area or something. I still find it odd.

I hardly ever take VIA but every time I'm taking a flight I'm sitting down until the line to board is down to its last couple people.

 

[MetroMan]

I hardly ever take VIA but every time I'm taking a flight I'm sitting down until the line to board is down to it's last couple people.

Flights are routinely oversold and so sometimes, it’s first come, first serve. If you get a boarding pass, you’re most likely getting on that flight but if a seat is needed last minute, and if you’re the last one on, your seat is taken up and you get bumped. I don’t think the same is true for trains but you might want to consider being less lax about boarding a flight.

I usually get to the airport close to departure since I rarely check in luggage and just walk straight to my gate but I’ve been bumped twice, even though I had already checked in.

 

[smallspy]

Flights are routinely oversold and so sometimes, it’s first come, first serve. If you get a boarding pass, you’re most likely getting on that flight but if a seat is needed last minute, and if you’re the last one on, your seat is taken up and you get bumped. I don’t think the same is true for trains but you might want to consider being less lax about boarding a flight.

I have never, ever experienced this, and I fly a half-dozen or more times a year.

Every time I've seen it, if the flight is overbooked and you are late getting your boarding pass, rather than showing the seat assignment on the pass, it will show "see attendant" or leave it blank, or something to that effect. They usually won't even let you onto the plane until they're sure that they can accommodate you - which is usually after everyone else has boarded.

Dan

 

[rbt]

I have never, ever experienced this, and I fly a half-dozen or more times a year.

I have, several times. You're considered to have missed the flight a few minutes before the doors are closed, before the final manifest is printed.

When there is a standby list those "final boarding" announcements typically coincide with giving away seats from passengers with assigned seats who have not yet made it to the gate; they do not leave empty seats when there are people waiting at the gate for a seat. If you get to the gate during that short window between your seat being given away due to being a no-show and the manifest being printed, you're still typically out of luck; I've only seen it reversed for when staff were the standby's.

 

[crs1026]

I find the boarding part to be the worst part of flying, and it is remarkably uneven in quality, even within a single airport and airline.
The rush to board is all about luggage stowage, and in the era of Rouge-style compession of space it has gotten worse. I have no anxiety about claiming my seat, but I have lots of anxiety about having to stow my bag way back in the plane, where I can’t reach it until the plane has emptied. The gate staff sometimes are efficient and organized, but sometimes are understaffed or run into complications - numerous wheelchairs and strollers being examples, plus the ‘booking from hell’ that ties up one staffer on the computer terminal while others are queued behind - that overwhelm their system.

What’s clear is that VIA has no plan for how it is supposed to work, does not train its staff to follow that plan, and does not equip either people or physical plant to make it work. Which is puzzling considering that their on board service gets better every time I ride. The actions of the gate staff and top of stairs staff are clearly ad-hoc.

I agree that a better PA is desperately needed, but also the gate staff will have to be trained to use it (airline gate staff do a pretty good job here, although sometimes they fall back on shouting also). VIA seems to have taken the architecht’s plans at face value without thinking through how the space can be used most effectively and then implementing a system to match the design.

I suspect we UT’ers are a non-representative group of travellers, in that we know too much and are anticipating too many things. We may be too picky. The average traveller is happy to line up if it’s clear which line is for which train, and they are happy to be sheep-herded up the stairs provided they can hear the instructions and figure out which way to go. And don’t have to show their boarding pass all over again every twenty meters.. VIA needs monitors bottom and top of the stairs, and along the platforms, that point to car numbers. This technology is quite common in other places.

- Paul

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

I find the boarding part to be the worst part of flying, and it is remarkably uneven in quality, even within a single airport and airline.
The rush to board is all about luggage stowage, and in the era of Rouge-style compession of space it has gotten worse. I have no anxiety about claiming my seat, but I have lots of anxiety about having to stow my bag way back in the plane, where I can’t reach it until the plane has emptied. The gate staff sometimes are efficient and organized, but sometimes are understaffed or run into complications - numerous wheelchairs and strollers being examples, plus the ‘booking from hell’ that ties up one staffer on the computer terminal while others are queued behind - that overwhelm their system.

