Toronto Spadina Subway Extension Emergency Exits | ?m | 1s | TTC | IBI Group

The MTO doesn't check to see if you've had X amount of hours of highway driving to pass the final G test. You just have to wait the full 12 months, with an expectation that you have built up experience. I have a G licence though I don't own a car - I can borrow one often enough, and rent whenever.

And what happens if you ever find yourself in a job where a licence is required?
 
The MTO doesn't check to see if you've had X amount of hours of highway driving to pass the final G test. You just have to wait the full 12 months, with an expectation that you have built up experience. I have a G licence though I don't own a car - I can borrow one often enough, and rent whenever.

And what happens if you ever find yourself in a job where a licence is required?

They don't check, but you have to sign to verify (honour system?) that you have had X amount of hours of highway driving. I know because I just did it last year.
 
Honestly though, I had a friend that didn't have a driver's license and she'd have to carry her Passport on her all the time if she was planning on drinking at all. It's a hassle. It's easier for her because she has a big purse to throw it in, but I know personally that I'd go crazy trying to find places to put that booklet all the time.
Why doesn't she simply get one of those photo-ID cards that the LCBO issues to young people - http://www.lcbo.com/socialresponsibility/byidcard.shtml ... hmm, that seem to cost money now ... but only $20 - far cheaper than losing a passport.
 
Why doesn't she simply get one of those photo-ID cards that the LCBO issues to young people - http://www.lcbo.com/socialresponsibility/byidcard.shtml ... hmm, that seem to cost money now ... but only $20 - far cheaper than losing a passport.

Do all bars/pubs accept that as valid ID? If they aren't aware of its existence, they probably wouldn't accept it...

I don't keep in touch with the mentioned person anymore, but I'll keep in mind that something like that exists. Thanks.
 
Do all bars/pubs accept that as valid ID? If they aren't aware of its existence, they probably wouldn't accept it...

I don't keep in touch with the mentioned person anymore, but I'll keep in mind that something like that exists. Thanks.

they should except it. it's a legal form of ID to prove that you're of age.
 
It's LCBO-issued ID. I'd think that if an LCBO-licensed bar didn't accept it, they would be in violation of the terms of their licensing, and would be subject to penalties from LCBO.

And they do get training - presumably LCBO training covers LCBO IDs. I never had any problem using these ... though it has been a couple of decades and a few name changes of the ID!
 
Even if you don't drive, it's always worth having a license and staying in practice by renting a car every now and then.

As for Steve Munro's lack of driving experience, I was a passenger in a car long before I knew how to drive and I never understood the convenience and emotional connection of just being able to get up and go anywhere until I got my own car. He doesn't know that feeling, so when he says we should have slow LRT everywhere instead of a balance of LRT and subways and "density this" and "ridership that", he's saying that because he doesn't have the driving experience or emotional connection as a comparative reference point. When you're used to driving, you want to get there fast! You feel stupid taking something that doubles or triples your travel time.

The other point I wanted to make is about family. Once you have a wife and kids, you need a car, and the rationalization of leaving it behind and taking transit on certain trips seems counter-intuitive. He's never experienced that either. Once you have the car, you're going to use it almost all the time unless there's something almost as good (ie. a subway).
 
^We're getting OT so maybe we should start our own thread about owning cars, but I've always wondered what might happen once I have kids. I probably will buy one car for the family to use, but I still plan on doing commutes to work by public transit and I hope my kids get to school on their own, too (I walked, biked and took the bus to school from Kindergarten to Grade 13, and I expect my kids to do the same). Since cars are so damn expensive, I probably will only justify getting a Zipcar membership, or something like that. Anyway, if cars were only used for family trips or the once a week jaunt to the grocery store, we wouldn't have congestion problems. It's really the use of cars for weekday commute use that puts a strain on our system.
 
^We're getting OT so maybe we should start our own thread about owning cars, but I've always wondered what might happen once I have kids. I probably will buy one car for the family to use, but I still plan on doing commutes to work by public transit and I hope my kids get to school on their own, too (I walked, biked and took the bus to school from Kindergarten to Grade 13, and I expect my kids to do the same). Since cars are so damn expensive, I probably will only justify getting a Zipcar membership, or something like that. Anyway, if cars were only used for family trips or the once a week jaunt to the grocery store, we wouldn't have congestion problems. It's really the use of cars for weekday commute use that puts a strain on our system.

