Rob Ford's Toronto

[newearthling]

Matt Elliot has some suggestion for what to do next:
http://metronews.ca/voices/ford-for-toronto/993751/rob-ford-if-not-an-arrest-what-next/
April 4, 2014 Updated: April 4, 2014 | 11:29 am

If there’s no Rob Ford arrest, what do his opponents do next?
...
So what happens now? For Ford opponents, I’d suggest three things.

1) Beat him. Despite trumped-up fears that the mayor is some sort of campaign mastermind, he’s a very beatable incumbent with pretty lousy poll numbers. So pick one of of the 47 candidates running against him, volunteer and help them win. There will be no better end to the Ford saga than for the people to decisively reject the guy who has always said he has a mandate from those same people.

2) Make council better. In addition to the vaunted mayoral race, there are 44 individual council races taking place this October. Each of them is critical. Ford will remain an ineffective leader — even if reelected — unless councillors decide to empower him. It’s worth taking the time to look at your local council race and see how things are shaping up.

3) Don’t lose sight of the bigger picture. Regardless of where the Ford story ends up, we need to constantly demand better from law enforcement and the justice system. There are far too many examples of troubling cases where privilege has triumphed over justice, and power has let guilty men walk. We can do better.

 

[euler]

Don't be so dismissive and hostile. Not everyone spends that much time on Urban Toronto.

Neither do I but I manage to read every post without whinging about it.

 

[newearthling]

We need more people coming out and explicitly slamming his actions in public.
When we do have that, then we will know without a doubt that the tide has turned on RoFo and his Traveller Crack Circus.

http://torontoist.com/2014/04/duly-quoted-paula-fletcher-on-the-mayors-claims-of-exoneration/
Duly Quoted: Paula Fletcher, on the Mayor’s Claims of Exoneration

Councillor insists that, regardless of the outcome of Project Brazen 2, Rob Ford will face judgment.

By Sarah Sweet

“I think he wishes he was cleared. What’s clear is that he was smoking crack, he was taking drugs, he was drinking and driving and probably using the most vulgar language any mayor has ever used here about his wife here at City Hall, and that he’s lied consistently. Those aren’t court issues. . . . But the court of public opinion will have its day.”

-Councillor Paula Fletcher (Ward 30, Toronto-Danforth), responding to Rob Ford’s comment from yesterday about having been cleared of wrongdoing after the OPP announced it would be stepping back from the Project Brazen 2 investigation. Various outlets reported Thursday that the OPP does not anticipate laying charges against the mayor, and that the Crown believes there is insufficient evidence to proceed with the investigation—but Toronto police insist the probe is ongoing.

 

[pud99]

incriminating questions to a witness

Options 1) and 2) are the same. There is nothing to "invoke" in Canada. Compelled testimony is simply inadmissible against you, except if you are prosecuted for perjury.

Not correct: See the Canada Evidence Act, section 5. To benefit from an answer to a potentially incriminating question being inadmissible in another case, the witness must object. Because the objection does not excuse the witness from actually answering, but just protects him from having the answer admitted in another case, this is referred to as the witness invoking the benefit of s-s.5(2) of the Canada Evidence Act. Again, to get that benefit the witness must object that answering may tend to incriminate him.

Incriminating questions

5. (1) No witness shall be excused from answering any question on the ground that the answer to the question may tend to incriminate him, or may tend to establish his liability to a civil proceeding at the instance of the Crown or of any person.

Answer not admissible against witness

(2) Where with respect to any question a witness objects to answer on the ground that his answer may tend to criminate him, or may tend to establish his liability to a civil proceeding at the instance of the Crown or of any person, and if but for this Act, or the Act of any provincial legislature, the witness would therefore have been excused from answering the question, then although the witness is by reason of this Act or the provincial Act compelled to answer, the answer so given shall not be used or admissible in evidence against him in any criminal trial or other criminal proceeding against him thereafter taking place, other than a prosecution for perjury in the giving of that evidence or for the giving of contradictory evidence.

R.S., 1985, c. C-5, s. 5; 1997, c. 18, s. 116.

