SaugeenJunction
Senior Member
What this new highway would really help with is movement of goods. I'm no fan of new highways, but the GTA West seems to fill a gap in the network and would help trucks bypass the core of the GTA.
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What this new highway would really help with is movement of goods. I'm no fan of new highways, but the GTA West seems to fill a gap in the network and would help trucks bypass the core of the GTA.
Leo_Chan
Senior Member
This is a good point. And I would like to bring up another, trucks not serving the GTA should take the 407, not the 401. However, you know this will be blamed on tolls.
BurlOak
Senior Member
Are you saying that production facilities cannot move their good on GO trains. That goes against the thinking of some.
Bureaucromancer
Active Member
I really question how much of a bypass this is. In terms of overall traffic, how much is REALLY coming from the west and headed north? The 407 at least has potential as a bypass for cargo moving through Toronto east to west, but the GTA west is, imo, too far north for traffic headed east and ultimately dumps it back onto the 400 and 401 at their worst points anyway.
Again I'm left thinking the REALLY useful truck route is the mid peninsula.
GTA West does, and always has, seemed like a project aimed at exurban developers.
Again I'm left thinking the REALLY useful truck route is the mid peninsula.
GTA West does, and always has, seemed like a project aimed at exurban developers.
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salsa
Senior Member
If the province puts tolls on it like with the 407 extension, the actual outcome will probably be underwhelming.
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Agreed in all counts. A GTA bypass which doesn't connect to the 401 on both ends really isn't a bypass. The 407 wasn't really an effective bypass for Trans-GTA travel until the 407 East and 412 opened. It was primarily a commuter highway (and still is).
I in theory support the Mid-Peninsula Highway, but like many here the environmental impacts may be too high. If it were built, I would like to see it connect to the 401 east of Cambridge though.
BurlOak
Senior Member
Bureaucromancer
Active Member
Beat me to it, was going to try and map it all this weekend. In short, yup. I'd quibble with those secondaries north of Hamilton (upgrading 34 between Cambridge and Guelph would seem very useful, and 5 should probably be a full 400 series Hamilton Bypass, possibly redirecting the 408 farther west toward Brantford) to, but this is how these things fit together in a coherent way.
I do see it as reasonably possible to break this into the 408 and its connections and the 457 and its, but repeat that either without all of the components is seriously questionable in value, the 408 remains more important, and both are stomach turning in their implications.
I do see it as reasonably possible to break this into the 408 and its connections and the 457 and its, but repeat that either without all of the components is seriously questionable in value, the 408 remains more important, and both are stomach turning in their implications.
narduch
Senior Member
I just don't think you can build the York Region portion. The locals would fight hard against that
Northern Light
Superstar
Ya know, if all these highways near the GTA were tolled, the traffic volume would drop materially, as would congestion............subject to having any spare transit capacity to absorb some of the shift. But hey toll revenue could pay for that!
Neutrino
Senior Member
Wouldn't all the parallel arterial roads just be clogged to high heaven?
Northern Light
Superstar
I don't think so. Surely some would be, for a time.....
But in general studies show road diets (which actually reduces nominal road capacity) don't cause jams.
Instead, people find different routes and methods of travel; or in some cases, over time, shift jobs or homes to reduce commute times.
But mostly people find alternate routes (that have to work as well for time) or they choose transit instead.
But as noted, that necessitates one have spare room in transit capacity to accommodate a shift.
If, for instance, one tolled the 401 from the 410 to the 412, I would not imagine that shifting much long-haul traffic as there is no viable alternative road or transit.
Though a small amount might switch to 407 if the toll was comparable.
But I imagine many shorter trips where there were practical alternatives would switch.
If you're trip is Brampton to DT and you use 410 to 401 to 427 to Gardiner..........the K-W GO line should be a very good alternative. But obviously one would have to run more trains at greater frequency, and there would have to be much better
transit service to the stations.
BurlOak
Senior Member
Likely.
- This rough route really only infringes on Oak Ridges, and possibly a few wealthy houses on K-V road.
- The least worst route would be Roughly following King-Vaughan Road, then just south of Bathurst Glen Golf course and south of Bond Lake and parallel (and just north of) Stouffville Road. From highway 404 (Gormley), there are no major obstacles to get to highway 407/412 (and 412 would be extended to join Highway 12 just north of Brooklyn).
- There are no other options south of Newmarket, and because of the farming of the Holland Marsh, likely the Bradford By-Pass north of Bradford is the only choice.
I always happy if someone take my ideas and improves on them - and hopefully has better graphic skills.
Bureaucromancer
Active Member
Bringing the GTA West corridor farther north to the Bradford Bypass seems like a potentially good option to me.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
I never understood the mid peninsula. To make it useful you would need to cut through the escarpment with major environmental impacts for a marginal improvement of traffic in an area that isn't really that congested.
I wouldn't mind seeing a widening of the QEW through Stoney Creek maybe and an upgrading of 6 to a RIRO - but I don't see a need for more than that.
A Cambridge - Brantford highway could be useful too, but a super two connecting from the 8/401 interchange to Wayne Gretzky Parkway in Brantford would probably be more than enough. Maybe make plans for it to eventually be upgraded to a 400 series highway.
another little pet project I'd like to see for personal reasons is to see the Caledonia Bypass connected with 6N around the Hamilton Airport and see the long ago planned Highway 6 upgrade to at least past Hagersville. The slog down to Lake Erie on Highway 6 could be a whole lot quicker with those upgrades.
I wouldn't mind seeing a widening of the QEW through Stoney Creek maybe and an upgrading of 6 to a RIRO - but I don't see a need for more than that.
A Cambridge - Brantford highway could be useful too, but a super two connecting from the 8/401 interchange to Wayne Gretzky Parkway in Brantford would probably be more than enough. Maybe make plans for it to eventually be upgraded to a 400 series highway.
another little pet project I'd like to see for personal reasons is to see the Caledonia Bypass connected with 6N around the Hamilton Airport and see the long ago planned Highway 6 upgrade to at least past Hagersville. The slog down to Lake Erie on Highway 6 could be a whole lot quicker with those upgrades.