Post: Canon Canada moves HQ downtown

[299 bloor call control.]

not to mention that more and more companies are moving into a time where they are starting to shed older employees who are entering retirement and have to be able to attract the younger, post grad crowd in their companies who very simply do not want to be sitting in a car for hours commuting...

 

[scarberiankhatru]

People live where they do because of their jobs and/or because of family and friends...only a small number of people seek out downtown, which is why such a tiny minority of this city's population lives there.

 

[Lone Primate]

Um, hello, GO train?

The GO train also runs TO 905.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

The GO train is also useless to anyone not living along the Lakeshore lines...it's a joke in York Region.

 

[theman23]

The GO train also runs TO 905.

Uhh...that would only be convenient if you lived in south Toronto or worked from the hours of 5pm-9am.

 

[Lone Primate]

Lone Primate, you make it seem like the 905 is an oasis of easy commuting and people can easily access their workplaces. The traffic in the 905 is brutal. And what if you lived in Mississauga but worked for Canon in Markham. How is it easier to commute to Markham than to Bloor and Church? At least there are a ton more public transit options to get downtown than to Markham.

RJ, I've lived in 905 and I've lived in 416. I've worked in 905 and I've worked in 416. As it turns out, whichever I lived in at any given time, I usually worked in the other. I still do. This I can tell you from personal experience: it's a lot easier getting around in 905. It's a lot easier getting to 905. And as a matter of fact, I actually DID used to live in Mississauga and work in Markham, ironically enough. It was a long drive but not a hard one. But why drive a longer distance than you have to? Luckily for me, it was feasible for me to move closer to work. But I see the traffic on the 404 every day; you'd never get me to agree to drive it southbound every morning, no matter what the money. I work to live, not live to work. Anybody for whom the reverse is true is entirely welcome their opinion and their lifestyle; it's not for me. I'm not unhappy that Canon is keeping the core viable, but I can tell you I would not be following them down there happily.

 

[Lone Primate]

Uhh...that would only be convenient if you lived in south Toronto or worked from the hours of 5pm-9am.

The, uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, sarcastic tone is cute, if a bit sophomoric; I could do without it, myself.

The thing is, any train that takes people from 905 to 416 is also, perforce, a train that takes people from 416 to 905. They don't suddenly appear in Milton and vanish again at Union Station. They go all the way back to Milton. The same is true for all the other lines. It doesn't just happen once at 5 p.m. and once at 9 a.m.

Where the system fails people is in not better connecting one area to another. Another line, one that rings the city and connects some of the outer stations, would nicely serve the people who don't need to get to 416 at all, but do need to move between areas of 905. A lot of couples go in different directions and live in some kind of compromise location. A ring route might serve to get more of them out of their cars.

 

[lordmandeep]

on the Georgetown the earliest train running the other way is at 9am.


About driving in the 905. It matters really from place to place and day to day.

Some places are empty and other places have more cars then ants...

 

[theman23]

The thing is, any train that takes people from 905 to 416 is also, perforce, a train that takes people from 416 to 905. They don't suddenly appear in Milton and vanish again at Union Station. They go all the way back to Milton. The same is true for all the other lines. It doesn't just happen once at 5 p.m. and once at 9 a.m.

For much of the GTA, GO train service is non-existent or mainly runs in the reverse direction during the afternoon rush hour. It isn't convenient to use the GO train for 905 bound commutes unless you live along along the southern portion of Toronto. But if you're living that area, what benefit in convenience is there to work in the 905 when the transit options to downtown are far superior?

on the Georgetown the earliest train running the other way is at 9am.

Which means you'll probably get to work at 10. And the only train back leaves at 3 PM.

