B
bizorky
Guest
"You know urine your new home!"
Toronto Toronto City Hall and Nathan Phillips Square | ?m | ?s | City of Toronto | Perkins&Will
"You know urine your new home!"
I
interchange42
Guest
Plant.
decisive 42
decisive 42
B
Bogtrotter
Guest
Are there any alternatives to these rather restrictive proposals?
I'm not staisfied with any of these particular suggestions.
I'm not staisfied with any of these particular suggestions.
B
building babel
Guest
NPS redesign competition
allabootmatt mused earlier about the whereabouts of Big Name architects in all of this, mentioning KPMB and a few others. My mole at that firm informs me they entered the competition.
Perhaps one day we'll see images of all the entries. It would be interesting to compare them - especially since there is a visual record of all the models for the original competition that Revell won.
allabootmatt mused earlier about the whereabouts of Big Name architects in all of this, mentioning KPMB and a few others. My mole at that firm informs me they entered the competition.
Perhaps one day we'll see images of all the entries. It would be interesting to compare them - especially since there is a visual record of all the models for the original competition that Revell won.
M
Mystery Man TO
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
A lot of big names (at least in Toronto circles) entered the competition and didn't make the short list. I'm actually glad there is no KPMB, Diamond, etc etc in this round.
A lot of big names (at least in Toronto circles) entered the competition and didn't make the short list. I'm actually glad there is no KPMB, Diamond, etc etc in this round.
B
building babel
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
Why? They always speak highly of you.
Why? They always speak highly of you.
A
adma
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
If even Rogers Marvel is "rather restrictive" by your standards, than the jurors factored you out of the equation virtually from the getgo. Sorry.
M
Mystery Man TO
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
The city seems little saturated in D&S and KPMB projects these days. For every Ballet School there's a Canada Life: they can miss just like everyone else.
The city seems little saturated in D&S and KPMB projects these days. For every Ballet School there's a Canada Life: they can miss just like everyone else.
A
AlvinofDiaspar
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
Lisa Rochon wading into the matter, from the Globe:
CITYSPACE: NATHAN PHILLIPS SQUARE
Square needs design edit
While most of the finalists pay tribute to the follies of the past, a New York plan bravely moves forward, writes LISA ROCHON
Nathan Phillips Square is one of those rare and momentous interruptions, a piece of poetry that saves us from the banality of the urban grid and commercial life. Larger than London's Trafalgar Square and roomy compared to New York's Bryant Park, the vast, nearly 5.3-hectare square that fronts Toronto's new City Hall was an act of audacity and courage. Its revitalization requires the same kind of brave, intuitive design.
Except for one, the schemes presented by the four finalists in the Nathan Phillips Square Design Competition -- the results to be announced on Thursday -- prefer not to dare, choosing to tread politely rather than acknowledge that time rolls on and, besides being older, we might be a little wiser about what makes a city work.
Take off the gloves and say it like it is: The original Viljo Revell design is a set piece from the 1960s, and a mostly gorgeous one at that, but it was crafted at a time when modern architects were earnestly flogging car-happy environments and promoting underground tunnels and aboveground walkways, ideas that have been proven since then to deaden street life. That postwar mindset guided the hand of Revell when he designed his entry, causing him to draw a precast walkway lifted one-storey around the perimeter of the square. Purists will argue that the walkway helps to define the square and frame views to the surrounding city. If you believe that, you must necessarily subscribe to the view that elevated highways and rail lines are exactly what help to connect cities to their waterfronts -- indeed, a bizarre piece of logic.
Revell's walkway obscures views to the glories of the Old City Hall, a sandstone marvel designed by E.J. Lennox in the style of Richardsonian Romanesque, and, to the west, the stately digs of Osgoode Hall. Only one team had the guts to mess with the premise of the elevated walkway, likely because Rogers Marvel Architects and Ken Smith landscape architects are New Yorkers. They have submitted a serious design authored with the clarity of free agents. Their scheme is imperfect -- they've failed to move the Peace Garden, an important but incongruous design plonked down during the 1980s that would be best relocated off the hard square. But by taking down a section of the walkway on the plaza's eastern edge they actually strengthen Revell's design, revealing the great moment when the prow of the library is thrust into the plaza alongside the ceremonial ramp.
Unafraid, they have revealed a design climax that is sadly obscured by the walkway. For this, Revell would surely thank them.