What’s clear is that VIA has no plan for how it is supposed to work, does not train its staff to follow that plan, and does not equip either people or physical plant to make it work. Which is puzzling considering that their on board service gets better every time I ride. The actions of the gate staff and top of stairs staff are clearly ad-hoc.

I agree that a better PA is desperately needed, but also the gate staff will have to be trained to use it (airline gate staff do a pretty good job here, although sometimes they fall back on shouting also). VIA seems to have taken the architecht’s plans at face value without thinking through how the space can be used most effectively and then implementing a system to match the design.

I suspect we UT’ers are a non-representative group of travellers, in that we know too much and are anticipating too many things. We may be too picky. The average traveller is happy to line up if it’s clear which line is for which train, and they are happy to be sheep-herded up the stairs provided they can hear the instructions and figure out which way to go. And don’t have to show their boarding pass all over again every twenty meters.. VIA needs monitors bottom and top of the stairs, and along the platforms, that point to car numbers. This technology is quite common in other places.

- Paul

The entire project is a demonstration of heritage demands over the actual transportation needs of today.

AoD

 

[raptor]

The entire project is a demonstration of heritage demands over the actual transportation needs of today.

AoD

The entire project was an attempt to re-build the station on the cheap, while using heritage as an excuse.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

The entire project was an attempt to re-build the station on the cheap, while using heritage as an excuse.

Save the headhouse - I wish we can raze this entire garbage to the ground.

AoD

 

[smallspy]

I have, several times. You're considered to have missed the flight a few minutes before the doors are closed, before the final manifest is printed.

When there is a standby list those "final boarding" announcements typically coincide with giving away seats from passengers with assigned seats who have not yet made it to the gate; they do not leave empty seats when there are people waiting at the gate for a seat. If you get to the gate during that short window between your seat being given away due to being a no-show and the manifest being printed, you're still typically out of luck; I've only seen it reversed for when staff were the standby's.

Sorry, I should have been more clear in my comments.

I was referring more specifically to the "first come, first served comment", and how it relates to late comers. Every time I've been on a an overbooked flight, they have made sure that every single person with an assigned seat has gotten onto the plane before dealing with the people who have no seating assignments. I've been on at least a couple of flights that have been delayed because someone who has made it through security and has a seat assignment was tardy to the gate, while the people lacking seat assignments were left to see if there was still room.

Dan

 

[rbt]

Sorry, I should have been more clear in my comments.

I was referring more specifically to the "first come, first served comment", and how it relates to late comers. Every time I've been on a an overbooked flight, they have made sure that every single person with an assigned seat has gotten onto the plane before dealing with the people who have no seating assignments. I've been on at least a couple of flights that have been delayed because someone who has made it through security and has a seat assignment was tardy to the gate, while the people lacking seat assignments were left to see if there was still room.

Got it. Yeah, that's true and with good reason; checked baggage must align with the passengers who board and they really really don't want to swap too many passengers around as gate time is a sizable cost for an airline.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

It's marked as a retail space from what I can gather. Not a lot of space to work with tho...

With the "pop up" spaces looking huge in comparison, really makes you wonder what would fit. Reminds me in scale of the coffee stands outside every London tube station.

I had a thought; with the fact that it's called the TD Carriageway, I'm wondering if it would be a line of ATMs.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

I had a thought; with the fact that it's called the TD Carriageway, I'm wondering if it would be a line of ATMs.

Knowing TD, they'd probably plaster it with their eyeball-searing puke green branding.

AoD

 

[Le Gique]

Which VIA trains out of Union still don't have assigned seating? Seems to be on the Kitchener and Montreal/Ottawa trains I've ridden recently.

Just a few -- I think on Friday and Sundays - peak weekend trains to Montreal, I guess.

 

[Neutrino]

How much would Via need to expand their fleet to eliminate reserved seating?