Toronto Union Station Revitalization | ?m | ?s | City of Toronto | NORR

[interchange42]

It is very easy to open up a coffee shop compared to a restaurant. I'm not sure how many other spaces are leased out but it can takes months to equip a new restaurant (even a fast food one). It also may be a conscious decision to avoid loitering (a.k.a. sitting down to eat your food) while there is limited room.

The food court will be downstairs below the York Concourse, yes, and it may not be open for a while, but north of the York Concourse in the York Promenade area you'll get Union Chicken, Burgers Priest, and others, opening sooner as that level is already accessible of course. Don't quite know how soon however…

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[tnarduzzi]

I'm willing to bet that as soon as they have the (exterior for the time being) stairs widened from the subway station to the Front Street Moat, they will close the interior route through the Bay Concourse. Wouldn't you want everyone out of there as soon as you had enough space for them elsewhere?

42

@interchange42 I agree here, the preferable option would have been to route passengers through the moat, down the stairs, and into the TTC. Completely avoiding the construction areas. But. For reasons unknown the Front Street moat is seriously delayed. Also you must consider that the "bypass/leather shop" route cannot support a rush hour load via those two double-doors. Stairs widened or not.

In light of that predicament instead of slowing down the overall project timeline I would concentrate preliminary excavation and structural work around the "front doors" to the TTC. Get the sub level in and knock out the future doors in the front headwall. At that point you can continue working all around as pax pass through hoardings until the moat finally does open.

Nothing confirmed here. Just my two cents.

 

[Richard White]

@interchange42 I agree here, the preferable option would have been to route passengers through the moat, down the stairs, and into the TTC. Completely avoiding the construction areas. But. For reasons unknown the Front Street moat is seriously delayed. Also you must consider that the "bypass/leather shop" route cannot support a rush hour load via those two double-doors. Stairs widened or not.

In light of that predicament instead of slowing down the overall project timeline I would concentrate preliminary excavation and structural work around the "front doors" to the TTC. Get the sub level in and knock out the future doors in the front headwall. At that point you can continue working all around as pax pass through hoardings until the moat finally does open.

Nothing confirmed here. Just my two cents.

What do you mean the moat is delayed? Sources?

 

[tnarduzzi]

What do you mean the moat is delayed? Sources?

Nothing confirmed here. Just my two cents.

EDIT: If I had to guess I would say the public art installation is the problem here. From what I observed the moat was ready to use, i.e. the slab was poured and mechanical/electrical installation was complete. Then up went the orange tarps and nothing has changed since. Again this is not confirmed, but from experience here are the two criteria that artists never think applies to them -- budget and schedule.

 

[tnarduzzi]

[...] north of the York Concourse in the York Promenade area you'll get Union Chicken, Burgers Priest, and others, opening sooner as that level is already accessible of course. Don't quite know how soon however...

I would be willing to say that the spaces have been turned over to the future tenants who now "have the keys" so to speak. The reason I say this is that new locks (Master Commercial Padlocks) have been added to the hoardings around the shops. This replaces the simplex pushbutton locks, which Carillion has been using the secure the hoardings, and indicates to me a change in ownership.

I agree with 42, the York Promenade retail will be opening sooner than later at this point. I believe it is now up to the schedule of the individual fit-outs.

 

[tnarduzzi]

Prior to the Bay Concourse closure there was a Mr Sub, McDonalds, Cinnabon, Jugo Juice, Sushi Place, Bagel Place, a pretzel place, DQ and Purdys.

Cannot forget about Harvey's.

 

[interchange42]

EDIT: If I had to guess I would say the public art installation is the problem here. From what I observed the moat was ready to use, i.e. the slab was poured and mechanical/electrical installation was complete. Then up went the orange tarps and nothing has changed since. Again this is not confirmed, but from experience here are the two criteria that artists never think applies to them -- budget and schedule.

