Stash the trash: Takeout coffe cup deposit at Tim Hortons et al?

[MindMe]

Stash the trash: Takeout coffee cup deposit at Tim Hortons et al?

http://timhortonstrash.blogspot.com/

What's the single most noticeable street trash you see every day? For my part, it's takeout coffee cups piggy lazy people can't bother to toss in a trash can but simply hurl at a fence or drop where they stand. Tim Hortons customers seem to be the biggest piggies but that might only be because they're the market leader.

My suggestion is follow what some cities like Seoul have done: put a deposit fee on each paper cup. You bring it back, you get your 20 cents back. You don't see takeout cup trash on the streets of seoul, despite there being a lack of public trash cans. You also don't see many bottles and soda cans where cities have similar deposit laws. Put a deposit on something and a small underground of street people and kids emerges to collect the item and return it.

It looks like this idea had some steam in 2008 but died. Odd we got a 5 cent bag fee rushed in. I never saw many grocery bags littering buses, sidewalks, etc. But a deposit fee slid off the table. I guess in the former, grocery stores simply get to keep the 5 cents. In the latter, Tim Hortons, Starbucks, etc will have to bear a cost. Still, lots of industries now have to bear a lifecycle cost for their products: tires, oil changes, etc. Further cash refunded will always be less than deposits taken in. They're free to keep that difference to help defray costs.

 

[CHAMMY]

I agree, I have been saying this for years, Toronto will never be a clean city again until they address the take-out trash issue. I agree that Timmys is the main culprit although there are others, I was starting to think that the tims coffeecup was becoming Torontos official flower because I see so many of them on the ground.

 

[MindMe]

"I was starting to think that the tims coffeecup was becoming Torontos official flower because I see so many of them on the ground. "

I love that line, Chammy. I'm going to quote you on the blog.

 

[fiendishlibrarian]

Their brown colour has always made me refer to them as Timmy Turds.

And I agree, there's something uniquely disgusting about many Tim Hortons customers. Everytime I see their ads on TV I wonder why someone doesn't do a parody of people walking or driving out of a Tim Hortons and promptly tossing cups and wrappers by the side of the road, placing them on top of newspaper boxes, leaving them under park benches and dropping them out of their open car doors when they're exiting a parking lot (or the urban version, leaving them under subway seats or on platform floors within sight of a bin).

 

[John Revolta]

Parents needs to start instilling manners in their children like they did in the past. There are too many spoiled brats. People of all ages litter, but we need to send a message to kids from the beginning to respect public property. This should also be taught in the school system. Some littering is due to sheer laziness and some is due to peer pressure. If a bunch of teenagers are out in a park they're most likely going to throw their trash on the ground because they don't want to look like a prissy, tree hugger.

Not to brag or anything, but this past summer I did a major cleanup of a local ravine by myself, of my own initiative, no pay, in the sweltering heat, while punching mosquitoes out of the air. I must have spent 3 hours a day for about a week, tediously covering every square inch of the ravine, picking up trash, ranging from cushions and tires to sucker wrappers. I must have filled a dozen large garbage bags. Of course, litter started to reappear shortly thereafter. I emailed the parks department and supposedly they only have a staff of about 8 people that clean and maintain our ravines. That's pathetic. No wonder why they're always filthy.

I've never understood how people can think nothing of throwing their trash on the ground. When they go over to a friend's house, do they throw their garbage on the floor? Obviously not. I guess when you're out in public and no one is willing to question you, there's no deterrent. Where I live, teens hang out in the local park and throw their McDonald's, Tim Horton's, junk food wrappings, on the ground on a nightly basis. I feel like smashing a dobro over their heads.

 

[MindMe]

Very true, John. I was raised during the "don't be a litter bug" crying indian era. Tossing your trash on the ground was like worse than hitler. I guess now the kids think as long as they're buying from apple and not running a factory pumping out carbon they must be doing right by the environment.

Following up the Tim Turd idea (another brilliant phrase) what confuses me is we've got pretty much every dog owner to poop 'n' scoop. You simply don't see dog owners letting their dogs take a crap on the sidewalk and then walking away. There's laws, there's huge social shaming, etc. Some how we can't communicate to Tim Hortons piggies and others to do retain their trash. I mean picking up dog crap (and carrying it) is a helluva lot less pleasant than throwing your used takeout cup in your backpack and tossing it at the next bus stop.

 

[John Revolta]

It's not even that. I think most kids, generally starting around the middle school age just tend to not give a crap about the environment. They're too busy being kids and having fun. And it's a consistency of bad habits that will probably lead into their adult lives. If you're never punished for your actions, then you don't know any better. Going off topic here, but kids need their asses spanked when they're out of line. Simply telling them they've done something bad isn't always enough to drive the message home, otherwise they think they're in control.

