Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited

nfitz said:
There's 2 parts to this though. They are also asking that additional stations be added at Bathurst, King, Queen, College, The Junction, St. Clair, Keele, Eglinton, Jane, Kipling and Woodbine, making the 2-stop express train a 13-stop not-express train. So it woudn't be premium service at that point. With that many stops, yes, it should be priced like TTC.
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Then end result of that sort of change though has to be that you have a service that is useless for all......too slow to be considered premium....and not enough capacity to be useful as everyday/mass transit......so a failure.

If you dig through their stuff, there's some wacky and incindery stuff in there such as "run clean electric trains asap, not cancerous diesel trains". Cancerous diesel trains? With a phrase like that, they've exposed themselves as being a bunch of nutjobs, and shouldn't be taken seriously.
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Sure, if the rejigging of the system to something that serves no real purpose is not enough, then I guess those phrases do expose them as nutters.
 
TOareaFan said:
Sure, if the rejigging of the system to something that serves no real purpose is not enough, then I guess those phrases do expose them as nutters.
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A lot of the people complaining in Weston are nutters. I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop, and for them to start complaining that the high-voltage lines used to power the trains are giving their kids cancer.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
smallspy said:
A lot of the people complaining in Weston are nutters. I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop, and for them to start complaining that the high-voltage lines used to power the trains are giving their kids cancer.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
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Just like the exploding bus garages in McNicoll. People go to nimbyism extremes and complain no matter what.
 
nfitz said:
There's 2 parts to this though. They are also asking that additional stations be added at Bathurst, King, Queen, College, The Junction, St. Clair, Keele, Eglinton, Jane, Kipling and Woodbine, making the 2-stop express train a 13-stop not-express train. So it woudn't be premium service at that point. With that many stops, yes, it should be priced like TTC.
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i.e. turn it into the western portion of SmartTrack. Which is much more useful to Torontonians than a premium fare service for tourists. It's ridiculous that so much track capacity is used for a service that so few people will use.
 
aquateam said:
i.e. turn it into the western portion of SmartTrack. Which is much more useful to Torontonians than a premium fare service for tourists. It's ridiculous that so much track capacity is used for a service that so few people will use.
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A) I reject your characterization that its just for tourists, Torontonians flying in and out of Pearson will use it.

B) Isn't it useful that serving a "few people" will eliminate 1.2 million car trips off the 427 and the Gardiner?

C) If you noticed the thread title, this is part of the Georgetown South project. This means some of that track capacity is in fact for 2 way all day GO service, which will receive heavy usage.
 
DonValleyRainbow said:
A) I reject your characterization that its just for tourists, Torontonians flying in and out of Pearson will use it.

B) Isn't it useful that serving a "few people" will eliminate 1.2 million car trips off the 427 and the Gardiner?

C) If you noticed the thread title, this is part of the Georgetown South project. This means some of that track capacity is in fact for 2 way all day GO service, which will receive heavy usage.
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Won't re-debate the whole cost and priority thing again, except to point out that other cities with express air links built standard transit first and the express links second, if we had done the same then UPX might not rankle so much.

My real concern is with statement C. The current build leaves GO with only the third track. I found a slide deck in my files from last year (sorry, don't have a link, but it was from a community consultation session for the Bloor station) which has the fourth track labelled as 'Potential - 2031'. I'm beating a dead horse, but I don't see clarity on what has been contracted to date and whether it is truly on the books. It appears that the original project scope was four tracks, and certainly some parts have been built to that vision. But others clearly have gaps and corners cut, including the 4th track east of Jane St, and the tunnel under the 401. My cynical theory is thAt when costs mounted - the groundwater surprises and the CTC order that slowed pile driving at the Junction being the most likely suspects - scope was quietly cut and history rewritten about the project deliverables. Even if I'm off base here, I don't think you can say the UPX project has helped GO much, except perhaps west of the new Pearson Jct. I'm dubious that operationally, GO movements can be interleaved with UPX on a 15 minute headway. You will see two tracks dedicated to UPX, and GO left holding the bag.

