They actually aren't that bad now. I think as part of the deal with the province for the extension and the additional toll highways being added the price structure was changed. Plus also the Canada pension plan is apparently a share holder in it now.
Really? Isn't the extension owned by the province? Don't see how it affects much.
Having a moderate toll will still reduce some discretionary trips. Right now, driving is cheaper than GO train. Even a 10 cent/km could change equation in favour of GO for a lot of commuters. If every highway is tolled, then the overall traffic on the roads will reduce. We may not have free flowing traffic throughout the day on 407 but we will reduce congestion on every single highway to some extent.
How about a compromise? We implement a congestion charge in downtown immediately, and implement a toll on the 400 series once RER is done.
When it costs more than twice the minimum hourly wage to drive for an hour on the highway, something doesn't add up.
(Of course it's rare for anyone to drive 100km regularly on the 407, but the rate still stands)
My issue is not the tolls, or its level, but where the tolls are going. In 2019, toll revenue was $1.5 billion, and profits were $600 million. It would take 50 years to recuperate those profits (assuming we pay in cash, which is unlikely). However, the lease has 70 years left, so we'd make $10 billion dollars. Of course, that's back-of-the-napkin math. If we implemented a toll(that was less, of course) on other roads that would first pay for the 407, then go towards transit or whatever, it suddenly looks better for mobility.
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/covid-19-takes-a-big-bite-out-of-highway-407-traffic-revenues-and-profits-1.5399014
If the 401 to 410/427/400 traffic continues to increase then we may need 8 lanes in rural area. For example I-5 is 8 lane for a long distance in the rural areas far away from any major city (
check here).
Here, we are talking about a highway that is "inside" GTA, even if that particular stretch may be rural.
That section is the only freeway between LA and SF, the 2nd and 12th largest cities in the US, with a combined population of (including major cities en route but excluding Sacramento), 22 million people, which is more than Central Canada.
That entire area from 401-407 interchange up through Bolton has been designated for development for years
So ... we un-designate it?
Nashville Conservation area is a concern for sure but there should be ways to minimize any impact traversing that area. Ultimately, if the goal with this highway is to help move goods through areas already designated largely for industrial development, then it is a net gain for the region.
Minimize sprawl, maybe? I've commented on the excessively wide corridor, but here, I'm returning (like a broken record, some would say), to sprawl. The area south of there is still forested, what happens then?
A truck only road would be better, maybe. I wouldn't believe it though.
If we're talking about farmland, the majority of owners in southern Caledon have already sold or will be selling off their land, especially as it becomes more apparent that the stretch from Georgetown to Bolton will be developed.
It's apparent because the government designated it as apparent, and because we don't do anything against it. If that area is no longer apparently going to be developed, we will be able to buy the land/farmers will be able to buy the land to turn it back into farmland/protected areas.
The Escarpment itself also acts a a physical barrier to development so the idea that this project will lead to unfettered sprawl is a bit overblown IMO.
The Escarpment sure didn't stop Hamilton, Waterdown, and Dundas, from sprawling. Besides, that's a lot of sprawl. We'd be as bad as Houston, Dallas, Phoenix, and other sprawl-y American cities.
This government and other successors should really focus on enhancing the GTA's existing highway network by gradually buying out the lease agreements for the 407 starting in the west end.
You can theoretically negotiate with the 407 consortium, but I doubt they'd give you anything unless you paid them.
407 through Halton should connect with the existing 403 through Mississauga thus creating a continuous 403 route from Woodstock to the 401 in Mississauga.
It does. What are you trying to say?
I think de-privatizing that segment is absolutely vital moving forward to relieve congestion on the QEW which will only get worse in the coming decade. If the 413 is going to move forward, it would make sense to connect it directly to the N-S 407 and N-S 403 through Mississauga to create a direct link to the 401, 403 and QEW.
We could run 10 minute service on Lakeshore West .
We could run frequent bus service with fare integration.
We could have flying cars (and probably will before the 407 is returned to the province).
I think it already will connect with the 407 in that segment. But building it further is duplication, and again, I doubt YR/Brampton - Hamilton/Halton demand is really strong enough to need an entire freeway.
How the government would go about repossessing the remaining ~100 km of 407 through the GTA remains to be seen but I think many voters would not be opposed to that sort of infrastructural pursuit through important highway corridors.
I did the math above; very few voters would not get sticker shock at $32 billion dollars, even if it will make money very far into the future. GTA West, as stupid as it is, would cost less.
The 407 is a key corridor that would help alleviate key E-W routes through the GTA.
No argument there.
The point of the new highway is to carry a significant number of additional trips though the region, both existing latent demand and the demand growth expected with the further development of the City. Not to mention the increasing need for infrastructure for goods and services movement throughout the GTA. While it would be great to support alternative modes, and we absolutely must, the need for accommodating increasing vehicular trips should not be ignored.
I would argue the opposite, if the new highway wouldn't be used there would be no point building it. The fact that it will become eventually clogged indicates a need for the connection and capacity. Perhaps over time, Eglinton LRT and the Ontario Line will become at capacity and clogged, is that not indicative of a successful project?
Is that success desirable? Or are there better, less polluting, more efficient ways to move private traffic? I have doubts that there are 50,000 trucks a day on that corridor, the 401 has that many vehicles in the rural areas.