Agreed. I've always believed that if it is at all possible, people should use transit for their daily commutes, and then use cars as necessary for trips to the grocery store or visits to relatives, etc. The large percentage of people taking the highway downtown to get to work could easily just manage their time better and take transit. I used to bus/subway combo my entire commute from the northern edge of Markham to downtown Toronto at Front St and John St, and it was perfectly fine for me. And it guaranteed that I would have a consistent time to show up to work because I find that people who take the bus always catch the same scheduled buses, while people who drive always push their travel time to the limit, which makes them late often times.
 
Northern Markham to downtown Toronto by TTC? -- that would take 2 hours each way. No offense, but most drivers would say you were nuts.
 
Northern Markham to downtown Toronto by TTC? -- that would take 2 hours each way. No offense, but most drivers would say you were nuts.

To be honest, assuming we're comparing my trip to that of someone driving to Finch station and subwaying the rest of the trip, it only added about 15 minutes to the travel time. The key for me was to take the YRT to a major road like Yonge and take the Viva south to Finch. The YRT ride was approx 10-15 minutes, which is only about 5 minutes longer than it would take to get to Yonge by car, and the Viva trip southbound is faster than most people think.

Then you have to factor in the time it takes to walk from the parking lot to the actual subway, while the Viva drops you off right at the stairs. That cuts about 5 minutes.

It definitely requires the transit mindset, but that's only because people who drive tend to view taking the bus as "slow and for poor people". I'd normally say "better for me because it gives me a place to sit on the bus", but frankly the ridership on Viva Blue is intense.
 
Getting a seat on the subway at Finch is easier said than done, too...the only way to ensure you get one is to miss a train on purpose.
 
Getting a seat on the subway at Finch is easier said than done, too...the only way to ensure you get one is to miss a train on purpose.

Well during the morning rush the trains are set to depart every 2 minutes or so. For a full year I was able to hone my ability to get a seat on the subway no matter how packed, and by the end of my work term I almost always had a seat. =P But the actual point is that since the trains roll out and roll into the station as soon as signally possible (yeah I made "signally" up), it was very easy to get a seat without skipping a train. That is, until a delay occurred and both trains would fill to the brim and the crowd would be so intense that people wouldn't even make it down the stairs...
 
Everyone's having a cow over about 2km of subway north of York. This is the segment of subway that enabled all other major transit projects on the table to get funding...it will never at "at capacity" (nor should it or could it) but having a well-used segment along which you just might get a seat during rush hour and helping trigger a huge transit-oriented development and increase transit's share of overall trips in the NW just might be worth 'putting up with' if it means a bajillion dollars worth of additional lines. Of course, if it was closer to capacity (not that that is possible or remotely desirable for a terminus segment), you would all be complaining about how crowded it is.

It's a complete waste of money. There's absolutely nothing up there. I say this as a person who regularly drives to that neck of the woods and grew up in this area. The only stuff that IS up there is only accessible by car (imagine walking to Colossus to watch a movie from Jane and 7, or walking to Ikea even!).

Then there's the cost of it. I can't even imagine how much it's going to cost to tunnel under the 407.

Furthermore, not only is there nothing up there, there's a LOT of factories surrounding this area. Considering it's a major CN yard, those factories are not going anywhere soon because it's the optimal location for them. There's a LOT of better places to redevelop in Toronto before this area should be abandoned (all those old industrials west of Dufferin along the route of the subway extension for instance).

True there are some open fields that Vaughan is planning to make into the VCC, but there aren't even any solid plans yet, and so anything is at least 15-20 years down the road. Not only that, but even if all those empty fields were filled to the brim, there still wouldn't be that many people living there as I doubt Vaughan will opt for 50 story towers, but likely low-rise buildings instead. An even worse thing is that east of Jane is a giant creek, where you're not going to have any development on unless they pave over a creek, which I can't see happening. Beyond that are industrials right next to the CN yard.

