Roads: Gardiner Expressway

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

So the Gardiner Hybrid passes and I'm still alive and the city isn't burning to the ground. Guess it wasn't so monumental.

Yet, apparently you're still a jerk that feels the need to rub things in others' faces. So, SNAFU, right?

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

"One Toronto" was a lie from the day he stacked his executive with suburban loyalists.

“Scarborough deserves a subway just like everybody else. When I’m at the end of the line, and its finally my turn to get my share of the pie, not even an equal share of the pie, just a little bit of the pie, it’s very upsetting for Scarborough residents and politicians to hear politicians from downtown Toronto being very selfish, very self-centered, saying ‘nothing for Scarborough, everything for our people."

- Glen De Baeremaeker, asking for a 4th station on the Scarb subway

De Baeremaeker has lost all my goodwill.

I thought that just maybe I could give him the benefit of the doubt that he was still a good councilor and was just being opportunistic with the subway. The Gardiner vote proved there is nothing worth to praise and he is just another regressive simpleminded suburban councilor.

I don't think the Gardiner vote changed my views on any other councilors though.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

I certainly won't be making the mistake of voting for Tory again.

I think you should probably wait for a couple of years on that. And see who the other candidates are.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I'm a Chow/NDP Supporter that DID vote for him. It was a strategic vote to save us from Ford(s).

The good thing about the Fords is that they're generally too stupid to implement their agenda.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

This is exactly right. Everyone who thought Tory would be the saviour from Ford, doesn't realize that a) Ford would have a much harder time passing things through council than Tory could, b) it is (and was) known that Tory has, for the most part, the same beliefs and values that the Fords do, but is a much better liar, and most importantly c) Due to the strength of incumbency, we've pretty much given Tory as much time in office as he wants

Bravo!

Y'all need to take a pill. Breathe.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Enjoy your 5-6% property tax increase for 2016, Toronto.

You worked hard for it--you deserve it.

View attachment 48331

You're kidding me. Is there seriously a 6% tax increase? I've never heard of this.

I sincerely hope you're joking

 

[ttk77]

I think you should probably wait for a couple of years on that. And see who the other candidates are.

If we have ranked balloting as it looks like we might I won't have to worry about strategic voting as much and I have full confidence that there will be a center-left or left candidate that I'll find more appealing than John Tory.

It's sounding like there may still be a chance to defeat this in September, so I remain hopeful.

 

[pman]

If we have ranked balloting as it looks like we might I won't have to worry about strategic voting as much and I have full confidence that there will be a center-left or left candidate that I'll find more appealing than John Tory.

It's sounding like there may still be a chance to defeat this in September, so I remain hopeful.

Another source of hope is the City's complete inability to build anything on time and anywhere near budget. Given Toronto's track record the hybrid might not be complete until 2025, by which point the original Gardiner might have fallen down and Tory/DMW might have retired.

 

[11th]

Enjoy your 5-6% property tax increase for 2016, Toronto.

You worked hard for it--you deserve it.

That map's not even a good argument. Using that, you can say the portion of 427 south of 401 has light traffic.
And, can someone do the math of how much money will have to be spent on maintenance during the 90+ years after the "hybrid" plan's carried out?

 

[Lenser]

I have to say I'm disappointed with the result but not terribly surprised. I view it as a squandered opportunity that Torontonians will come to regret. Still, I look forward to development at the Unilever site.

On the other hand, I'm heartened by the strength of the opposition to the so-called "hybrid" option. It means that council will continue to be fractious, but at this point it's pretty clear that Tory will never be any kind of unifying force. The weaker he is, the better off the city is... it limits the extent of damage he can wreak. Not that a state of inertia is a good thing for the city's government, mind you... I'd simply rather suffer under a bad yet hobbled mayor than an atrocious one with free reign.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

I have to say I'm disappointed with the result but not terribly surprised. I view it as a squandered opportunity that Torontonians will come to regret. Still, I look forward to development at the Unilever site.

On the other hand, I'm heartened by the strength of the opposition to the so-called "hybrid" option. It means that council will continue to be fractious, but at this point it's pretty clear that Tory will never be any kind of unifying force. The weaker he is, the better off the city is... it limits the extent of damage he can wreak. Not that a state of inertia is a good thing for the city's government, mind you... I'd simply rather suffer under a bad yet hobbled mayor than an atrocious one with free reign.

Yup, not the slightest bit surprised about the outcome. Say this - the expressway can't last forever and at some point it will be uneconomical to maintain - it will meet its' end in its' current form one way or another.

And, can someone do the math of how much money will have to be spent on maintenance during the 90+ years after the "hybrid" plan's carried out?

In all likelihood, above the estimate we had now.

De Baeremaeker has lost all my goodwill.

Well, if his performance during the subway debate hasn't already.

AoD

 

[TrickyRicky]

Let me take a slightly different take on this,

First, council actually had the balls to make a decision and that really surprised me. It could be the right or wrong decision but frankly council has not had the guts to make many decisions of this kind over the last few years.

Second, let me suggest that the city versus suburb model is not applicable here. It is more applicable to view the city as a three cities model. There are the Outer 401 suburbs, the Inner 401 Suburbs, and the Central City. I suggested this model when we were analyzing the previous mayoral election. Tory represents not the suburbs, but the Inner 401 suburbs. His tenure as Mayor should be viewed as timely precisely because the greatest city building endeavours of our time are concentrated not in the declining Outer 401 suburbs (as in Ford's Term as Mayor) or in the Central city (that is the primary area of ascendancy in terms of growth and development) but in the Inner 401 Suburban wards. Not only is this timely, it is right. The central city is not and should not be the focus of the greater city at this time. The future success of the city will not be determined by the central waterfront or central neighbourhood densification but by the urbanization of the areas of the Inner 401 suburbs. The hyrbrid option in this exercise is the preferred option from an Inner 401 suburb perspective.

From a central city perspective I think it is hard to swallow my analysis above (I live in Downtown West) because central city people tend to want to view the city through an international lense and wanted this vote to be congruent with international trends and standards. Fair enough; however, I would remind us that time and time again Toronto makes such "backward" and unfashionable decisions and yet remains one of the top cities in the world in liveability, a liveability that does not end at Eglington or the Don Valley in it's calculation. Cities around the world may be demolishing or burying highways as is fashionable at our time but it does nothing to help them become more liveable than Toronto.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

What does the Gardinee have to do with the densification of the inner 401?

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

What does the Gardinee have to do with the densification of the inner 401?

Indeed - if anything, he'd be more likely to kow-tow to anti-development forces in the inner 401 given that's his base.

AoD

 

[Napoleon]

As a former San Francisco resident, I definitely find this vote stunning. Not that this land is nearly as prime as the Embarcadero, but still a shocking turn of events.

Now SF had some pretty ridiculous city council members, but I have to say listening to the live stream of the debate, Toronto definitely has council members that are just shockingly unqualified. Policy positions that are inconsistent (Colle wanting to both maintain and sell it), speeches that are just incoherent (DiGorgio), a ridiculous desire to just not want to believe data (many of them when given a fact just made up their own version), Karygiannis (tunnels, tunnels, tunnels...why not throw in a monorail). And Tory was willing to do whatever it took to get his way...so much political capital expended. Amazing, embarrassing.