Premier Doug Ford's Ontario

[Jasmine18]

Reservation would seem to be the most appropriate - it doesn't necessarily create a permanent override of the legislation - but dealt with the immediate issue of the upcoming November election. At issue isn't the reach of provincial power - but the timing of it. It also provides an immediate check on the urge to wantonly use s33.

AoD

Then who is the stop a future federal govt from using such powers to stop provinces in the other direction when Conservatives are in charge federally?

You do realize as Ford Opens Pandora's box, Trudeau would open another and any future federal govt would cite Trudeau's use as an example.

I think you guys need to remember that grand extreme uses of govt powers is something that destabilizes countries then makes them stronger.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Dougie just doesn't care about any of it. This morning on CP24 he was once again complaining about the appointing vs the election of judges and said something along the lines of "judge and jury are elected every four years". Deity save us.

Yeah, I almost cried yesterday when he was going on about this during his press conference. Saying how he found it to be terrifying that an appointed judge would overrule the unconstitutional intentions of an elected premier.

It's enough to make one go mad. What's terrifying is this clown trying to play off his unconstitutional policy as somehow being legitimate because of his having been elected in our highly flawed electoral system.

We have here a premier who is in charge of a minority rule government (like those dicks in South Africa way back when also had) making these sorts of decisions and then trying to make it seem as if he's there for the people whilst pissing on the constitutional rights and obligations of those same people and trying to make the upholders of the constitution (the courts) look like the enemy of the people.

It's classic autocratic behaviour. I can't believe people are going for this guy's rubbish. He's extremely transparent, but it requires a bit of critical thought and freethinking to see it.

 

[SunriseChampion]

The Legal issues over the carbon tax are a sideshow...

Currently, the carbon tax is pretty much nearly dead federally due to political issues.

No it's not. Currently, it's about to be imposed on the entire country in spite of some provinces' leaders being obdurate fools stuck in the past. Those provinces who don't implement their own policy in this regard will have one imposed on them by the federal government.

Don't worry, it's "elected" folk doing the imposition, and not some rotten judicial wardens of the constitution.

Mind you, it'll be a minority rule government doing the imposition so I'm not sure how cool some people will be with that. Elected? Sort-of-elected? Elected-by-some-whilst-judges-are-not?
Whatever flavour of absurdity you choose can apply.

 

[SunriseChampion]

I think you guys need to remember that grand extreme uses of govt powers is something that destabilizes countries then makes them stronger.

You don't say!

Mind telling Doug Ford this?

 

[SunriseChampion]

And.............the lawsuits continue!

This time Greenpeace is suing over the end of Cap and Trade, arguing the absence of consultation was in violation of Ontario's own Environmental Bill of Rights.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toro...ncellation-of-cap-and-trade-program-1.4819250

Great! More judges making judgments as to the legality of the "elected" government's policies. Undemocratic! If it isn't imposed by a government who 35% of voters who voted elected, it's just undemocratic!

 

[Jasmine18]

No it's not. Currently, it's about to be imposed on the entire country in spite of some provinces' leaders being obdurate fools stuck in the past. Those provinces who don't implement their own policy in this regard will have one imposed on them by the federal government.

Don't worry, it's "elected" folk doing the imposition, and not some rotten judicial wardens of the constitution.

Mind you, it'll be a minority rule government doing the imposition so I'm not sure how cool some people will be with that. Elected? Sort-of-elected? Elected-by-some-whilst-judges-are-not?
Whatever flavour of absurdity you choose can apply.

https://globalnews.ca/news/4420844/alberta-climate-change-plan-federal-justin-trudeau/

Ontario, SK and AB are out, PEI and Manitoba and other provinces plans are nowhere near what the federal govt asked for...

There was a 09/01 deadline imposed by the federal govt and it has passed and the Federal govt has been 'crickets' since.
https://globalnews.ca/news/3929307/carbon-price-plan-deadline/

The reason it is dead for now is that Trudeau rather have the next election about Trump and NAFTA then about taxes and imposing a tax onto seat-rich Ontario with an election 12 months away, ha not happening my friend lol.

Why on earth would he give the federal Tories a clear wedge issue to get support over lol.


So the Carbon tax is dead politically until after the election.

 

[King of Kensington]

Ford = the Orban of Ontario.

 

[Northern Light]

The Legal issues over the carbon tax are a sideshow...

Currently, the carbon tax is pretty much nearly dead federally due to political issues.

Perhaps, except this wasn't a carbon tax (yes it was designed to achieve the same thing, w/similar consequences).

But this was Cap and Trade.

Regardless, the issue raised is whether the government violated its own law in the manner of terminating the program.

There is no suggestion they don't have the right to wind down the program, in an orderly, legal fashion.

