Toronto 2024 Olympic Bid (Dead)

[TheTigerMaster]

if by celebrities you mean "english speaking celebrities".
Do celebrities from India (bollywood), Hong Kong (huge movie market), Japan, South Korea all live in LA? Only countries like Canada does that.

Obviously I was speaking of English speaking nations.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Just in Riverdale, one of the BNL, Gord Downie, the drummer from Triumph -- and, non-musical, Rick Mercer, Rick Robert. The singer from one of those pop-punk bands, the guy who was married to Avril Lavigne. For a long time, Diana Leblanc.

I think the problem y'all are having in defining 'Canadian culture' is that all y'all are Neanderthals. ;-)

Think Martha Henry, Robert Lepage, Cirque de Soleil, Michel Tremblay, Daniel MacIvor, the Tarragon, W.O. Mitchell, A Prairie Boy's Winter, The Hockey Sweater, sugar pie. There's tons of Canadian culture and Canada is unique in the world (as is the US or France or Hong Kong.)

My problem is people limit Canadian culture to be and hockey. I honestly still don't feel there is a clear definition, having written several essays on the issue and its arguments.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

if by celebrities you mean "english speaking celebrities".
Do celebrities from India (bollywood), Hong Kong (huge movie market), Japan, South Korea all live in LA? Only countries like Canada does that.

In fact a lot of the Brits still stay home after making the A List in America/Worldwide. Colin Firth and Guy Richie for example.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

No, you are wrong. I am sure the French, Spanish and Italians have their own popular culture not completely dominated by Hollywood at all. Even Quebec has produced many local talents that actually stayed in Quebec. Many of the American TV shows are actually made after the British one, which means the UK has a strong local culture too. Can you name any American shows produced after a Canadian one? We have Canadian Idol, so you think you can dance -Canada, Canada got talent etc instead.

You must have missed the second word in my message. "Most ENGLISH SPEAKING countries"

And No, I don't need to be a proud Canadian citizen to live in Canada. My life is fine here and I intend to stay for a while. I just don't happen to feel proud to become a Canadian citizen at all, but who says you need to feel proud of the place you live in? If there is an opportunity elsewhere that I consider is better, I won't hsitate to leave though.

I am extraordinarily disappointed to hear this. This country is amazing and I hope that in time you will come to love it. Lack of pride only weakens this country. Hopefully your kids (if you will have any) will be proud of their new nation. The good news is that in my personal experience, children of immigrants tend to be much prouder of Canada then even Canadians that have been here for generations.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

My problem is people limit Canadian culture to be and hockey. I honestly still don't feel there is a clear definition, having written several essays on the issue and its arguments.

Canadian culture is notoriously hard to define (I've tried on several occasions to do this) but that does not mean that it does not exist. I would be interested to see if visitors from other countries can better define Canada's culture. I suspect that defining culture may be somewhat similar to accents. People who have accents generally don't realize that they have accents because its just the way they speak, but others can notice it very easily. Canadians may have a hard time defining our culture because we just view it as the way we live while an outsider may be able to define it easier.

Anyways, I've spoken to many of my American friends and they've said that Canadian culture is definitely different then American culture. Since Canada isn't just emulating American culture there is little doubt in my mind that Canada does have a unique and distinct culture. The trouble is figuring out exactly what that unique culture is.

 

[kkgg7]

Canadian culture is notoriously hard to define (I've tried on several occasions to do this) but that does not mean that it does not exist. I would be interested to see if visitors from other countries can better define Canada's culture. I suspect that defining culture may be somewhat similar to accents. People who have accents generally don't realize that they have accents because its just the way they speak, but others can notice it very easily. Canadians may have a hard time defining our culture because we just view it as the way we live while an outsider may be able to define it easier.

Anyways, I've spoken to many of my American friends and they've said that Canadian culture is definitely different then American culture. Since Canada isn't just emulating American culture there is little doubt in my mind that Canada does have a unique and distinct culture. The trouble is figuring out exactly what that unique culture is.

hard to define because it has a little bit of everything and not so much of its own. US, UK, France, even Asia. Yes, I agree that Canadian culture is somewhat different from American culture, but the similarity is like 85%. There is difference but not enough to make it stand out, like the French are different from the Germans, or the Japanese different from the Chinese.

It is unsurprising because Canada had its own constitution completely independent from the UK only in 1982. Canadian citizenship didn't exist until 1947, and before that, it was essentially a part of Great Britain.