Finally, there could be an argument about getting Woodbridge residents to use more transit instead of driving downtown, but then again, would those people really use the subway that much if there's no planned massive parking lot? Finch serves as a good place for Thornhill residents to get downtown because of the parking lot. Since Jane/Hwy 7 won't have a massive parking lot, Woodbridge residents with easy access to the 400 are much less likely to not drive and get dropped off there or take infrequent buses from their suburban locations.
 
It's a complete waste of money. There's absolutely nothing up there. I say this as a person who regularly drives to that neck of the woods and grew up in this area. The only stuff that IS up there is only accessible by car (imagine walking to Colossus to watch a movie from Jane and 7, or walking to Ikea even!).

As a person whose office overlooks the future terminus of the extension, I can say that there is more than "nothing up there". Do you think people drive up here because they want to view the scenery and be stuck in terrible traffic? Many people work in the area who live in Toronto and drive because the transit options are currently very limited, but can improve. The congestion is terrible, and it's pretty much all day. True, the area is currently auto-oriented, but that can change. I believe there will be a lot more buses coming feeding into the terminus, plus a ROW on 7. But why would anyone take the subway to go to Colossus? Regardless of the state of the pedestrian environment, it's still pretty far from Millway/7. Ikea will have shuttle buses.

Then there's the cost of it. I can't even imagine how much it's going to cost to tunnel under the 407.

Cost of tunneling under the 407 has already been determined and included in the overall cost. It is no different than tunneling under an empty field. The problem, that has been mentioned many times by others, is the fact that it will be tunneled in some places where cut-and-cover methods would be a lot more feasible.

Furthermore, not only is there nothing up there, there's a LOT of factories surrounding this area. Considering it's a major CN yard, those factories are not going anywhere soon because it's the optimal location for them. There's a LOT of better places to redevelop in Toronto before this area should be abandoned (all those old industrials west of Dufferin along the route of the subway extension for instance).

Downtown Toronto evolved from having major shipping yards along the waterfront. The CN yard is still a bit far away, but nonetheless the factories on either side of yard and along Creditstone can stay where they are for now. But other buildings along Jane can be redeveloped. Toromont is already leaving.

True there are some open fields that Vaughan is planning to make into the VCC, but there aren't even any solid plans yet, and so anything is at least 15-20 years down the road. Not only that, but even if all those empty fields were filled to the brim, there still wouldn't be that many people living there as I doubt Vaughan will opt for 50 story towers, but likely low-rise buildings instead. An even worse thing is that east of Jane is a giant creek, where you're not going to have any development on unless they pave over a creek, which I can't see happening. Beyond that are industrials right next to the CN yard.

Define "solid plans". Building permits, no, but there are a lot of plans in the works, such the Corporate Centre plans. Go tell the City of Vaughan Planning dept. that there are no plans and they will laugh you out the door. There are already approvals for 35-storey residential buildings at Creditstone so 50 storey buildings right at Jane is definitely plausible. There will be office buildings as well since the CC plans are for a major employment district as it's one of the Province's Urban Growth Centres, something that people always leave out in their arguments against the extension. Black Creek is not the Mississippi River. They could even engineer it be an open space area with walking trails and bike paths, or something like the Riverwalk in San Antonio.

Finally, there could be an argument about getting Woodbridge residents to use more transit instead of driving downtown, but then again, would those people really use the subway that much if there's no planned massive parking lot? Finch serves as a good place for Thornhill residents to get downtown because of the parking lot. Since Jane/Hwy 7 won't have a massive parking lot, Woodbridge residents with easy access to the 400 are much less likely to not drive and get dropped off there or take infrequent buses from their suburban locations.

For Woodbridge residents getting downtown, I think the proposed GO line to Bolton is ideal. If not, then improved bus service on 7 (such as the VIVA BRT ROW) can feed into the subway, or further east to a new potential GO station on Barrie Line, east of Keele. There's also going to be a 3,000+ space parking lot at Steeles West in the hydro corridor for those that want to drive to a subway station.

The extension is not just to get people downtown Toronto, but also for people who already commute north to Vaughan.
 

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