All of the schemes introduce greater amounts of greenery onto the plaza but, in the Rogers Marvel scheme, nature is allowed not only to cohabitate with the city, but it becomes a compelling destination. The Marvel team tucks a glass-walled skating pavilion under a hill or escarpment on the western edge of the plaza, so that visitors can wander up into a distinct area of trees and shrubs and discover even a warm fire. The west flank of the walkway has been taken down to allow nature to rise and flourish. And the New Yorkers, in joint venture with du Toit Allsopp Hillier Architects, have no interest in competing architecturally with Revell.
Other teams have dropped new buildings onto the plaza, but, with or without swoopy roofs, they end up looking trivial next to the great wallop that Revell originated. To give privilege to Revell's buildings and render new built interventions nearly invisible is the right decision. For this reason, new architecture on the western edge has been folded within the proposed landscape.
In contrast, the locals were unable to correct the fundamental flaws of Revell's scheme. To be sure, theirs are thoughtful and sustainable schemes full of greenery and recycled water and transparent glass pavilions. But the brave gestures have been avoided.
The walkways, in my mind, were one of Revell's mistakes -- call it a folly and blame it on the 1960s. The other is the ceremonial ramp in front of the city hall, an aesthetic joy but a flop in terms of its function. The ramp was originally designed for limousines to drive up to the second-storey podium level and unload passengers in top hats -- indicated in one of Revell's sketches. In an archival photograph taken during the opening of new City Hall in September, 1965, there are some cars parked on the podium and throngs of people gathered on the walkways. Around the same time, cars were encouraged to clog the piazzas of Spain and Italy, elevated highways were being built everywhere, from Los Angeles to Berlin and Toronto in between, and cities such as Edmonton and Calgary were being primed to fully embrace the wisdom of the aboveground Plus 15 walkway system to remove people from the streets.
Then-prime minister Pierre Trudeau travelled thus during the 1960s, says Peter Ortved, the competition's professional adviser, but the life of the ramp could not be sustained. It was difficult to see or be seen two storeys up on the podium -- the concrete balustrade providing the barrier -- and there was nowhere to go once you had taken the time to drive up there. Still, in its homage to Revell, Baird Sampson Neuert Architects has decided the ceremonial ramp should be greatly extended to swoop down off the podium roof toward the west, abandoning the lovely asymmetry of the existing single ramp, so that a new ramp can connect via a sharp left turn to proposed new landscaping.
Plant Architect Inc. indicates a desire to embellish and fawn over Revell's scheme, proposing that with the addition of light wells and wooden walkways, more people could be enticed to travel above the square, even though the walkways there have no destination. Besides, the people voted years ago with their feet -- they'd rather be moving about below on the plaza. Not surprisingly, all of the competitors have embraced the idea of greening the roof of the second-storey podium, one of the unfulfilled wishes of Revell, who died in 1964 of a heart attack before his Toronto monument was completed.The great strength of Revell's scheme lies both in the design restraint -- a hard-surface plaza animated by a single reflecting pool -- and, in contrast, the near-sensuous curve of its two curved towers of unequal height, which gather the saucer-shaped council chamber into its organic embrace. In this way, Revell establishes a link between landscape and architecture which is both visceral and cerebral, for the gut and the mind. Nowhere is there the wow factor which has become, regrettably, synonymous with the reinvention of cultural and civic spaces these days.
The scheme by Zeidler Partnership Architects, led by Tarek El-Khatib, attempts to thrust the square into a brave new world but with a gazillion light sources and light projections onto the square, as well as gardens defined as undulating ribbons. It travels well beyond what's required. The Rogers Marvel architects scheme with Ken Smith is the only one that contains a degree of suspense and thrill at realigning a square for the future. It's possible to feel the team grappling with the spirit of the place, digging into its bones, and getting to its essence and current successes. But the plaza has been junked up over the years with plastic litter bins, parked cars, and even the storage of propane-gas equipment. The time has come to renew the faith with one of North America's greatest civic spaces.
During their recent presentation to an overflow crowd at City Hall, Roger Marvel and Ken Smith made it clear that there is already good karma at Nathan Phillips Square. They indicated their interest in the "mystery and intrigue" of the plaza at night, the way it presents as a slightly dark presence in the city. "It's not about competing with the building," said Smith, one of the talents who collaborated years ago on the remarkable Village of Yorkville park. "But allowing the public space to breathe. And you need big masses of green. You need to think big to create a shift."
What is the role of the architect, anyway? Defender of an architect from the past or defender of the city, past, present and future? I say honour the work of the past and the brilliance of great minds, but not merely for the sake of hero worship. Some Toronto architects may well have found God with the Finnish architect Viljo Revell. To them, editing any of the original pieces of the square might risk breaking the sacraments of modern architecture. On the other hand, we live in an incomplete society. There will always be work to be done so that the city can live on.
