Rob Ford's Toronto

[Isaachan01]

hmmmmmmmm

I honestly think a barrier would be the best idea.. Its the only way to really ensure safety for a biker. In many european cities this idea is already in use.

 

[MisterF]

Retrotted

What about that sentence are you disputing?

I have no quibble with the statistics quoted above except that they are National as opposed to specific to Toronto.
Pickup trucks are very popular even as the sole family vehicle in small town and rural areas, in Toronto not so much. If you need verification drive around any small centre more than 50 Km from Toronto and you are in a sea of trucks.
Drive any bus route in Toronto and those "Special edition`pickups masquerading as the family car are pretty rare, most City pickups are work vehicles replete with the tools and materials of their driver`s trade. A gardener is unlikely to park his pickup and show up at the bus stop with all his mowers, blowers and gas cans nor would he be cheered on for taking his vehicle off the road.

This is an urban nation, you don't get to #1 by only selling to rural areas. Besides, it's not just pickups. Drive around any suburb and it's a sea of SUVs and minvans. Whether in Toronto or a small town the average vehicle is a lot heavier than a Civic.

 

[adma]

Interesting nugget from The Star:

`Ford and his councillor brother Doug are committing gaffes; the marathon meeting has energized their opponents; and a hasty, ham-handed budget process is alienating centrists and fraying the Fords’ hold on at least two inner circle members.'

More here: http://www.thestar.com/news/toronto...nking-government-not-deficit-drives-ford?bn=1

Any bets on the identities of the queasy insiders? I'll wager Stintz and Robinson.

I believe Stintz and Pasternak are the ones on the record opposing library cuts (though I don't know how "inner circle" Pasternak is)

 

[Admiral Beez]

No, don't licence the riders, licence the bikes as in register ownership for the purpose of ticketing.

Toronto used to license cyclists, and I believe the system worked well enough.

 

[Isaachan01]

misterF i agree with you..

Civics and small cars are still everywhere.. big pickups may be the top selling "new" vehicle.. but we have to remember that most cars on the road are about 5-20 years old not many people can afford a brand new car/truck these days. Used cars still own the road!

 

[W. K. Lis]

I believe Stintz and Pasternak are the ones on the record opposing library cuts (though I don't know how "inner circle" Pasternak is)

James Pasternak, councilor ward 10—York Centre, is a newbie as a councilor. However, he was a school trustee before coming in as a councilor, so has some experience as how government works.

 

[spider]

Toronto used to license cyclists, and I believe the system worked well enough.

I recall having a licence plate on my bike in East York in the 1940's and a trip to the police station to get it. I remember some kind of interview/test thing before being issued a plate for the bike but I didn't receive anything that resembled an operators licence on paper.

 

[EMP1729]

History of bike licensing in Toronto:

http://www.toronto.ca/cycling/safety/licensing/history.htm

Can't argue with the reasoning the city rejected licensing:

The major reasons why licensing has been rejected are:

- The difficulty in keeping a database complete and current
- The difficulty in licensing children, given that they ride bikes too
- Licensing in and of itself does not change the behaviour of cyclists who are disobeying traffic laws.

 

[EMP1729]

I have a question, if someone on this board doesn't mind answering: If a pedestrian jaywalks or a cyclist breaks the HTA and it caught by a police officer, but that person does not have any photo ID (no driver's license or no passport). How can the cop write up a ticket? What happens?

For other crimes, I know the police will just make an arrest, take you to the station and sort it out there. But for these minor infractions, it would seem to me that the cop wouldn't bother wasting his time taking you into custody for riding on the sidewalk or jaywalking.

Perhaps, as the province is rolling out the new photo ID card, make it mandatory to carry one - but that does seem like a facist move.

 

[Ak2809]

- Licensing in and of itself does not change the behaviour of cyclists who are disobeying traffic laws.

Faulty reasoning. Do drivers licenses stop motorists from breaking traffic laws? The amount of money being made from ticketing would suggest no.

 

[freshcutgrass]

Faulty reasoning. Do drivers licenses stop motorists from breaking traffic laws? The amount of money being made from ticketing would suggest no.

True, but it's a rare occurrence to see a motorist approach a red traffic light and flagrantly go through it. But it is a very common occurrence with cyclists (not to be confused with 4-way stop signs, which is a different matter).

Like motorists who used to think nothing much of drinking and driving, or not wearing seat belts, the prevailing attitude of certain behaviour needs to become ingrained. And cyclists definitely need to change the prevailing attitude that certain rules of the road are just "optional" for them.

When both the penalties of doing these things, and the social non-acceptance factor become strong enough pressures, you will start to see far fewer cyclists break the law without giving it a second thought.

But to keep things in perspective, it is motorists that cause 99% of the accidents, injuries, deaths and property damage on the road.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

I have a question, if someone on this board doesn't mind answering: If a pedestrian jaywalks or a cyclist breaks the HTA and it caught by a police officer, but that person does not have any photo ID (no driver's license or no passport). How can the cop write up a ticket? What happens?

Some might give a false name and address, through I believe that's a criminal offense in of itself. If you have done nothing illegal nor broke any bylaws and are asked, you can refuse to give out any personal information.

 

[Automation Gallery]

If you have done nothing illegal nor broke any bylaws and are asked, you can refuse to give out any personal information.

Well it all boils down to, if you have done nothing wrong, why would you not give an authority your proper name.
All i know from experience is that even if you havent done wrong, but by mistake walked into a crime scene..you better hand them your personal info or your going into the slammer.

 

[Isaachan01]

Well it all boils down to, if you have done nothing wrong, why would you not give an authority your proper name.
All i know from experience is that even if you havent done wrong, but by mistake walked into a crime scene..you better hand them your personal info or your going into the slammer.

What about a free license plate? cop stops you cause you're weaving in and out of lanes.. The cop would then just check the plate and you wouldn't have to give any information..

 

[MetroMan]

Please get back on topic

Guys, that's 3 pages of cycling license plate debate. Please take this to the Transportation forum.

Please let's get back to debating Ford as Mayor of Toronto. Has anybody nothing to say about the potentially explosive game changer that some councillors are considering the possibility of blocking Ford out of being Mayor?