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Toronto, Capital of North America?

I heard LA is the shit. I wanna visit sometime.

West Los Angeles is quite livable. Don't believe those steorotypes. Sometimes I found LA haters extremely funny esp when they haven't live there ever.
A friend of mine attended UCLA for 4 years without owning a car. It is really not like what the rumor says. LA is also working hard to expand its public transit, esp subways.

LA is large, about twice the size of Toronto in land, and 1.5 times in population, and there are very nice and very bad areas. It is at least as diverse, cosmopolitan and vibrant as Toronto.
 
It's like all cities, it has good parts and not so good parts. It is definitely worth a visit. If you can, make your way up to San Francisco to compare.

West Los Angeles is quite livable. Don't believe those steorotypes. Sometimes I found LA haters extremely funny esp when they haven't live there ever.
A friend of mine attended UCLA for 4 years without owning a car. It is really not like what the rumor says. LA is also working hard to expand its public transit, esp subways.

LA is large, about twice the size of Toronto in land, and 1.5 times in population, and there are very nice and very bad areas. It is at least as diverse, cosmopolitan and vibrant as Toronto.

Definately going down now. Just gotta convince my sister ;)


LA-Rail-Map11.jpg


This is what LA is doing for transit too. Wow.
 
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Definately going down now. Just gotta convince my sister ;)

I had an interview with a consulting company a few years ago. One of the partners was wearing flip flops at work that day. You are gonna love that!
LA despite its bad rep, is an affordable and nice place to live. Making $50K in LA is like $70K+ in Toronto. You can buy a decent condo in Beverly Hills or Westwood for $300-500/sf, which is a lot cheaper than anywhere near central Toronto. Auto insurance is like $80 a month.
 
I had an interview with a consulting company a few years ago. One of the partners was wearing flip flops at work that day. You are gonna love that!
LA despite its bad rep, is an affordable and nice place to live. Making $50K in LA is like $70K+ in Toronto. You can buy a decent condo in Beverly Hills or Westwood for $300-500/sf, which is a lot cheaper than anywhere near central Toronto. Auto insurance is like $80 a month.


But they won't scrape you off the road if you get hit by a car and then patch you up "no questions asked" like they will here in Toronto...
 
Where in Toronto can you find a 1 bedroom condo for under 50,000 dollars? (Regent Park or Jane/Finch? NOPE!)

I think what a lot of you guys are failing to realize is the great differences in prices, in a place like Chicago. Where in Toronto can you find a condo for under 50k or a 3 bedroom house for that price? You can find that in South Chicago. You can also find condos for 30 million, in Central Chicago. What section of town you live in has a much bigger impact on prices, than in Toronto. The poor areas in Chicago, are not just a 3 block area, like some parts of Toronto, they can go for miles in South or West Chicago. This has to have a big effect in the average price of real estate. If you took off the top 10% and the bottom 10% in both cities, I'm sure Toronto and Chicago would be much closer in price. In Toronto, it doesn't matter if you're in the east, west, north of south, you are NOT going to get any great deals in real estate, the way you do in American cities. (even NYC) Even in NYC, if you live in the Bronx, you can find very inexpensive places to live. You can't even find that in Jane/Finch, so in some ways, Americans have way more diverse options than we have.
 
I had an interview with a consulting company a few years ago. One of the partners was wearing flip flops at work that day. You are gonna love that!
LA despite its bad rep, is an affordable and nice place to live. Making $50K in LA is like $70K+ in Toronto. You can buy a decent condo in Beverly Hills or Westwood for $300-500/sf, which is a lot cheaper than anywhere near central Toronto. Auto insurance is like $80 a month.
Definately. And even places like Mid Wilshire, San Pedro are looking up as well. 250k can get you something nice. And the beaches....
But they won't scrape you off the road if you get hit by a car and then patch you up "no questions asked" like they will here in Toronto...

Blue Shield of California.
 
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LA isn't anything like Toronto. its a big sprawling place with many wonderful sites to visit. From my experience, a car is a necessity to fully enjoy the area.
 