_________________________________________________
I expected more from Rochon than this false analogy. The narrow walkways has more in common with a colannade than an expressway, and the latter is not designed to enclose a space.
AoD
Lisa Rochon wading into the matter, from the Globe:
CITYSPACE: NATHAN PHILLIPS SQUARE
Square needs design edit
While most of the finalists pay tribute to the follies of the past, a New York plan bravely moves forward, writes LISA ROCHON
Nathan Phillips Square is one of those rare and momentous interruptions, a piece of poetry that saves us from the banality of the urban grid and commercial life. Larger than London's Trafalgar Square and roomy compared to New York's Bryant Park, the vast, nearly 5.3-hectare square that fronts Toronto's new City Hall was an act of audacity and courage. Its revitalization requires the same kind of brave, intuitive design.
Except for one, the schemes presented by the four finalists in the Nathan Phillips Square Design Competition -- the results to be announced on Thursday -- prefer not to dare, choosing to tread politely rather than acknowledge that time rolls on and, besides being older, we might be a little wiser about what makes a city work.
Take off the gloves and say it like it is: The original Viljo Revell design is a set piece from the 1960s, and a mostly gorgeous one at that, but it was crafted at a time when modern architects were earnestly flogging car-happy environments and promoting underground tunnels and aboveground walkways, ideas that have been proven since then to deaden street life. That postwar mindset guided the hand of Revell when he designed his entry, causing him to draw a precast walkway lifted one-storey around the perimeter of the square. Purists will argue that the walkway helps to define the square and frame views to the surrounding city. If you believe that, you must necessarily subscribe to the view that elevated highways and rail lines are exactly what help to connect cities to their waterfronts -- indeed, a bizarre piece of logic.
Revell's walkway obscures views to the glories of the Old City Hall, a sandstone marvel designed by E.J. Lennox in the style of Richardsonian Romanesque, and, to the west, the stately digs of Osgoode Hall. Only one team had the guts to mess with the premise of the elevated walkway, likely because Rogers Marvel Architects and Ken Smith landscape architects are New Yorkers. They have submitted a serious design authored with the clarity of free agents. Their scheme is imperfect -- they've failed to move the Peace Garden, an important but incongruous design plonked down during the 1980s that would be best relocated off the hard square. But by taking down a section of the walkway on the plaza's eastern edge they actually strengthen Revell's design, revealing the great moment when the prow of the library is thrust into the plaza alongside the ceremonial ramp.
Unafraid, they have revealed a design climax that is sadly obscured by the walkway. For this, Revell would surely thank them.
All of the schemes introduce greater amounts of greenery onto the plaza but, in the Rogers Marvel scheme, nature is allowed not only to cohabitate with the city, but it becomes a compelling destination. The Marvel team tucks a glass-walled skating pavilion under a hill or escarpment on the western edge of the plaza, so that visitors can wander up into a distinct area of trees and shrubs and discover even a warm fire. The west flank of the walkway has been taken down to allow nature to rise and flourish. And the New Yorkers, in joint venture with du Toit Allsopp Hillier Architects, have no interest in competing architecturally with Revell.
Other teams have dropped new buildings onto the plaza, but, with or without swoopy roofs, they end up looking trivial next to the great wallop that Revell originated. To give privilege to Revell's buildings and render new built interventions nearly invisible is the right decision. For this reason, new architecture on the western edge has been folded within the proposed landscape.
In contrast, the locals were unable to correct the fundamental flaws of Revell's scheme. To be sure, theirs are thoughtful and sustainable schemes full of greenery and recycled water and transparent glass pavilions. But the brave gestures have been avoided.
The walkways, in my mind, were one of Revell's mistakes -- call it a folly and blame it on the 1960s. The other is the ceremonial ramp in front of the city hall, an aesthetic joy but a flop in terms of its function. The ramp was originally designed for limousines to drive up to the second-storey podium level and unload passengers in top hats -- indicated in one of Revell's sketches. In an archival photograph taken during the opening of new City Hall in September, 1965, there are some cars parked on the podium and throngs of people gathered on the walkways. Around the same time, cars were encouraged to clog the piazzas of Spain and Italy, elevated highways were being built everywhere, from Los Angeles to Berlin and Toronto in between, and cities such as Edmonton and Calgary were being primed to fully embrace the wisdom of the aboveground Plus 15 walkway system to remove people from the streets.