The public art could likely be installed with just the north half of the carriageway closed, so I'm willing to bet that the art is not the issue. I think it has to do now with work commencing on the Front West Moat, to replace the floor and to seal it off from the sky. I have no idea how long it will take to rip up the pavement (not that long I image) nor to cast a new floor, nor to install the skylight (but I assume that will take some serious work). Once that's all done, well I would hope that the public art would be in by then, and the carriageway and moat can all open at once.

Since the widened stairs and double-doors at the top of them won't handle the full rush hour crush coming from the north (and vice versa in the AM), might they not try to divert a good percentage of people through the Bay West Teamway access? I still can't see the route through the Bay Concourse persisting much longer. It's going to become simply too difficult to maintain it while work goes on all around it.

EDIT: one more thought. The Front West Moat seems, to me anyway, to be the least important part of the puzzle in terms to traffic flow. Any chance that it might be used as a staging area for all of the skylight construction and that in fact it may end up being completed last as skylight materials get moved through the carriageway for installation over the Front East Moat, for example? I imagine that they'll find a way to keep the East Moat open while installing overhead, but they are going to need not inconsiderable space to store the skylight components before they are installed.

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[tnarduzzi]

I agree with you that the current Bay access has got to go. I am just thinking:

If you were to look at the the North-Western-most area of the Bay concourse, Bondfield are focusing on excavating down to the new sub-level both inside and outside of the East Wing head-house building right now in this area. Also the East wall of the bypass/leather shop route leads right into this excavation. "The grey door."

Thus the option exists to underpin the 2 (or 3) structural columns in this area (which already have the steel bracing installed btw), cutout the future doorways in the foundation, pour the slab, and have pax drop down from the leather shop via a temp staircase into the new sub level. Then it is just a short walk across the moat into the TTC. This would enable hoarding to be built around the pax route so work can continue all around on moat coverings, Bay concourse, etc.

 

[Mercator]

I was surprised to see the newly opened starbucks closed yesterday. There was a lengthy (8 or 9 people) lineup at the Tim Hortons. .... I know there would be decreased demand in the York Concourse on the weekend and there are other options, but I still think that Starbucks could operate (at a profit) during the daytime on the weekends in the York Concourse.

I was also surprised to see a newly installed CIBC ATM in the york concourse. I thought TD had acquired the rights to the whole station, but perhaps that's only for part of it?

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

Cannot forget about Harvey's.

And Commuters

 

[mdrejhon]

I was surprised to see the newly opened starbucks closed yesterday.

I think it is only open on weekdays, perhaps?

Weekend commuter traffic is probably not profitable enough (yet) until more GO train routes begin year-round 365-day 2-way service in the coming years.

 

[Student99]

article said that they would be open on weekends immediately though

 

[chriskayTO]

article said that they would be open on weekends immediately though

It is odd - I went down there on Saturday - the McD's was going gang-busters and the Starbucks was closed. I also noted that the Starbucks location is pretty unfortunate - in a very quiet area on the far west side. Perhaps it will seem less out-of-the-way once the retail concourse opens and the hoarding comes down, and other retailers open up around it.

I tweeted Sbux about the closed location but I have yet to receive a response.

 

[mdrejhon]

It is odd - I went down there on Saturday - the McD's was going gang-busters and the Starbucks was closed. I also noted that the Starbucks location is pretty unfortunate - in a very quiet area on the far west side. Perhaps it will seem less out-of-the-way once the retail concourse opens and the hoarding comes down, and other retailers open up around it.

I tweeted Sbux about the closed location but I have yet to receive a response.

Better indoor York-side PATH connections would be a huge asset, to bring commuter flows from the west. Several are planned or talked about, but I think all of them needs to happen to help ensure successful Union mall and visibility (for both commuters and lunch market).

 

[Le Gique]

@interchange42 Also you must consider that the "bypass/leather shop" route cannot support a rush hour load via those two double-doors. Stairs widened or not.

Done. That walkway needed a name. It's the Leather Shop Bypass.