Toronto declared ‘sanctuary city’ to non-status migrants

[Peepers]

There was a recent article in Toronto Life about the large number of Irish construction workers in Toronto on temporary work permits. Many of these people would like to remain here, but the process to extend their work permits (or immigrate) are not so easy.

The Celtic Invasion: why the arrival of hundreds of Irish construction workers benefits Toronto's building boom

This is what I don't understand about our immigration system. Why should it be so difficult for these Irish lads to get permanent residency? They have skills that are in high demand. They speak English perfectly and were educated in a system that is as good - or probably better than ours. In short they are the perfect immigrant and yet it is difficult for them to get landed immigrants status?

Meanwhile Canada grants permanent residency to 10,000's of family class immigrants which include the sick and aging parents and grandparents of landed immigrants, i.e. many people who will never contribute anything to Canada and yet receive FREE healthcare within a few months of arrival and old-age security after 10 years in Canada (despite never paying into the system).

To put this into perspective - last year Canada accepted 36,000 skilled worker class immigrants (like these Irish lads) versus 15,000 sick and aging Parents & Grandparents.

It is insane for Canada to be granting permanent residency to so many people who will be nothing but a burden on our Healthcare system till the day they die and yet every political party in this country supports this because they are afraid of loosing votes.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/statistics/facts2011-preliminary/01.asp

 

[TOperson]

This is what I don't understand about our immigration system. Why should it be so difficult for these Irish lads to get permanent residency? They have skills that are in high demand. They speak English perfectly and were educated in a system that is as good - or probably better than ours. In short they are the perfect immigrant and yet it is difficult for them to get landed immigrants status?

Meanwhile Canada grants permanent residency to 10,000's of family class immigrants which include the sick and aging parents and grandparents of landed immigrants, i.e. many people who will never contribute anything to Canada and yet receive FREE healthcare within a few months of arrival and old-age security after 10 years in Canada (despite never paying into the system).

To put this into perspective - last year Canada accepted 36,000 skilled worker class immigrants (like these Irish lads) versus 15,000 sick and aging Parents & Grandparents.

It is insane for Canada to be granting permanent residency to so many people who will be nothing but a burden on our Healthcare system till the day they die and yet every political party in this country supports this because they are afraid of loosing votes.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/statistics/facts2011-preliminary/01.asp

I think you can't get one without the other. I.e. part of why skilled immigrants come here is so that they can bring their family members over later. It makes sense - it can't be easy knowing your parents/grandparents are getting on, need care, and you are not there to look out for them, and services in the home country may be inadequate or non-existent. If we were to disallow the family class immigrants we might not get the skilled immigrants we want. No easy solution to that one.

 

[Jaye101]

I'm surprised by how many of you are against this. Council did the right thing.

 

[Peepers]

I think you can't get one without the other. I.e. part of why skilled immigrants come here is so that they can bring their family members over later. It makes sense - it can't be easy knowing your parents/grandparents are getting on, need care, and you are not there to look out for them, and services in the home country may be inadequate or non-existent. If we were to disallow the family class immigrants we might not get the skilled immigrants we want. No easy solution to that one.

I am sure you can get one without the other. No other country that I know of allows sick and aging parents to immigrate and receive free healthcare and social security benefits (although it would not surprise me to learn that the UK and the other European countries that are currently going down the drain offer these generous freebies).

In the United States - for instance - a green-card holder 65 and older would have had to pay Medicare taxes for ten years before being eligible for Medicare. Likewise they would not be entitled to any social security benefits if they had not paid into the system. If they are not eligible for Medicare they have to obtain private health insurance which at age 65 and over costs a small fortune ($1,500-$2,000 a MONTH for a couple age 65+) . There are no free rides down there and there shouldn't be any here!

 

[urbandreamer]

Maybe this is a "conspiracy" to protect the housing market from collapsing? 200,000 illegals gotta live somewhere....rental condos perhaps?

Peepers: Read the Daily Mail etc. Same thing happening in London etc.

 

[Peepers]

Maybe this is a "conspiracy" to protect the housing market from collapsing? 200,000 illegals gotta live somewhere....rental condos perhaps?

Peepers: Read the Daily Mail etc. Same thing happening in London etc.

I do. Yes I know, it's a real mess over there.

 

[nfitz]

There are no free rides down there and there shouldn't be any here!

Basic health care is a human right, not a free ride.

Go to Europe ... even tourists get free health care in some countries. There's no mechanism in place to start charging people. The world doesn't end.

It's like all these BS photo health cards the NDP brought in ... and implementation ground to a halt after the auditor general pointed out that the cost of the program exceeded the estimate of health care fraud!

What a terrible thing it would be for a refugee to take out a library book.!

 

[TOperson]

I am sure you can get one without the other. No other country that I know of allows sick and aging parents to immigrate and receive free healthcare and social security benefits (although it would not surprise me to learn that the UK and the other European countries that are currently going down the drain offer these generous freebies).