The North American continent appears to be entering a twilight of cities past anything Jane Jacobs could have foreseen. I don't see any reason to think that Detroit, Cleveland, Buffalo, Indianapolis, Milwaukee, Minneapolis, St. Louis, Kansas City, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Memphis, New Orleans, Montreal or any of a hundred smaller American and Canadian cities will do anything other than fall further and further into complete decay; centers such as Boston, Portland and San Francisco are barely holding steady numbers; New York and Los Angeles face the challenges of decaying infrastructure and growing social disorder; cities in Mexico are arguably in even worse shape; and most Canadian and American cities with healthy growth are dependent on commodities economies (Houston, Calgary).

Is Toronto, with diverse economic growth, social stability and riding an even-handed development wave, positioned to become the alpha city for the whole continent? (Before we get the chorus that New York is bigger, let me remind you that Sao Paulo is bigger than New York and no one, not even the Brazilians, would posit that it is more important for that reason alone.)

Yes, the above is hyperbole to an extent. But it may be less and less so if the global economy goes into another slump.

Toronto's done very well the past few decades largely due to very strong banks and a humungous influx of migrants and their money. Both of these can change and then we're kinda #*$&ed. Sure, we'll still have all the institutions and cultural/media jobs, but they won't be enough to save the city should the first two things go south.

Some of the cities you mentioned are bizarrely grouped. Do you really think places like Minneapolis or Indianapolis are in the same festering league as Buffalo or New Orleans? Numbers say otherwise. And Toronto faces no infrastructural challenges?

What's more impressive is that half of that growth is within the old city of Toronto, which shows how much of an impact the condo boom is having. Hopefully the trend continues.

What's even more impressive is that the old city of Toronto's population was totally flat from 2001 to 2006 (and if memory servies, I think it even lost a few thousand people) despite the beginning of the condo boom. New construction is one thing, but demographic change in existing housing can do just as much to change growth rates. I haven't seen census tract details yet, but I suspect the Parkdale/Riverdale areas stopped bleeding ~1% of their population per year like they had been for a while (gentrification, etc.), and this went along with the condos.
 
I had an interview with a consulting company a few years ago. One of the partners was wearing flip flops at work that day. You are gonna love that!
LA despite its bad rep, is an affordable and nice place to live. Making $50K in LA is like $70K+ in Toronto. You can buy a decent condo in Beverly Hills or Westwood for $300-500/sf, which is a lot cheaper than anywhere near central Toronto. Auto insurance is like $80 a month.

And the housing crash in the US has nothing to do with this? Do you understand the housing situation in the US today? Do you understand the financial situation of the entire state of California? Anyone who is comparing housing values between Canada and the US today has either been living in a box or is completely insane.
And for your information, 2 bedroom condos under 200K do exist in Toronto and even though i wouldn't want to live in those neighborhoods they are still far superior to Chicago's shady neighborhoods. There's a reason those condos in Chicago are selling for less then 100K and take that into consideration next time you start comparing housing situations.

Btw........Chicago had 425 homicides in 2011 and Toronto had 47. Take a good look at those numbers. Study them long and hard.
 
And the housing crash in the US has nothing to do with this? Do you understand the housing situation in the US today? Do you understand the financial situation of the entire state of California? Anyone who is comparing housing values between Canada and the US today has either been living in a box or is completely insane.
And for your information, 2 bedroom condos under 200K do exist in Toronto and even though i wouldn't want to live in those neighborhoods they are still far superior to Chicago's shady neighborhoods. There's a reason those condos in Chicago are selling for less then 100K and take that into consideration next time you start comparing housing situations.

Btw........Chicago had 425 homicides in 2011 and Toronto had 47. Take a good look at those numbers. Study them long and hard.

Of course someone had to bring up the murders. Edmonton also had more murders than Toronto. NYC had the same amount as Chicago. That's not what were talking about here, in fact that's type of "quality of life" argument that is brought up here on the regular. No one is going to live in the dangerous areas. In the Loop sub 100k condos do exist. The Loop is not anymore Dangerous than downtown Toronto.