Is it because "we just view it as the way we live while an outsider may be able to define it easier"? good try but hardly. I am sure ask any Italian or Chinese, they will have no trouble telling all about what their country is about and how it is different from the rest of the world. And plus, most outsiders are NOT able to define it either, not just Canadians.

I know it is hard for Canadians to admit the fact that Canada does NOT possess a distinct culture and identity - it is still forming - and that people will keep arguing that it is a different culture due to the pride thing.

Many have said "American friends" telling them how Canadian culture is vastly different from American culture, as if it is solid evidence. I am sure they are just being polite and nice. Why would an American friend you are familiar rudely say "you guys have no culture and everything is basically borrowed from us"? It is like your friend will also say your kid is cute and smart. Why do they want to offend you any way? But as a Canadian, when you travel to or live in urban US, do you really experience some sort of "culture shock"? Seriously? I have lived a large city in both country, and I am confident to say the similarities (85%) completely overwhelms the differences (15%) when everything considered.

One way for Canada to develop its own culture is to stop relying on American culture so habitually every single day (of course stop speaking English would be the best efficient way but not possible), ranging from P&G consumer goods to what you watch and listen on the media. Second is to start considering the US as simply foreign country like the rest of the world (cut the umbilical cord). The US should not be the benchmark of everything we do, there is the rest of the world. There are many small-big neighbouring countries and I have never seem one dependent on the other like Canada does on the US.

The US has an influential culture, and being its small neighbour sharing the same language is a big misfortune culturally wise. If everything is business as usual, Canada will never be able to create its own culture, and the rest of the world will never recognize it.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

You must have missed the second word in my message. "Most ENGLISH SPEAKING countries"



I am extraordinarily disappointed to hear this. This country is amazing and I hope that in time you will come to love it. Lack of pride only weakens this country. Hopefully your kids (if you will have any) will be proud of their new nation. The good news is that in my personal experience, children of immigrants tend to be much prouder of Canada then even Canadians that have been here for generations.

TigerMaster you are a great poster. Just wanted to say this again. Some others would have started raging. Great and well thought out response.

 

[LordWanker]

I know it is hard for Canadians to admit the fact that Canada does NOT possess a distinct culture and identity - it is still forming - and that people will keep arguing that it is a different culture due to the pride thing.

Many have said "American friends" telling them how Canadian culture is vastly different from American culture, as if it is solid evidence. I am sure they are just being polite and nice. Why would an American friend you are familiar rudely say "you guys have no culture and everything is basically borrowed from us"? It is like your friend will also say your kid is cute and smart. Why do they want to offend you any way? But as a Canadian, when you travel to or live in urban US, do you really experience some sort of "culture shock"? Seriously? I have lived a large city in both country, and I am confident to say the similarities (85%) completely overwhelms the differences (15%) when everything considered.

Examples oh wizened one especially since your percentages are dubious? So which cities have you resided in where the differences between American and Canadian culture are negligible?

 

[TheTigerMaster]

hard to define because it has a little bit of everything and not so much of its own. US, UK, France, even Asia. Yes, I agree that Canadian culture is somewhat different from American culture, but the similarity is like 85%. There is difference but not enough to make it stand out, like the French are different from the Germans, or the Japanese different from the Chinese.

It is unsurprising because Canada had its own constitution completely independent from the UK only in 1982. Canadian citizenship didn't exist until 1947, and before that, it was essentially a part of Great Britain.

Is it because "we just view it as the way we live while an outsider may be able to define it easier"? good try but hardly. I am sure ask any Italian or Chinese, they will have no trouble telling all about what their country is about and how it is different from the rest of the world. And plus, most outsiders are NOT able to define it either, not just Canadians.

I know it is hard for Canadians to admit the fact that Canada does NOT possess a distinct culture and identity - it is still forming - and that people will keep arguing that it is a different culture due to the pride thing.

Many have said "American friends" telling them how Canadian culture is vastly different from American culture, as if it is solid evidence. I am sure they are just being polite and nice. Why would an American friend you are familiar rudely say "you guys have no culture and everything is basically borrowed from us"? It is like your friend will also say your kid is cute and smart. Why do they want to offend you any way? But as a Canadian, when you travel to or live in urban US, do you really experience some sort of "culture shock"? Seriously? I have lived a large city in both country, and I am confident to say the similarities (85%) completely overwhelms the differences (15%) when everything considered.