 

[Pickles]

Do the police need an actual voice recording of Ford ordering Lisi to get back the video? I don't think so. TPS have the phone records showing calls between Ford and Lisi right after Gawker broke the story. It's very clear that Lisi got involved because of Ford, and with Lisi's record, Rob had to know that it could get ugly. The cops have everything they need to get Ford, I think they're just waiting for the final nail looking through Lisi's phone records. At this point it really doesn't matter, Ford is done, whether he's arrested or not. It's just a matter of time, and October is fast approaching.

To answer your question: An actual voice recording is the sort of evidence the TPS needs. The phone records are not conclusive. Connecting the dots is what you do when all you have is circumstantial evidence and, when the dots can be explained away by a different theory, the so-called evidence will not secure a conviction.

Example. Within minutes after Ford called Lisi, Lisi started to try to find the video. Does this prove Ford asked him to retrieve it? No. Ford could have called Lisi to say "Some guy just called me about some video of me smoking crack. Do you know anything about it?" The words that Ford exchanged with Lisi and other calls at that time are absolutely crucial to establishing that he asked Lisi to get the video or that he asked staff to ask Lisi to get the video.

Tom Beyer's phone records were also seized. Perhaps Beyer's abrupt resignation from Ford's staff indicates something. He knew Lisi and is a friend of Dave Price's. Could he be willing to turn Queen's Evidence? Does he have anything helpful to the TPS? He's about the only hope on the extortion charge unless Lisi suddenl;y changes his mind and rats.

 

[jml]

Tom Beyer's phone records were also seized. Perhaps Beyer's abrupt resignation from Ford's staff indicates something. He knew Lisi and is a friend of Dave Price's. Could he be willing to turn Queen's Evidence? Does he have anything helpful to the TPS? He's about the only hope on the extortion charge unless Lisi suddenl;y changes his mind and rats.

I doubt it. The ITO describes Beyer as one of Ford's closer friends in the office. Unless they've got something highly incriminating on him, which I doubt, I can't imagine he'd talk.

 

[LowPolygon]

Speaking of timing, he apparently held back his previous column where the OPP dismisses the investigation for a few weeks. His OPP source gave him that stuff weeks ago but he timed it to come out now for some reason.

Jimmi,
can you clear some space in your mailbox? i can't PM you.
thanks,

 

[Dubster]

Jimmi,
can you clear some space in your mailbox? i can't PM you.
thanks,

Hey man, that's no fun for the rest of us!

 

[JasonParis]

I am unlurking (from a very long time reading this thread with great amusement) to say that he's completely unpopular in Milton. I just moved here from Toronto via NYC, we are definitely not poor, and I'm a sixth-generation Canadian. Most of my neighbours aren't immigrants, either. Ethnically diverse, sure. But nobody I've spoken to in Milton is pro-Ford. I wish I could vote in October. A lot of people in Milton do. Please don't paint Miltonites (?) with a Ford-supporting brush. It's just not true. /rant /$0.02 /backtolurking /reluctant905er

I think you over-stated my perhaps broad brush strokes. Point taken though.

 

[pud99]

During the course of the investigation the police heard Lisi talk about dirty cops loyal to Ford.

It wasn't Lisi who was wiretapped saying that.

 

[edmundoconnor]

There's a lot of "spite" support for Ford among Sun commenters. The only (somewhat) comforting factor is that many of these morons appear to live outside of Toronto, and so won't be able to vote in October.

If they own property in the City of Toronto and they are Canadian citizens, they can. Hence the reason Chow has been talking to the South China Morning Post about the Toronto municipal election(!) as ex-pat Canadians in Hong Kong can vote in the election, provided they get their paperwork in order. Granted, a lot of the 905 commenters probably don't own property in Toronto, but it's a useful reminder of how municipal elections are a little different than provincial or federal ones.

 

[OSS 117]

you know people dont support ford because they like him. They support ford because they hate you.

This is exactly correct. People need to remember this the next time they're around "friends" or family members who support Ford.

 

[Huge Seagull]

Check out Jeet Heer on Twitter for some thoughts on Robbie's 'gangster' style of governance. Must-read.

 

[themarc]

Geez - Ford on CP24 doing the "Clean Toronto" launch - and he's in the spirit with both sides of his collar trying to take flight. What a slob.

 

[pud99]