Toronto Queens Quay & Water's Edge Revitalization | ?m | ?s | Waterfront Toronto

[ADRM]

There was a bicycle blitz at Queen & Bay yesterday, for example. I often see police checking for full stops at Queen's Quay between Stadium Rd. & Bathurst (they should watch motorists there too). There are also, as smably mentions, regular blitzes regarding equipment. If you ride in the city, you'll see them.

If that's true, the police pursued a bicycle ticketing blitz on one of the worst days in the last calendar year for cyclist and pedestrian deaths/injuries. Which is, unfortunately, perhaps the saddest and most accurate commentary on this city's attitude towards transportation and safety.

 

[reaperexpress]

They've added bicycle symbols to the appropriate traffic lights. Of course it makes no difference. Cyclists are still blowing through reds. It's not a matter of comprehension, it's about entitlement.

I think it's an issue of the light being red even though there's no one coming from either direction.

The size and complexity of the Queens Quay intersections really emphasizes the inefficiency of the Ontario calculations for red light clearances. We calculate for the entire intersection being clear, which takes a really long time in these cases. In some other places such as the Netherlands, they calculate individual all-red times individually for each movement, since some parts of the intersection will become clear before others.

Additionally, most of the red light time for bicycles is actually only there because the bicycle signal copies the car signal, and pedestrians are crossing in front of cars. The number of vehicles crossing the bicycle path during the north-south green is generally minimal. The crossing between pedestrians and bicycles is actually not signalized, so there could be opportunities to provide more green time for bicycles by cutting the north south vehicle green down to reflect the low traffic volumes.

 

[TransitBart]

Sure - you see that - or right on red.

But with bikes, you see lights in the middle of the red cycle, and the bike just sails straight through, without even stopping.

I really can't recall seeing that with a car more than once or twice.

I think it's an issue of the light being red even though there's no one coming from either direction.

The size and complexity of the Queens Quay intersections really emphasizes the inefficiency of the Ontario calculations for red light clearances. We calculate for the entire intersection being clear, which takes a really long time in these cases. In some other places such as the Netherlands, they calculate individual all-red times individually for each movement, since some parts of the intersection will become clear before others.

Additionally, most of the red light time for bicycles is actually only there because the bicycle signal copies the car signal, and pedestrians are crossing in front of cars. The number of vehicles crossing the bicycle path during the north-south green is generally minimal. The crossing between pedestrians and bicycles is actually not signalized, so there could be opportunities to provide more green time for bicycles by cutting the north south vehicle green down to reflect the low traffic volumes.

This makes a lot of sense. My rolling through a stop on my bike is totally fuelled by the ridiculously long reds.

 

[LNahid2000]

Alone this evening, I made three right turns at red lights and in all three cases there was a pedestrian or crowd at the light. Not once did anyone check over their left shoulder before they marched off the sidewalk. I won't even mention the number of people wearing two ear buds.

Lol I didn't realize pedestrians were responsible for shoulder checking for motorists making right turns on red (though I do always shoulder check). Most motorists seem to think it's their god given right to turn right on red before coming to a full stop and checking for other traffic.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Why bicyclists tend to ignore signal lights:

 

[Kitsune]

1:25 wait? The wait is near 4 minutes when crossing QQ at the fire station.

 

[reaperexpress]

1:25 wait? The wait is near 4 minutes when crossing QQ at the fire station.

The cycle at Queen's Quay & Fire/EMS is 120 seconds long, so if the detectors are working properly the maximum possible wait is 126 seconds (2:06). That said, I have experienced 4 minute waits there too, as the fancy new optical detectors failed to detect not only me on a bike, but also a car waiting correctly on the other side. After those 4 minutes, the car driver gave up and drove through the red light, and I certainly don't blame them.

And I have photos to prove it! I started taking pictures when I realized we hadn't been detected. The driver's license plate is blacked out to protect their identity.

This was shortly after the street's opening, I assume the detectors have been adjusted since then.