As for the housing crash LA was not as affected as Moreno Valley, Corona or Fontana (Inland Empire Suburbs.)
 
And the housing crash in the US has nothing to do with this? Do you understand the housing situation in the US today? Do you understand the financial situation of the entire state of California? Anyone who is comparing housing values between Canada and the US today has either been living in a box or is completely insane.
And for your information, 2 bedroom condos under 200K do exist in Toronto and even though i wouldn't want to live in those neighborhoods they are still far superior to Chicago's shady neighborhoods. There's a reason those condos in Chicago are selling for less then 100K and take that into consideration next time you start comparing housing situations.

Btw........Chicago had 425 homicides in 2011 and Toronto had 47. Take a good look at those numbers. Study them long and hard.

the $250K condo I mention are in Chicago's upscale neighbourhood, as I have emphasized, which would cost $450K in a comparable area in Toronto. Chicago's near north side has significantly lower crime rate than the entire city in general and can be considered safe in general. So let's stop using the crime stats to make Chicago look like a crime ridden dump nobody wants to live in. There are good areas and bad areas. Even the nice neighbourhoods in Chicago is significantly cheaper than Toronto.

California's problem stems from many factors, a lot to do high tax and heavy entitlement payments. However, let's not pretend or imagine the California nowadays is nothing worth respect. It is still one the world's largest economy - larger than entire Canada, and have many many successful and competitive companies we don't have here. They may be in trouble right now, but who isn't? It is just a matter of degree. Ontario is not exactly a shining start in terms of growth and competitiveness. LA and SF areas are still a lot more attractive and offer way more opportunities than the Golden Horseshoe. Ask anyone non-Canadian, and I am sure the answer should be the same. Let's not get ahead of ourselves with all this pride and prejudice. During the past 2 years, three of my close friends left Toronto heading for the US because they got better jobs, one to nowhere other than Los Angeles. People are still going, no matter how incredible you find it is.

In sum, Canadian cities are more expensive not because they are "better" or more desirable, but because of country differences (banks, mortgage policy, tax etc).
 
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Of course someone had to bring up the murders. Edmonton also had more murders than Toronto. NYC had the same amount as Chicago. That's not what were talking about here, in fact that's type of "quality of life" argument that is brought up here on the regular. No one is going to live in the dangerous areas. In the Loop sub 100k condos do exist. The Loop is not anymore Dangerous than downtown Toronto.

As for the housing crash LA was not as affected as Moreno Valley, Corona or Fontana (Inland Empire Suburbs.)

Say what??? Of course LA was hit by the housing crash. The city and it's suurbs. And they were hit hard.
 
the $250K condo I mention are in Chicago's upscale neighbourhood, as I have emphasized, which would cost $450K in a comparable area in Toronto. Chicago's near north side has significantly lower crime rate than the entire city in general and can be considered safe in general. So let's stop using the crime stats to make Chicago look like a crime ridden dump nobody wants to live in. There are good areas and bad areas. Even the nice neighbourhoods in Chicago is significantly cheaper than Toronto.

And again you are indicating your lack of knowledge regarding the housing bubble in the US. What do you expect people who are desperate to sell due to a life changing event to do. They have to compete with foreclosures. No one is selling their house in the US now because they want to cash in (minus Manhattan, that's a whole different animal). I just bought an investment property in downtown Miami for 1/5th what the previous owner paid in 2003. I've studied the US housing industry long and hard over the last 2 years as i've just purchased 3 properties there. My best friend who moved there pre-crisis just bought a townhome in San Diego in a neighborhood that used to demand almost 1million as an entry price. They paid barely over 400K. The housing market in the US is a buyers dream, if you have cash that is.
If one condo down the block is being foreclosed at 200K you think anyone will even look at your condo if you put it on the market for 400K. The only neighborhoods surving the crash are the high end posh way above 1million.
 

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