One way for Canada to develop its own culture is to stop relying on American culture so habitually every single day (of course stop speaking English would be the best efficient way but not possible), ranging from P&G consumer goods to what you watch and listen on the media. Second is to start considering the US as simply foreign country like the rest of the world (cut the umbilical cord). The US should not be the benchmark of everything we do, there is the rest of the world. There are many small-big neighbouring countries and I have never seem one dependent on the other like Canada does on the US.

The US has an influential culture, and being its small neighbour sharing the same language is a big misfortune culturally wise. If everything is business as usual, Canada will never be able to create its own culture, and the rest of the world will never recognize it.

I agree with 90% of what you said. I disagreed when you said that Canadian culture is 85% American. Though American influence is strong I don't think that our culture is anywhere close to being 85% influenced by the Americans. Anyways, the good news is that America's cultual influence is slowly degrading and I feel that Canada may be beginning to take its own direction.

On a political note, I am very encouraged by the Harper Governments (TM) policies to the United States. They are aggressively diversifying Canada's economy so that it is no longer as reliant on the Americans. That can only be good for us from an economic and cultural standpoint. However, I am very concerned by the dominance of American brands in Canada. I believe that an important step in creating culture is ensuring that Canadian brands dominate Canada. I am personally very disturbed when I see brands like Target, Wal-Mart, American Apparel, HBO and American Eagle operating in Canada. I think that the government needs to figure out how to prevent these popular brands from opening locations in Canada. Their presence only hurts Canada in the long run. Furthermore, I feel that the government needs to do more to prevent takeovers of Canadian companies; particularly by American and Chinese corporations. For the past few years we've been seeing several high profile takeover of Canadian companies and all that does is weaken Canada economically, culturally and politically.

As long as I'm talking about ways to reduce American influence I might as well mention the media. I feel that Canadian media is in a very good position. Canadian music and television is more popular then ever, particularly among young people. But we do need to work a little harder on the creation of Canadian movies. Canada has lots of talent and it is critical that government invests much more in our film industry. If they did this Canada could have one of the largest film industries in the world and the dominance of American movies in Canada would be weakened.

One last thing about media: Can the CRTC please revoke CNNs licence to broadcast in Canada? Largely because of CNN, Canadians are far more interested in politics down south then what is going on within our own borders (I can't blame them. The American political circus is very amusing). I honestly don't see why American political news needs to be broadcasted all over Canada. CNN either needs to switch the broadcast to CNN International or return the licence so we can use that space to broadcast Canadian content.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Examples oh wizened one especially since your percentages are dubious? So which cities have you resided in where the differences between American and Canadian culture are negligible?

Why don't you tell us the difference.

I agree with 90% of what you said. I disagreed when you said that Canadian culture is 85% American. Though American influence is strong I don't think that our culture is anywhere close to being 85% influenced by the Americans. Anyways, the good news is that America's cultual influence is slowly degrading and I feel that Canada may be beginning to take its own direction.

On a political note, I am very encouraged by the Harper Governments (TM) policies to the United States. They are aggressively diversifying Canada's economy so that it is no longer as reliant on the Americans. That can only be good for us from an economic and cultural standpoint. However, I am very concerned by the dominance of American brands in Canada. I believe that an important step in creating culture is ensuring that Canadian brands dominate Canada. I am personally very disturbed when I see brands like Target, Wal-Mart, American Apparel, HBO and American Eagle operating in Canada. I think that the government needs to figure out how to prevent these popular brands from opening locations in Canada. Their presence only hurts Canada in the long run. Furthermore, I feel that the government needs to do more to prevent takeovers of Canadian companies; particularly by American and Chinese corporations. For the past few years we've been seeing several high profile takeover of Canadian companies and all that does is weaken Canada economically, culturally and politically.

As long as I'm talking about ways to reduce American influence I might as well mention the media. I feel that Canadian media is in a very good position. Canadian music and television is more popular then ever, particularly among young people. But we do need to work a little harder on the creation of Canadian movies. Canada has lots of talent and it is critical that government invests much more in our film industry. If they did this Canada could have one of the largest film industries in the world and the dominance of American movies in Canada would be weakened.

One last thing about media: Can the CRTC please revoke CNNs licence to broadcast in Canada? Largely because of CNN, Canadians are far more interested in politics down south then what is going on within our own borders (I can't blame them. The American political circus is very amusing). I honestly don't see why American political news needs to be broadcasted all over Canada. CNN either needs to switch the broadcast to CNN International or return the licence so we can use that space to broadcast Canadian content.