 

[rbt]

In some other places such as the Netherlands, they calculate individual all-red times individually for each movement, since some parts of the intersection will become clear before others.

They also have far shorter pedestrian crossing times. They seem to be timed for a healthy adult; Ontario lights are timed for someone with mobility issues. That has a huge impact on green time.

 

[smuncky]

Crazy how they all those pedestrians and cyclists just interact w/o any lines on the paving.

https://twitter.com/Hackneycyclist/status/750436166537805824

 

[reaperexpress]

They also have far shorter pedestrian crossing times. They seem to be timed for a healthy adult; Ontario lights are timed for someone with mobility issues. That has a huge impact on green time.

Very true. In addition, they commonly use two-stage crossings at low-volume intersections staggered to make a sort of "green wave" for the pedestrian, which also cuts down red time for other users. But that obviously wouldn't work somewhere with as much pedestrian traffic as Queens Quay.

 

[MetroMan]

Why bicyclists tend to ignore signal lights:

You mean the jackasses who pretend they're pedestrians when it's convenient to them, riding their bikes on pedestrian infrastructure? If you want to use the crosswalks and sidewalks, get off your bike and become a pedestrian.

Until cyclists in this city can demonstrate that they're capable of following the rules of the road, they haven't earned the right to ride on our roads and have their own dedicated infrastructure.

After having experienced several near misses this week alone, and watching the total disregard for the rules from not just some cyclists but a vast majority of them riding on Queens Quay, I've officially lost all patience for this group.

While licensing cyclists is a non starter that we've already gone through before, I'm in favour of registering all bikes that ride on roads and bike lanes. Have an RFID tag with a unique identifier for each bike and then install RFID readers on problem intersections recording bikes that run reds. When cyclists start getting fines in the mail, perhaps the culture in this city will begin to change.

 

[W. K. Lis]

If the signals are not changing, wouldn't you transform yourself from a "cyclist" to a "pedestrian" to press the pedestrian signal button?

 

[MetroMan]

If the signals are not changing, wouldn't you transform yourself from a "cyclist" to a "pedestrian" to press the pedestrian signal button?

Yes, yes I would. I'd get off my bike, walk where I needed to walk and then get back on the bike where I'm allowed to ride. Swerving in and out of pedestrian infrastructure without actually dismounting is one of the hallmarks of the entitlement that's become more than apparent with many cyclists in this city. Just because a cyclist isn't in an enclosed vehicle doesn't mean that they're a pedestrian. They're still a vehicle. Vehicles aren't allowed on pedestrian sidewalks and crosswalks.

 

[MetroMan]

Yesterday, I was walking on Beverly, I pressed the button to cross the street at a signalled crossover. A couple of cars came to a stop and I began crossing. I had seen a cyclist further down and assumed she had slowed or stopped but she was hidden by the hydro pole. No, she actually sped up and blew right through the crosswalk, zooming by in front of my nose as I began crossing. I told her "You're supposed to stop!" She didn't even look.

That's the kind of entitlement that has had me lose all respect and support for the cycling lobby in this city. Until people can demonstrate that they're mature enough to be responsible vehicle operators, they don't deserve the investment and infrastructure.

 

[LNahid2000]

Yesterday, I was walking on Beverly, I pressed the button to cross the street at a signalled crossover. A couple of cars came to a stop and I began crossing. I had seen a cyclist further down and assumed she had slowed or stopped but she was hidden by the hydro pole. No, she actually sped up and blew right through the crosswalk, zooming by in front of my nose as I began crossing. I told her "You're supposed to stop!" She didn't even look.

That's the kind of entitlement that has had me lose all respect and support for the cycling lobby in this city. Until people can demonstrate that they're mature enough to be responsible vehicle operators, they don't deserve the investment and infrastructure.

You can't just paint all cyclists with the same brush because you saw some who didn't obey the law. Some motorists also break the law all the time, so I guess they don't deserve any investment and infrastructure either based on your logic.