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The Coming Disruption of Transport

Would you buy an EV from a Chinese OEM?

  • Yes

    Votes: 10 11.5%
  • No

    Votes: 61 70.1%
  • Maybe

    Votes: 16 18.4%

  • Total voters
    87

Nearly seven in 10 Canadians intend to make their next vehicle purchase an EV: survey

KPMG poll finds that most Canadians plan to go electric, with price the only major roadblock and younger generations the most keen

Sixty-two per cent of 2,000 Canadians polled indicated they plan on buying a new vehicle in the next five years. A strong majority of that group — 68 per cent — say they are likely or very likely to choose an EV for their next vehicle purchase, whether it be a pure battery electric or hybrid model.

I don't see larger trucks being eliminated, unless they are banned or the infrastructure not longer designed to accommodate them.
The argument is that without drivers, the economic benefit of fewer, larger trucks largely vanishes. So since smaller trucks will be economically equal or better than large ones, they will become more common.
 
The argument is that without drivers, the economic benefit of fewer, larger trucks largely vanishes. So since smaller trucks will be economically equal or better than large ones, they will become more common.
The problem is, how much does a large truck cost compared to smaller trucks carrying the same amount? I tried but failed to find anything about this. Does anyone more knowledgeable than I am have any sources?
 
The problem is, how much does a large truck cost compared to smaller trucks carrying the same amount? I tried but failed to find anything about this. Does anyone more knowledgeable than I am have any sources?
I wouldn't say that's a problem at all. The biggest cost in trucking is labour.
 
The problem is, how much does a large truck cost compared to smaller trucks carrying the same amount? I tried but failed to find anything about this. Does anyone more knowledgeable than I am have any sources?
I don’t have data, but I imagine it’s case specific, all over the map, and the combination of electric and self driving probably resets the whole marh. In some cases the change is huge (not every truck uses all its cube volume) and in some cases it’s meaningless (the furniture and appliance delivery has to send two people anyways, tailor the vehicle to a full day’s worth of deliveries). Two electric drive trains may be cheaper than one diesel motor, smaller loads mean smaller cheaper batteries. But how many dump trucks do we want on a construction site at a time?
There may be a transformation in loading docks, too ....AV locates a suitable spot, drops off a mini intermodal container using a self contained boom, photigraphs it and leaves, recipient has to shuffle and unload the container. No more wiggling big trailers into confined nooks (although the AV may know how to do that, too)

- Paul
 
Madrid managed to expand Metro at a rate Torontonians could only dream about for several reasons.

They did not dig everywhere but rather employed at-grade, elevation, and current rail corridor wherever possible. They didn't build Taj Mahal subway stations in the burbs a la Spadina extension, they had a plan, and they didn't change every couple of years. They also didn't, unlike Toronto, build completely grade separated lines and then charge such ridiculous fares that no one can afford to take it a la UPX and then just to piss everyone along the route off, use polluting, loud, and slow diesel trains.
 
A discussion of impacts of AVs on cities. The prediction: lots of traffic due to induced demand. I tend to agree. The only way I can see this not being the case is with very high dynamic/TOU road tolling, perhaps with dedicated lanes (or dedicated capacity at lower cost) for high occupancy vehicles.

 
I guess on the bright side, being able to price road use should provide significant revenues to support transit, bike infrastructure, etc. There is absolutely no logic in leaving the price low and high degrees of congestion. And no reason to let AV fleet operators capture that value.
 
I guess on the bright side, being able to price road use should provide significant revenues to support transit, bike infrastructure, etc. There is absolutely no logic in leaving the price low and high degrees of congestion. And no reason to let AV fleet operators capture that value.
Assuming AEVs drop the cost of driving below the cost to operate private vehicles, and we (have to) use road pricing to ensure we don't have congestion or too many people switching to cars from transit etc., you can potentially get pretty big numbers. In Canada, there are 400B vehicle km travelled per year (and growing at a decent clip). Even if we can only charge $0.10/km road pricing on average, that is $40B per year in revenue. The GTA's share of that is probably on the order of $10B per year on population basis. But given that many of the most congested roads in the country are in the GTA, the road pricing would be higher here. It could easily translate to $20B or more of additional revenues that could support investments in transportation infrastructure. It's basically enabling the enormous tax private car ownership represents on households with funds that can go to public benefit.
 
 

Waymo's CEO is resigning and being replaced by a pair of co-CEOs. This move is likely to kickstart some aggressive expansion and deployment. Given that they have FULLY autonomous vehicles in service now, they don't have any fundamental challenges left, it is just a scaling issue.

I think that here in Toronto, you will be able to hail a ride in a fully autonomous in about 3-4 years. I really look forward to being hail an autonomous vehicle for intercity travel though. Productive time on the go, refreshed after the journey and best of all, more convenient and cheaper than a train (no subsidy)!
 
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It is going to take time to scale the fleet, particularly using Waymo's model of heavily modified vehicles.

If road pricing becomes a thing in order to manage congestion, I'm not sure it will always be cheaper than a train.
 
Another last mile AEV solution. An electric mini-bus with 12-68 miles of range, and speeds up to 40 kph. Could be used for getting people to/from transit stops, for instance. Coming to market 2023. They have completed testing with 75,000 rides in geofenced campuses in the US.



 

Many in the urbanist community are irrationally hostile to autonomous vehicles, but like it or not, they are coming and fast. Mobileye, a leader in the space is deploying starting in 2022, and by 2025, Mobileye's Amnon Shashua is anticipating significant market penetration. It puts things into perspective, especially when we have so many transit projects which, when taking into account the impact of autonomous vehicle, probably won't be needed.

Investing in a light rail line now is like building an interurban railway in the late 1920s. Times are changing and it won't last long.

Also, I think that people here should find this quote illuminating:

A calculation was done that focused on San Francisco, where there are 60,000 Uber and Lyft vehicles transporting people, and it turned out that the same number of passengers could be transported with 2,000 autonomous vehicles. So, yes, traffic jams will be significantly reduced.
Autonomous vehicles will play a large role in massively cutting traffic for a variety of reasons. Mentioned in the quote is one of them.
 
The
Many in the urbanist community are irrationally hostile to autonomous vehicles, but like it or not, they are coming and fast. Mobileye, a leader in the space is deploying starting in 2022, and by 2025, Mobileye's Amnon Shashua is anticipating significant market penetration. It puts things into perspective, especially when we have so many transit projects which, when taking into account the impact of autonomous vehicle, probably won't be needed.

Investing in a light rail line now is like building an interurban railway in the late 1920s. Times are changing and it won't last long.

Also, I think that people here should find this quote illuminating:


Autonomous vehicles will play a large role in massively cutting traffic for a variety of reasons. Mentioned in the quote is one of them.
Road capacity will remain a challenge, particularly because AEVs will result in a big increase in VMTs. They can also play a big role in making transit more relevant to more users (minibuses).
 

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