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Smitherman's Transit plan
- Thread starter SimonP
- Start date
nfitz
Superstar
Why would anyone who lives outside of Toronto really care that much about transit in Toronto? Interest perhaps ... the odd comment ... but actual activism?
Really, most of SOS is outside of Toronto? ROTFLMAO! Well that explains why they seem so ignorant on so many aspects. No wonder they are pushing all these subway extensions to nowhere!
GraphicMatt
Looking forward to a FRESH START for Toronto
No, and I'm glad you're passionate about these things. But you do have to admit that your desire to be a politically-engaged activist group is hampered by none of KeithZ, gweed, CC nor you being eligible to vote in the upcoming election.
Justin10000
Banned
The Mad Navigator
Banned
They should start an "Urban GTA" forum and profess their idiocy there.
Fresh Start
Banned
Yes, isn't it a shame that all the good people have been driven out by the City's reluctance (failure) to meet the demands of the average citizenry? I'm sure many people in the 905 area would prefer to live Downtown but have either been priced out or offered a job position elsewhere too cushy to refuse.
js97
Senior Member
Rossi's plan is still the most realistic!
nfitz
Superstar
The one where he sold Toronto Hydro to get a revenue stream that was little better than the revenue stream it is already providing to the city budget. And likely much worse given he forgot to account the money that would have to be given to the province?
It might well be the most realistic than Smitherman ... but isn't the goalpost kind of low ... heck it's lying on the pitch. Even SOS's plan is more realistic than Rossi's. Or Smitherman's.
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Isn't pitting projects against one another how you determine priorities? If something is more important than something else, it should be higher up the list. Seems like a pretty simple concept to me.
I was living in Toronto for the past 5 years up until 2 weeks ago. I got a job in Ottawa, so I moved back. And I would hardly call the DRL a subway extension to nowhere. And I'm not ignorant, we just have different views on what should be done.
Says the guy who lived in Ottawa for a couple years and seems to think that makes him an expert on how the Transitway works... Your hypocracy knows no bounds...
nfitz
Superstar
Fair enough. And quite frankly, we don't disagree on DRL ... but much of the pushing has been these extensions that have so little traffic - Sheppard East, Sherway, Sheppard West past Victoria Park ...
Ah ... Ottawa. You can enjoy watching how they will scupper their newly-funded LRT project this time. Not sure how they will pull that off ... but I expect they will. I guess the upcoming election will be the test. Or perhaps you think it should be subway instead ...
And I guess you'll be enjoying a fully-implemented Presto card before we do!
Second_in_pie
Senior Member
For starters, someone who lives in the GTA has a pretty big impact from Toronto transit. Maybe you'd like higher transit usage in Toronto so you have an easier commute to work? Maybe you want new transit lines so you can get to work or just around the city more easily? Really, this idea that Toronto's separate from the rest of the GTA is a stupid concept. What if I'd like a Sheppard subway to get to work at STC from the Go train? What if I want the DRL so I can visit my friend in Parkdale by transit? Should I not be able to advocate for a DRL which could significantly improve my commute just because I don't live in Toronto? If that's the case, what business would someone living in Rexdale have advocating for a DRL?
Going even further out from just the GTA or even GGH, I could see why everyone in Canada would want Toronto to actually have a good transit system. You do not want the largest and most economically important city in your country sitting in traffic and deadlocked by terrible transit planning. Maybe I'd like Toronto to try to break out of the mold of American transportation planning and be a leader for the rest of Canada? Maybe I just think that the nation will work better if people can actually get where they want to go instead of a frustrating, time wasting commutes?
Not to mention that you don't have to be particularly engrained in the issue to be vocal about it, or see the obviously right thing to do. I think that child labour in India is a bad thing. But is it affecting me? Heck, the only thing that I'm getting is cheaper clothes! So why should I care? That's a much farther boat than 4km to the Toronto border, but it seems to be a reasonable issue to believe in.
So that's a pretty sorry excuse for knowing that LRT is in fact a mistake. Maybe instead of pulling excuses out of your ass, you could actually help Toronto get a real transit system together.
nfitz
Superstar
Fair enough ... if someone is working in Toronto, but living outside, I can see that they might have an interest in better transit. I'm not sure this is the case though, for the 4 people we've been talking about. Maybe I'm wrong ... I often am ...
Many people seem to think LRT is a good thing. Not sure how you know it is a mistake
And there you just demonstrate your ignorance about Toronto. Perhaps in Markham people are allowed to keep donkeys ... but it's not allowed under the by-laws in Toronto - not in the back garden at least. Just because you have an ass, doesn't mean you should assume others are so lucky!
Sheppard West: I don't think it's a high priority, I've never stated it has been. My justification for having it eventually is for network connectivity purposes, so that the Sheppard Subway isn't only dumping passengers onto an overcrowded Yonge subway.
Sherway: Again, not a priority. I'd like to see a subway to Pearson before I see a subway to Sherway.
Sheppard East past VP: Justified to STC. Beyond Agincourt along Sheppard however, barely worthy of BRT, let alone LRT.
Ah ... Ottawa. You can enjoy watching how they will scupper their newly-funded LRT project this time. Not sure how they will pull that off ... but I expect they will. I guess the upcoming election will be the test. Or perhaps you think it should be subway instead ...
And I guess you'll be enjoying a fully-implemented Presto card before we do!
I have written Jim Watson saying that his position on not needing the DOTT is flat out wrong (I phrased it nicer than that obviously). The city cannot survive with an at-grade option through the downtown. It simply won't work. The only way to meet the forecasted demand is through grade separation.
This new TMP is miles ahead of where the last one was. In hindsight, I'd much prefer my council voting a stupid project down, starting from scratch, and getting it right, as opposed to following through on a deeply flawed project, just because "it's better than nothing". There are two ways to do things: right, and again. Doing things right may cost more at first, but paying extra to fix your mistake later on will always end up costing you more. It may take 15-25 years for the 'again' part to kick in, but when it does...