100 Queens Quay at Sugar Wharf | 117.34m | 25s | Menkes | B+H

alklay

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I pray they break this into several small plots instead of selling the whole thing as one. No more huge block developments down there please! I feel as though they'd net more $$ that way as well.

Agreed. What they need are lots of small streets to run through the development, rather than a Pinnacle like mega structure or two.
 

Grimace

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Does this land include the parking lot and other unused land between Cooper Street and the Loblaws? Probably too much to hope for, but if it includes those lands its a large enough plot to warrant a mini-precinct plan with new streets and individual lots sold off. (EDIT: I see someone else jumped in and said this first.) It looks like the size of 6-7 Market Wharves, to take the example of one of the nearest condo currently under construction, and the Market Wharf site is pretty big for a condo. I think this looks like a lot more than 5 Ten Yorks -- that is, if I'm right that it includes the lands east of Cooper.

Would be nice if the province would put Waterfront Toronto in charge of this, even with the caveat that the proceeds of sale will go to the province instead of funding future development.
 

Urban-Affair

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Does their site include the parking lot to the east? If so then it is an unprecedented block of downtown real estate.

LCBO owns the blocks between Freeland, Lake shore blvd East and QQ east all the way over to the border with that Grocery Store complex near Lower Jarvis. Not sure what parts they are selling or whether it is the whole thing. The first main LCBO block also has some TEDCO portion on it in its middle section, but as far as I can tell they own the entire next block up to the back of that grocery store on Jarvis.
 
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Mongo

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Wow, that's a huge plot of land. My question is whether this would be a single planned neighborhood development as with the land further east, or will it simply be sold off to the highest bidder, for them to do whatever they want with it, i.e. big box stores? Or (most likely) is it too early to say?
 

yyzgyy

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LCBO owns the blocks between Freeland, Lake shore blvd East and QQ east all the way over to the border with that Grocery Store complex near Lower Jarvis. Not sure what parts they are selling or whether it is the whole thing. The first main LCBO block also has some TEDCO portion on it in its middle section, but as far as I can tell they own the entire next block up to the back of that grocery store on Jarvis.

I recall hearing the former railway tracks that cut through the site are owned by Build Toronto.
 

Hypnotoad

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Wow, that's a huge plot of land. My question is whether this would be a single planned neighborhood development as with the land further east, or will it simply be sold off to the highest bidder, for them to do whatever they want with it, i.e. big box stores? Or (most likely) is it too early to say?

6871389563_59cc7c86d3_b.jpg

I didn't illustrate this on the map, but this is very close the WT lands north of Corus, west of the Moche Safdie development. It would be great if WT was able to help coordinate the development here too. It would be very unfortunate to have another strip of QQ's developed without at least considering the built plan for the district. A MLS or ICE-type development, while in line with the area on the other side of the Gardiner, is not in line with the vision for QQ.
 
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Mongo

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It occurs to me that $200 million is a lot of money, even with the size of the plot of land. I don't have the figures, but on an area basis, the asking land price must be similar to that of the later phases of Southcore. Do Southcore land prices require Southcore densities?
 

Torontovibe

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^^ Doesn't the west side of the Pier 27 land belong to the municipal government? (the part that's still a parking lot today) I think it is going to become a public square or some type of public use.
 

TOareaFan

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They can always move into the future proposed government run 880 Bay St. office development

Is there much interaction between the warehouse and the HO? If so, it is not likely that the warehouse will be anywhere near the downtown (likely somewhere along the 407 from Brampton to Markham (pick a spot) ) and if the HO needs to be adjacent/nearby then it would likely be some sort of office/warehouse thing like you see in a lot of the new industrial parks in the 905.
 

canarob

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LCBO owns the blocks between Freeland, Lake shore blvd East and QQ east all the way over to the border with that Grocery Store complex near Lower Jarvis. Not sure what parts they are selling or whether it is the whole thing. The first main LCBO block also has some TEDCO portion on it in its middle section, but as far as I can tell they own the entire next block up to the back of that grocery store on Jarvis.


I can't think of anywhere else in Canada where a plot of land -- even a big one -- between an elevated expressway and a sugar refinery would fetch $200 million. Even compared with two or three years ago, land prices have really shot through the roof. We're talking what, maybe 6-8 towers (judging from the size of Pinnacle's site)? I could see a supertall being built here along with other very tall towers, otherwise I'm not sure how the numbers would work, even if PSF is very high.
 

Redroom Studios

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I'm a bit surprised that there doesnt seem to be any sentimentality for the heritage buildings here. The long narrow building that runs parallel to the Gardiner at the north end of the site seems to hold some interest for me and I'd like to see that portion remain. But at this point where the Ontario government seems to be moving into fire sale mode I suppose there will be little consideration of the heritage value and developers would like to see the slate wiped clean. I guess my concern is that this area is going to become an extension of the sterile Southcore / MLS neighbourhood...
 

Mongo

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If whoever buys this site must pay $200 million, then I expect that it will need to be built at Southcore densities to make a profit for the developer. Adding in the Toronto Star lands (possible supertall?) and even the Pier 27 development (is it one or two 35s towers in the later phases?), and we would end up with another Southcore (at least in terms of density), east of Yonge.
 

gristle

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It would be a shame if those jobs head out to the suburbs. Some of that property must remain as employment lands.


Subsidizing the horse-racing "industry"?

Spare me.
 

Automation Gallery

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It would be a shame if those jobs head out to the suburbs. Some of that property must remain as employment lands.

They can always move over next-door to Waterfront Toronto which has a proposed area plan for employement lands, but then again that doesnt make sense...i could see them moving out to the 905.
 

gristle

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Unfortunately, the government is likely looking for the cheapest relocation option, and that could mean the suburbs. It would be fantastic if the HQ jobs would remain downtown. The more employment located in the city, the better. That's why I think it's imperative that a reasonable chunk of the property reserved for employment.
 

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