Canadian culture is notoriously hard to define (I've tried on several occasions to do this) but that does not mean that it does not exist. I would be interested to see if visitors from other countries can better define Canada's culture. I suspect that defining culture may be somewhat similar to accents. People who have accents generally don't realize that they have accents because its just the way they speak, but others can notice it very easily. Canadians may have a hard time defining our culture because we just view it as the way we live while an outsider may be able to define it easier.

Anyways, I've spoken to many of my American friends and they've said that Canadian culture is definitely different then American culture. Since Canada isn't just emulating American culture there is little doubt in my mind that Canada does have a unique and distinct culture. The trouble is figuring out exactly what that unique culture is.

I think the media is awful. Outside the CBC I see very few Canadian shows. At the end of the day, we eat the same food, wear the same clothes and listen to the same music (for the most part ). That's what makes it hard to define for me. But then people in Germany and the UK do the same, on a lesser scale, but the point remains. Same with the CNN. But Canadian Politics in itself is boring, and it should stay that way. Americans love to make a drama of everything that has happened since 2008 is not exception.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

hard to define because it has a little bit of everything and not so much of its own. US, UK, France, even Asia. Yes, I agree that Canadian culture is somewhat different from American culture, but the similarity is like 85%. There is difference but not enough to make it stand out, like the French are different from the Germans, or the Japanese different from the Chinese.

It is unsurprising because Canada had its own constitution completely independent from the UK only in 1982. Canadian citizenship didn't exist until 1947, and before that, it was essentially a part of Great Britain.

Is it because "we just view it as the way we live while an outsider may be able to define it easier"? good try but hardly. I am sure ask any Italian or Chinese, they will have no trouble telling all about what their country is about and how it is different from the rest of the world. And plus, most outsiders are NOT able to define it either, not just Canadians.

I know it is hard for Canadians to admit the fact that Canada does NOT possess a distinct culture and identity - it is still forming - and that people will keep arguing that it is a different culture due to the pride thing.

Many have said "American friends" telling them how Canadian culture is vastly different from American culture, as if it is solid evidence. I am sure they are just being polite and nice. Why would an American friend you are familiar rudely say "you guys have no culture and everything is basically borrowed from us"? It is like your friend will also say your kid is cute and smart. Why do they want to offend you any way? But as a Canadian, when you travel to or live in urban US, do you really experience some sort of "culture shock"? Seriously? I have lived a large city in both country, and I am confident to say the similarities (85%) completely overwhelms the differences (15%) when everything considered.

One way for Canada to develop its own culture is to stop relying on American culture so habitually every single day (of course stop speaking English would be the best efficient way but not possible), ranging from P&G consumer goods to what you watch and listen on the media. Second is to start considering the US as simply foreign country like the rest of the world (cut the umbilical cord). The US should not be the benchmark of everything we do, there is the rest of the world. There are many small-big neighbouring countries and I have never seem one dependent on the other like Canada does on the US.

The US has an influential culture, and being its small neighbour sharing the same language is a big misfortune culturally wise. If everything is business as usual, Canada will never be able to create its own culture, and the rest of the world will never recognize it.

I have to agree with all of this. I would not go as far to say we don't have one at all, but the one we have is not easily identifiable.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I think the media is awful. Outside the CBC I see very few Canadian shows.

CBC, CTV and CityTV all make ok Canadian television shows, but they are still not as good as the American ones. Like I've said before, Canadian media (including television) is increasing in quality and popularity and that is a very good thing. I feel that there is serious potential for Canadian television and music to become more popular then American media here in Canada within the next two decades.

At the end of the day, we eat the same food, wear the same clothes and listen to the same music (for the most part ). That's what makes it hard to define for me. But then people in Germany and the UK do the same, on a lesser scale, but the point remains.

I think we need to stop calling this American culture. Its Western culture and it is shared among all Western nations. The Canadian, Australian, British and even to a certain extent American cultures are just subcultures of the much larger Western culture.

But Canadian Politics in itself is boring, and it should stay that way. Americans love to make a drama of everything that has happened since 2008 is not exception.