I'm not one for regulations and restrictions but I wouldn't mind seeing gum prohibited. Firstly all gum contains aspartame which is essential a poison and never should have been put in our food. It would also keep our sidewalks free of black smudges, aside from the picturesque asphalt patches. There are alternatives luckily. People can suck on mints instead. They're generally more effective for fighting bad breath anyway.

We really need to start a marketing campaign that tackles the issue of littering. Get the message out there to everyone, especially younger people. Send out messages on Facebook, and cell phones that are relative to them. Make the message simple and non intrusive. Something that can make people look at the environment in a different light. Let them know it's not uncool to be responsible and to take pride in their city's appearance.

 

[doady]

^ I agree with John Revolta, it's mostly just the kids who are drinking Tim Hortons coffee and throwing cups on the ground. The City should consider a youth curfew for whole, and solve its littering problem and crime problems in one stroke, kill two birds with one stone. Curfews have had a lot of success in Australia and US at reducing crimes, no doubt it would be successful, not just for stopping crime, for littering. Toronto need to start to stop problems at their source, and really it is the youth.

Chiildren 18 years and younger should only be allowed outside of their home and schools weekdays from 6am to 8am, and from 2pm to 4pm, i.e. when school stops and ends. The curfew for 19-21 years can be more lenient, maybe 6am to 6pm. So kids would only be outside around 1/5 of the time than they are now, so it would reduce the littering and crime by 1/5 also. Prevention, solving a problem at the source, is much easier and cheaper than arresting people or picking up trash after the fact, it's a simple as that.

 

[lead82]

That's a radically practical idea that may actually work. Therefore it can't be done in Toronto.

 

[John Revolta]

^ I agree with John Revolta, it's mostly just the kids who are drinking Tim Hortons coffee and throwing cups on the ground. The City should consider a youth curfew for whole, and solve its littering problem and crime problems in one stroke, kill two birds with one stone. Curfews have had a lot of success in Australia and US at reducing crimes, no doubt it would be successful, not just for stopping crime, for littering. Toronto need to start to stop problems at their source, and really it is the youth.

Chiildren 18 years and younger should only be allowed outside of their home and schools weekdays from 6am to 8am, and from 2pm to 4pm, i.e. when school stops and ends. The curfew for 19-21 years can be more lenient, maybe 6am to 6pm. So kids would only be outside around 1/5 of the time than they are now, so it would reduce the littering and crime by 1/5 also. Prevention, solving a problem at the source, is much easier and cheaper than arresting people or picking up trash after the fact, it's a simple as that.

That's completely absurd. I would never want to see kids permitted to stay indoors, for several reasons. It infringes upon their freedom and though being stuck inside would definitely help to curb criminal activity it would also make kids go insane and become increasingly out of shape. If anything, teens need to get outside more often, and get away from their computers, video games, gadgets. I agree people under 18 really shouldn't be out roaming around late at night. I'd like to see a restriction on cell phones until you turn 18. No kid needs a cell phone. None of us had them when were in middle school. It's ridiculous and the excessive distractions in today's world are severely hindering our creativity and problem solving skills. Most kids are complete dolts these days because their brains are fried from too much technology. Text messengers should just disappear completely. There's absolutely no need for them. Why can't people just communicate vocally? All this moronic texting lingo is destroying the English language. People can't spell or carry an intelligent conversation, to save their lives. I'm going way off the rails of the thread here.

 

[John Revolta]

That's the sad truth, but it's worth a shot. This city has so much potential that it will never realize.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

It isn't "just the kids" - that's too easy - go on the subway and take a look at who are the ones who consistently leave the newspapers behind, for example. Nor do I think that it is "just the kids" who are leaving junk at highway offramps.

AoD

 

[John Revolta]

I never said it was just kids. All age groups contribute. I think kids are probably more prone to it because they don't really rationalize their decisions. Kids just do, without thinking. Unfortunately many adults are the exact same.

 

[Northern Light]

I'm in full agreement with the deposit idea.

They still had deposits on pop bottles when I was a child.....(sigh, I'm older than I like to think)

My recollection is that not only was it rare to find this sorta thing as litter, but if you did, as a kid it was a gold mine!

Deposits on pop bottles used to be 30c! In the 70's!

That would be what? .75c now at least.

You imagine collecting a dozen of those as a child, you'd have enough money for movie.

I think that would go some distance to reducing litter.

Pop bottles of course, were' also glass, generally no bigger than 1L as I recall.

Applying the same logic to takeout; either buy/bring a reusable (get a glass/mug for in-store) or pay for the cup and get something back for returning it.

Good ideas; the trick is getting them implemented!

 

[gabe]

Bottle Redemption Centers are found all over the states, they accept cans, bottles and plastic bottles. I would love to see something like that in Canada, it also creates jobs. Like Northern Light i also remember when there was deposits on pop bottles, I can remember helping my Dad carry cases of empty pop bottles, we would take them to the A&P they had a deposit area inside the store.