Then-prime minister Pierre Trudeau travelled thus during the 1960s, says Peter Ortved, the competition's professional adviser, but the life of the ramp could not be sustained. It was difficult to see or be seen two storeys up on the podium -- the concrete balustrade providing the barrier -- and there was nowhere to go once you had taken the time to drive up there. Still, in its homage to Revell, Baird Sampson Neuert Architects has decided the ceremonial ramp should be greatly extended to swoop down off the podium roof toward the west, abandoning the lovely asymmetry of the existing single ramp, so that a new ramp can connect via a sharp left turn to proposed new landscaping.
Plant Architect Inc. indicates a desire to embellish and fawn over Revell's scheme, proposing that with the addition of light wells and wooden walkways, more people could be enticed to travel above the square, even though the walkways there have no destination. Besides, the people voted years ago with their feet -- they'd rather be moving about below on the plaza. Not surprisingly, all of the competitors have embraced the idea of greening the roof of the second-storey podium, one of the unfulfilled wishes of Revell, who died in 1964 of a heart attack before his Toronto monument was completed.The great strength of Revell's scheme lies both in the design restraint -- a hard-surface plaza animated by a single reflecting pool -- and, in contrast, the near-sensuous curve of its two curved towers of unequal height, which gather the saucer-shaped council chamber into its organic embrace. In this way, Revell establishes a link between landscape and architecture which is both visceral and cerebral, for the gut and the mind. Nowhere is there the wow factor which has become, regrettably, synonymous with the reinvention of cultural and civic spaces these days.
The scheme by Zeidler Partnership Architects, led by Tarek El-Khatib, attempts to thrust the square into a brave new world but with a gazillion light sources and light projections onto the square, as well as gardens defined as undulating ribbons. It travels well beyond what's required. The Rogers Marvel architects scheme with Ken Smith is the only one that contains a degree of suspense and thrill at realigning a square for the future. It's possible to feel the team grappling with the spirit of the place, digging into its bones, and getting to its essence and current successes. But the plaza has been junked up over the years with plastic litter bins, parked cars, and even the storage of propane-gas equipment. The time has come to renew the faith with one of North America's greatest civic spaces.
During their recent presentation to an overflow crowd at City Hall, Roger Marvel and Ken Smith made it clear that there is already good karma at Nathan Phillips Square. They indicated their interest in the "mystery and intrigue" of the plaza at night, the way it presents as a slightly dark presence in the city. "It's not about competing with the building," said Smith, one of the talents who collaborated years ago on the remarkable Village of Yorkville park. "But allowing the public space to breathe. And you need big masses of green. You need to think big to create a shift."
What is the role of the architect, anyway? Defender of an architect from the past or defender of the city, past, present and future? I say honour the work of the past and the brilliance of great minds, but not merely for the sake of hero worship. Some Toronto architects may well have found God with the Finnish architect Viljo Revell. To them, editing any of the original pieces of the square might risk breaking the sacraments of modern architecture. On the other hand, we live in an incomplete society. There will always be work to be done so that the city can live on.
_________________________________________________
I expected more from Rochon than this false analogy. The narrow walkways has more in common with a colannade than an expressway, and the latter is not designed to enclose a space.
AoD
G
ganjavih
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
I don't mind keeping the walkways now that they're open and have a function, but man she's right, they do ruin the views from the square.
On the other hand, it's interesting to see the proposals' respect for the walkway. It's a bit unusual but somewhat comforting in a city where usually nothing is sacred. But how can they be made attractive?
I don't mind keeping the walkways now that they're open and have a function, but man she's right, they do ruin the views from the square.
On the other hand, it's interesting to see the proposals' respect for the walkway. It's a bit unusual but somewhat comforting in a city where usually nothing is sacred. But how can they be made attractive?
A
adma
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
Surely, this from Spacing Wire must count for something in this thread.
Surely, this from Spacing Wire must count for something in this thread.
A
AlvinofDiaspar
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
Interesting you should post that Ada...I meant adma.
AoD
Interesting you should post that Ada...I meant adma.
AoD
B
building babel
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
I missed the Endangered Species exhibition and book launch at Dominion Modern over the weekend - Solobak has an essay in it.
I missed the Endangered Species exhibition and book launch at Dominion Modern over the weekend - Solobak has an essay in it.
M
Mystery White Boy 66
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
Don't they chose the winner this week?
Don't they chose the winner this week?
B
Bogtrotter
Guest
Re: NPS redesign competition
It seems it will be. We've been provided four very limited proposals and we're expected to chose one and be happy with the result. What a sad display.
It seems it will be. We've been provided four very limited proposals and we're expected to chose one and be happy with the result. What a sad display.