I wish that Canadian politics weren't so dry and boring. I like a good political drama every once in a while. But I guess we have Rob Ford and the Americans to entertain us

 

[kkgg7]

I agree with 90% of what you said. I disagreed when you said that Canadian culture is 85% American. Though American influence is strong I don't think that our culture is anywhere close to being 85% influenced by the Americans. Anyways, the good news is that America's cultual influence is slowly degrading and I feel that Canada may be beginning to take its own direction.

On a political note, I am very encouraged by the Harper Governments (TM) policies to the United States. They are aggressively diversifying Canada's economy so that it is no longer as reliant on the Americans. That can only be good for us from an economic and cultural standpoint. However, I am very concerned by the dominance of American brands in Canada. I believe that an important step in creating culture is ensuring that Canadian brands dominate Canada. I am personally very disturbed when I see brands like Target, Wal-Mart, American Apparel, HBO and American Eagle operating in Canada. I think that the government needs to figure out how to prevent these popular brands from opening locations in Canada. Their presence only hurts Canada in the long run. Furthermore, I feel that the government needs to do more to prevent takeovers of Canadian companies; particularly by American and Chinese corporations. For the past few years we've been seeing several high profile takeover of Canadian companies and all that does is weaken Canada economically, culturally and politically.

As long as I'm talking about ways to reduce American influence I might as well mention the media. I feel that Canadian media is in a very good position. Canadian music and television is more popular then ever, particularly among young people. But we do need to work a little harder on the creation of Canadian movies. Canada has lots of talent and it is critical that government invests much more in our film industry. If they did this Canada could have one of the largest film industries in the world and the dominance of American movies in Canada would be weakened.

One last thing about media: Can the CRTC please revoke CNNs licence to broadcast in Canada? Largely because of CNN, Canadians are far more interested in politics down south then what is going on within our own borders (I can't blame them. The American political circus is very amusing). I honestly don't see why American political news needs to be broadcasted all over Canada. CNN either needs to switch the broadcast to CNN International or return the licence so we can use that space to broadcast Canadian content.

Agree with most of what you said too, particularly about the popularity of American consumer goods and politics in Canada.

I almost always feel sad for Canada every time something happening (nothing extremely important) in US makes headline news in Canadian media across the country. No country would be interested in reporting the progress of the American federal election to such details, for example, who won which state, who said what, blah blah. Canadians often forget it is another country. My friend joked to me that the Canada media feels so assimilated in the American politics that they say "President Obama" instead of "US president Obama", as if it is their president too. No other country would do that, ever.

The dominance of American consumer goods is annoying too. If you go to any grocery store or drug store, there are more products imported from the US than made in Canada. Do we really have to eat American tomatoes, apples, and strawberries? Maybe we do, I don't know. When I was in the US, I seldom seen products "imported from Canada).

You may think these are just politics and media, but they add up and make everyone unsure how Canadian Canada really is, since our exposure to a foreign country, its culture, its products is so overwhelming, we wonder what is left.

 

[kkgg7]

I think we need to stop calling this American culture. Its Western culture and it is shared among all Western nations. The Canadian, Australian, British and even to a certain extent American cultures are just subcultures of the much larger Western culture.

I don't agree. Western culture is NOT American culture, although most countries are influenced by it. The British culture is still distinct from American as they produce tons of high quality media products even the US needs to make copycats. They talk differently, eat different food, and they don't exclusively watch American TV/movies. BBC for example, produced abundance of great programs. Australia, I am not 100% certain, but someone used to post something saying that they don't rely so much on American culture content either since they are so far away.

Canada is a completely different story in terms of the extent of American influence. Don't try to bring other countries in to justify "it is a global thing, not just Canada". It IS. Take a look at our TV premium channel. How many are American and how many are Canadian. We are a cultural colony of the US, admit it. Other English speaking countries don't even come close to that.

 

[sixrings]

Canadian culture is notoriously hard to define (I've tried on several occasions to do this) but that does not mean that it does not exist. I would be interested to see if visitors from other countries can better define Canada's culture. I suspect that defining culture may be somewhat similar to accents. People who have accents generally don't realize that they have accents because its just the way they speak, but others can notice it very easily. Canadians may have a hard time defining our culture because we just view it as the way we live while an outsider may be able to define it easier.

Anyways, I've spoken to many of my American friends and they've said that Canadian culture is definitely different then American culture. Since Canada isn't just emulating American culture there is little doubt in my mind that Canada does have a unique and distinct culture. The trouble is figuring out exactly what that unique culture is.

Chris Bosh thought Canada was "DIFFERENT"