Worth noting here, while I am a champion of eco causes, I was not a fan of the cap and trade scheme, I prefer different means to achieve the objective in question.

Though I oppose the Ford plan on the basis both of its legal impropriety and the fact no alternative scheme has even been presented, let alone implemented.

What has happened here, is again reckless, bordering on wilful ignorance of basic procedure.

I'm unclear on whether people in the current government are really that obtuse (seems unlikely, the premier aside) or whether they chose to go this course
notwithstanding the very serious problems with it. (more likely).

I assume they felt there was political expediency in this course.

I would beg to differ, and add that it shouldn't matter, one must comply w/the law, and all they needed to do in this case was amend the EBR at the same time.

If nothing else, the government is guilty of being lazy; but I would consider less kind terminology.

 

[Northern Light]

Then who is the stop a future federal govt from using such powers to stop provinces in the other direction when Conservatives are in charge federally?

You do realize as Ford Opens Pandora's box, Trudeau would open another and any future federal govt would cite Trudeau's use as an example.

I think you guys need to remember that grand extreme uses of govt powers is something that destabilizes countries then makes them stronger.

Who would disagree?

But is the alternative any better?

Allowing a provincial government to flaunt the constitution is not in the best interest of a stable, harmonious country either.

We are entering a realm of choices between bad and worse.

 

[SunriseChampion]

So, I saw some random interview with Brian Mulroney, and I'm quite sure he's willing to disown his sycophantic waste of a daughter.
I would. Ignore the dumb t*** til she stops being so disgustingly subservient to an autocratic man-child.

Trudeau is hilarious on the issue as well. He's turned into a spineless tit this close to a federal election. His last move of decisive action was an idiotic and ill-timed nationalisation of an oil pipeline and now he's trying to hide so as to retain power, presumably so he can lie about something other than electoral reform.

Meanwhile, Tory doesn't know who else to moan to and still won't tell Ford to suck his m****.

So, we're left with a situation where the idiots have taken over.....with the full support of a third of the population, mind you, which of course makes it all perfectly legitimate.

 

[Jasmine18]

Why would anyone expect Trudeau to go into a constitutional issue,

if far more capable leaders of the past had a hard time dealing with such issues ^^^

Who would disagree?

But is the alternative any better?

Allowing a provincial government to flaunt the constitution is not in the best interest of a stable, harmonious country either.

We are entering a realm of choices between bad and worse.

The failsafe of section 33 is any party has to face the voters and its up to the voters to keep Politicans in check.

and I dont think you make a country more stable by bringing back a mechanism to circumvent the separation of federal and provincial powers.

I think the problem is that you only this such a use of federal power is correct because of the people in charge (Liberals).

If Trudeau uses a historic power over the size of a city council, what you think future federal govts could do over bigger issues? I think you can see what kind of a mess that can make.

I dont think you stop pandora's box by opening another.

 

[Admiral Beez]

So, I saw some random interview with Brian Mulroney, and I'm quite sure he's willing to disown his sycophantic waste of a daughter.
I would. Ignore the dumb t*** til she stops being so disgustingly subservient to an autocratic man-child.

Trudeau is hilarious on the issue as well. He's turned into a spineless tit this close to a federal election. His last move of decisive action was an idiotic and ill-timed nationalisation of an oil pipeline and now he's trying to hide so as to retain power, presumably so he can lie about something other than electoral reform.

Meanwhile, Tory doesn't know who else to moan to and still won't tell Ford to suck his m****.

So, we're left with a situation where the idiots have taken over.....with the full support of a third of the population, mind you, which of course makes it all perfectly legitimate.

What's dumb t***, m**** and why are we talking tits?

Seems like UT is harboring some misogamy.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Then who is the stop a future federal govt from using such powers to stop provinces in the other direction when Conservatives are in charge federally?

You do realize as Ford Opens Pandora's box, Trudeau would open another and any future federal govt would cite Trudeau's use as an example.

I think you guys need to remember that grand extreme uses of govt powers is something that destabilizes countries then makes them stronger.

Nothing - just like there is nothing stopping future Conservatives from using it if they deemed it is in their interest. It isn't even like they are new to creating constitutional crisis (think Prorogation in 08)

AoD

 

[christiesplits]

I would be stunned if more than two or three MPPs (likely backbenchers) in the PC caucus vote against the bill. There needs to be roughly 12 votes against in his caucus for the bill to fail.

Yes, it's a "free vote," but to get in the good graces of Ford, and try and get plum committee, parliamentary assistant and cabinet roles, you have to fall in line, especially this soon following an election.

 

[sixrings]

no different then when people threw away a good lrt plan and voted for subways subways subways to earn robs trust