In the United States - for instance - a green-card holder 65 and older would have had to pay Medicare taxes for ten years before being eligible for Medicare. Likewise they would not be entitled to any social security benefits if they had not paid into the system. If they are not eligible for Medicare they have to obtain private health insurance which at age 65 and over costs a small fortune ($1,500-$2,000 a MONTH for a couple age 65+) . There are no free rides down there and there shouldn't be any here!

I'm pretty sure Australia does, since it is another country with a big immigration program. It doesn't seem to have hurt their economy at all!

Your comment assumes that skilled immigrants bring over their family members just for the "freebies" and not for emotional reasons. I guess you think leaving your parents and grandparents to get sick and die in a faraway place is no sweat? Is that really a condition we want to impose on skilled newcomers to Canada? You can't think of a reason why someone might not take that deal?

Skilled immigrants pay taxes too, and their labour contributes to our economic growth, and we don't pay the cost of training them since they come already skilled, so they and their families are not getting "free" ride.

As for Europe, the number of family class immigrants is just too low to account for the larger economic issues. I've been following discussions about the European economy and I've never heard anyone suggest that family class immigrants are a significant economic problem.

As for the USA, they have truly the WORST healthcare system of any developed country. Even Americans say that. So I don't see why anyone should follow their example.

I said upthread that the planet is going through the largest human migration in history right now. There are BIG economic, political, and ecological forces in play here. Fussing over who paid enough into the system to start taking from misses the big picture, badly.

 

[ChesterCopperpot]

They speak English perfectly and were educated in a system that is as good - or probably better than ours.

Yet we still have to do an English exam that costs $300

 

[uptown]

This only goes to show city council is truly out of touch. We keep hearing how all tiers of government are cash-starved but there's enough money in the cookie jar to provide services to people who are here without legal status? If anything the city should be pledging to help the federal government identify and deport residents without status. This is a slap in the face to every immigrant who played by CIC's rules and patiently waited.

 

[nfitz]

We keep hearing how all tiers of government are cash-starved but there's enough money in the cookie jar to provide services to people who are here without legal status?

Surely it's cheaper to give all city residents library cards without having to put a system in place to confirm the citizenship status.

And if you were, how do you deal with the portion of city taxes they pay in their rent. Do you refund it?

These seems to be more an attempt to promote an extreme-right wing anti-immigrant agenda of Stephen Harper than it is an attempt to save the city money.

 

[SP!RE]

Peepers... you've gotta lay off watching so much evening news (a breeding ground for paranoia) or cut back on your newspaper-reading or something. Your paranoia and fear about this whole thing is going to cause you way more issues than this city hall decision ever will.

 

[datamouse]

These seems to be more an attempt to promote an extreme-right wing anti-immigrant agenda of Stephen Harper than it is an attempt to save the city money.

Oh please. Not supporting illegal immigration doesn't mean someone doesn't support legal immigration.

 

[nfitz]

Oh please. Not supporting illegal immigration doesn't mean someone doesn't support legal immigration.

Perhaps not, but one has to wonder when posters start trying to advocate that the city act prejudicially against city residents ... and then manipulate into a "cost" issue.

 

[Hipster Duck]

This is what I don't understand about our immigration system. Why should it be so difficult for these Irish lads to get permanent residency? They have skills that are in high demand. They speak English perfectly and were educated in a system that is as good - or probably better than ours. In short they are the perfect immigrant and yet it is difficult for them to get landed immigrants status?

Meanwhile Canada grants permanent residency to 10,000's of family class immigrants which include the sick and aging parents and grandparents of landed immigrants, i.e. many people who will never contribute anything to Canada and yet receive FREE healthcare within a few months of arrival and old-age security after 10 years in Canada (despite never paying into the system).

To put this into perspective - last year Canada accepted 36,000 skilled worker class immigrants (like these Irish lads) versus 15,000 sick and aging Parents & Grandparents.

It is insane for Canada to be granting permanent residency to so many people who will be nothing but a burden on our Healthcare system till the day they die and yet every political party in this country supports this because they are afraid of loosing votes.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/statistics/facts2011-preliminary/01.asp

From an economic standpoint, it makes total sense that an Irish worker with trades skills remains part of a revolving door system of temporary foreign workers with no recourse to permanent residency and benefits. They are skilled labourers, to be sure, but it's not like their skills are so specialized and remote that either their employer or the Canadian government should jump through hoops to secure permanent residency for them. Once an Irish plumber's visa expires, there are thousands of other plumbers from Ireland (or other countries) that would jump at a chance for a spot, and they can be easily found and hired.

If you're going to make an emotionless economic dollars-and-cents argument for why families of immigrants shouldn't be brought over (which is not based on any evidence), you should at least be consistent. From an emotionless economic dollars-and-cents POV, you should be perfectly comfortable with an Irish trades worker having no access to permanent residency.

It is clear that you judge immigrants of different countries differently. You care for the social and emotional well-being of Irish immigrants, but strictly the economic interests of Canada when it comes to immigrants of other countries. You have a double standard.