Roads: Six Points Interchange Reconfiguration (City of Toronto, UC)

[interchange42]

When I worked in the area, I had the easiest route through the interchange: westbound on Dundas through the interchange to stay on Dundas towards Highway 427. I liked that there was no traffic signal until Aukland. However, there was one feature that I hated on Dundas eastbound through the interchange: the ramp from Kipling onto Dundas eastbound. I was driving the speed limit on Dundas at the interchange (60 km/h), when a driver who didn't yield drove slowly into my lane from the ramp. I braked hard and swerved into the other lane to avoid a collision. It was the worst-case scenario short of a collision.

After that incident, I drove more cautiously through the interchange knowing the higher risk of collisions and tried to use the right lane whenever driving by the ramp. But I saw the same thing happen to other drivers. A ramp requiring drivers to merge into the left lane on a curving road with a 60 km/h speed limit is hardly a good design. It's easy for drivers to miss approaching vehicles because of the curve. I look forward to seeing the new grid of streets and development to improve safety, and to create a sense of community and place in the area.

Yup - that one's bad, hence my note about continuing to Dunbloor and going north on it to get to Dundas. That's not the only bad move here though; there's a very quick merge from northbound Kipling onto eastbound Dundas which must have caused some fender benders over the years.

The more I look at it, the more I have to admire the work of genius that this interchange is. At least in those days.

It is a pretty cool set of ramps in a fairly small space. It worked better way-back-when, when traffic was lighter. What it has done over the years, however, (and I know you're not arguing this), is stymie the development of a sub-centre for Etobicoke that Metro Plan called for decades ago. The railway cutting diagonally across Bloor between Islington and Kipling has always complicated that too. It will probably take a decade for a downtown to develop here, but I'm keen to see what we end up with. Here's hoping that the architecture of the new Etobicoke Civic Centre will be something handsome enough to inspire following buildings in the area to be more like it, and less like the Pemberton Port Royal junk to the immediate east.

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[Midtown Urbanist]

I see the potential for a critical mass of people and density forming in central Etobicoke. You have the existing density between Kipling and Islington, the coming density already underway between Cloverdale and Kipling along Dundas, and the future development of the land parcels being opened up by the Six Points reconfiguration. If the Six Points succeeds in creating an attractive urban environment, I forsee the area having the required density to support commercial uses like restaurants, shops, bars, etc.

 

[Cityminded]

I'll miss being able to take Bloor westbound from Islington and continue on Dundas straight to the 427.

I understand it makes sense to have Bloor continuous again. I just don't like the fact that Dundas is getting all chopped up.

I’m also disappointed that Dundas Street will remain disfigured. The design purist in me just wants these three streets to intersect the way they were supposed to – in an actual “Six Points” pattern that would feel like a real crossroads and urban focal point, which is the result we say we want. Yes traffic flow would take a back seat to urban form and place-making, but if we look at the great urban spaces anywhere this is often the case.

 

[Johnny Au]

It was a missed opportunity to make this intersection a roundabout.

 

[junctionist]

I thought so too at first. But a single large intersection or roundabout wouldn't be pedestrian friendly, which is one of the main goals of the project.

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

Would we place a giant statue of Rob Ford in the middle of said roundabout?

 

[darth_freeman]

If the Six Points succeeds in creating an attractive urban environment, I forsee the area having the required density to support commercial uses like restaurants, shops, bars, etc.

Believe it or not: restaurants, shops, bars already exist in Etobicoke!

It was a missed opportunity to make this intersection a roundabout.

Traffic studies showed traffic volumes were too high to support roundabouts here, and had negative impacts for cycling, pedestrians, etc. Also less space for future development.

 

[Edllguy]

For those in the know is it possible to have a public square incorporated into the design of six points? I would say something like Younge/Dundas square or Oakville/Lakeshore Town Square. Could it be incorporated into the new Etobicoke Civic Centre?

I think it would a missed opportunity if they didn't include some type of meeting place for the public. It could be used for festivals, concerts, protests, and other community events. Below the square they could have underground Green P parking.

 

[Steve X]

It was a missed opportunity to make this intersection a roundabout.

A roundabout would not work, it will have to be a traffic circle with signalization. A two lane roundabout would need a reserved medium for buses and large vehicles to assist them to proceed safely through the roundabout. Plus buses and trucks would have to hog both lanes prior to entering the roundabout to be able to proceed safely. It simply won't work in this case.

The recent roundabouts built in Mississauga (although only one lane roundabout) has a concrete medium circle for buses (especially artics). E.g.

 

[Towered]

For those in the know is it possible to have a public square incorporated into the design of six points? I would say something like Younge/Dundas square or Oakville/Lakeshore Town Square. Could it be incorporated into the new Etobicoke Civic Centre?

I think it would a missed opportunity if they didn't include some type of meeting place for the public. It could be used for festivals, concerts, protests, and other community events. Below the square they could have underground Green P parking.

I do believe that there is a plan for such a public square as part of the new civic centre.

 

[crs1026]

Looks like the answer to this is just around the corner.

- Paul

 

[crs1026]

More info - seems the competing designs will be presented in April, final decision in September to be approved by Council Oct 2nd

http://www.villageofislington.com/files/ECCDesignComp_PublicPresInvitation2017.jpg

- Paul

 

[44 North]

This is fairly exciting. Hopefully they'll have models. In a way though I'm a bit surprised there will only be five designs to choose from. Thought with something major and public like this design teams around the world would scramble over themselves to offer up ideas for the public to see. And from a few dozen that would lead to a shortlisted five. I believe that's how Toronto City Hall came to be.

 

[Edllguy]

Enjoyed the presentation tonight on the design competition for the new Etobicoke Civic Centre at Six Points.

I liked presentation #2 ECC model with the pop up stage and winter toboggan hill made over the stairs/steps.

I really liked the suggestion at the end by someone in the audience that said it would be great if we had a pedestrian path system under six points that connects to Kipling subway entrance. However, when discussed with a build toronto representative the cost would have been prohibitive and it would need to be designed and implemented before the road construction starts. However, he did say they are trying to have some path/above ground tunnel through YMCA building to at least have some coverage from the elements when walking to the ECC.

What was your favourite design?

 

[aquateam]

Traffic studies showed traffic volumes were too high to support roundabouts here, and had negative impacts for cycling, pedestrians, etc. Also less space for future development.

But space for a statue. Something like this but with Rob and Doug Ford instead:

For those in the know is it possible to have a public square incorporated into the design of six points? I would say something like Younge/Dundas square or Oakville/Lakeshore Town Square. Could it be incorporated into the new Etobicoke Civic Centre?

I think it would a missed opportunity if they didn't include some type of meeting place for the public. It could be used for festivals, concerts, protests, and other community events. Below the square they could have underground Green P parking.

I do believe that there is a plan for such a public square as part of the new civic centre.

"Rob Ford Square"? "Respect for Taxpayers Town Centre"? "Gravy hill"? Etobicoke needs to commemorate its prodigal son(s).

The lack of direct connection to Kipling station is disappointing.