The new government has promised 2-way GO, so a further capital project may emerge, but it's possibly a decade or more until completion.

- Paul
 
nfitz said:
If you dig through their stuff, there's some wacky and incindery stuff in there such as "run clean electric trains asap, not cancerous diesel trains". Cancerous diesel trains? With a phrase like that, they've exposed themselves as being a bunch of nutjobs, and shouldn't be taken seriously.
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Once they get electric trains they will complain about the EMF fields. It will never stop.

I still think that we should have the electicity plants near their actual use. Reduce the amount lost during transmission which will reduce the amount of harmful natural gas. An ideal spot would be right in Weston. Or even better have a waste-to-power facility there.
 
muller877 said:
Once they get electric trains they will complain about the EMF fields. It will never stop.

I still think that we should have the electicity plants near their actual use. Reduce the amount lost during transmission which will reduce the amount of harmful natural gas. An ideal spot would be right in Weston. Or even better have a waste-to-power facility there.
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Now that's an idea I could get behind. The NIMBYs would have none of it though.
 
muller877 said:
Once they get electric trains they will complain about the EMF fields. It will never stop.

I still think that we should have the electicity plants near their actual use. Reduce the amount lost during transmission which will reduce the amount of harmful natural gas. An ideal spot would be right in Weston. Or even better have a waste-to-power facility there.
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It wouldn't surprise me one bit if Metrolinx bought power from Pearson as a bit of a service trade (Pearson and Air Canada use railway line for shipping jet fuel; part of that is probably Metrolinx owned now).
 
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crs1026 said:
My real concern is with statement C. The current build leaves GO with only the third track. I found a slide deck in my files from last year (sorry, don't have a link, but it was from a community consultation session for the Bloor station) which has the fourth track labelled as 'Potential - 2031'. I'm beating a dead horse, but I don't see clarity on what has been contracted to date and whether it is truly on the books. It appears that the original project scope was four tracks, and certainly some parts have been built to that vision. But others clearly have gaps and corners cut, including the 4th track east of Jane St, and the tunnel under the 401. My cynical theory is thAt when costs mounted - the groundwater surprises and the CTC order that slowed pile driving at the Junction being the most likely suspects - scope was quietly cut and history rewritten about the project deliverables. Even if I'm off base here, I don't think you can say the UPX project has helped GO much, except perhaps west of the new Pearson Jct. I'm dubious that operationally, GO movements can be interleaved with UPX on a 15 minute headway. You will see two tracks dedicated to UPX, and GO left holding the bag.
- Paul
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Other than the 401 (which I was told by the GTS team that was being delayed because they are still trying to engineer a solution), its my understanding the 4th track is being built along the whole corridor. Maybe drum would like to chime in?
 
As long as we get GO RER on the corridor, we're almost good to go for airport trips on a GO fare. You could probably walk from Milton GO to Pearson. But if we just rebuild the LINK train to expand to Milton GO then that would be perfect. I wonder if they extended it that way, would we need to change the name of Milton GO to Pearson GO? (Yes I wonder about such things).
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
As long as we get GO RER on the corridor, we're almost good to go for airport trips on a GO fare. You could probably walk from Milton GO to Pearson. But if we just rebuild the LINK train to expand to Milton GO then that would be perfect. I wonder if they extended it that way, would we need to change the name of Milton GO to Pearson GO? (Yes I wonder about such things).
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It is a 6 hour walk from Milton GO station to Pearson.

On the other hand, it is a 45 minute walk from Malton GO station to Pearson. Still a long walk but I'm sure this is what you were referring to.

The Malton GO station is 4.8 km to Terminal 3.. quite a long way for a LINK train to go.
 
TOareaFan said:
http://www.ourunionpearson.ca/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Take_action:_say_no_to_paying_$20_to_$30_to_ride_the_new_Union-Pearson_train_
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I don't support. Why does all transit need to serve local travel and be single fare level. By that logic we should be tear Go a new one for serving long distance travel, and TTC's express routes for charging more than a standard fare.
 
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