 

[syn]

RJ, I've lived in 905 and I've lived in 416. I've worked in 905 and I've worked in 416. As it turns out, whichever I lived in at any given time, I usually worked in the other. I still do. This I can tell you from personal experience: it's a lot easier getting around in 905. It's a lot easier getting to 905. And as a matter of fact, I actually DID used to live in Mississauga and work in Markham, ironically enough. It was a long drive but not a hard one. But why drive a longer distance than you have to? Luckily for me, it was feasible for me to move closer to work. But I see the traffic on the 404 every day; you'd never get me to agree to drive it southbound every morning, no matter what the money. I work to live, not live to work. Anybody for whom the reverse is true is entirely welcome their opinion and their lifestyle; it's not for me. I'm not unhappy that Canon is keeping the core viable, but I can tell you I would not be following them down there happily.

Haven't you realized that not everyone drives?

Even for those who do drive, they can just drive to their nearest subway station (if they really want to) and take transit.

 

[299 bloor call control.]

uhm... not to mention that you're screwed when you get TO the 905 in the morning on the GO Train... the GO works to Union and the Greater Downtown Toronto Area because people can walk or have a convenient transit connection from teh GO station to their work... the reverse is hardly true.. a 905 business park is just not transit friendly...

an autoshare program that would be affordable -- i.e. workers use it during the day and residents use it at night -- at GO stations would probably help increase GO reverse commuting.

 

[Lone Primate]

on the Georgetown the earliest train running the other way is at 9am.

Is there any logistical reason you're aware of it would be impossible to change that?

 

[Lone Primate]

Haven't you realized that not everyone drives?

Yes, in fact, because we're talking about the GO Train; indeed, I'm championing points that ought to make it more viable for some people who currently DO drive.

Even for those who do drive, they can just drive to their nearest subway station (if they really want to) and take transit.

Or they can just stay in their cars if it's a pain in the ass, which is clearly what they're doing. The limitations of the subway system in Toronto mark it as hugely parochial. York University has been up on Steeles for what, 50 years now? I was there on course in 2005 and the number of buses hauling in and out of there was literally astounding; I'd never seen anything like it. Clearly, the need is critical, there and beyond, while the Spadina line ends at Sheppard. But now, after all this time, there's a provisional, probably, fingers-crossed plan to build the line a little further... to York? Swell, terrific... what about Vaughan? Richmond Hill? Why does the Bloor line end at Kipling like Etobicoke Creek is the Berlin Wall? Why didn't did to go Square One by 1975; why isn't it bringing people in from Oakville Place today? There are cities our size -- five, six million -- with vastly better interurban transit and more extensive subway systems than we have. But the thinking here is pokey and feudal. But then you turn around and tell me the car culture is the problem.

If you're expecting your "let 'em eat cake" solution to impress anyone, don't hold your breath... or maybe you'd better, because it's no solution to smog at all. You're just trading one car-accessed destination inside 416 for another car-accessed destination inside 416; there's hardly a difference. And so people are going to continue to drive to save time and money, and there's going to continue to be pressure for business to locate and relocate outside the core. I've been on both sides of it; I know how I feel about it: let down by people 40 years ago.

We can do better for the people 40 years from now than this.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Link to articleMason Olds, a senior vice-president of Canon Canada, said the company had its own reasons for moving its $275-million direct sales division downtown

It may be a simple case of the senior management of the firm living in the city. I know it sounds crazy, but a big wig consultant I knew in eastern Canada who's job was mostly helping the monied set up firms told me one of the greatest decisions on where to set up the head office is where the President and senior staff live. Look at RIM, those guys lived in KW, and thus that's where the firm is. The reason downtown Toronto has Massey Hall et al things Massey, is because that's where the Massey's lived. So, if you're the President of Canon Canada and have a lot of say on the relocation and live in Rosedale, Forest Hill, the Beach(es) or even one of the tonier houses in my neighbourhood of Cabbagetown, there's no way you're going to want your HQ in Vaughan, Mark'am or Brampton.

Whatever his/her motivations, I think this is great news for the city.

 

[Lone Primate]

For much of the GTA, GO train service is non-existent or mainly runs in the reverse direction during the afternoon rush hour. It isn't convenient to use the GO train for 905 bound commutes unless you live along along the southern portion of Toronto.

Exactly the point. If you want people out of their cars, you'd better start thinking of what they need. And they need to get places besides Front and Yonge. Telling them "you can't get there from here" isn't going to get a single one of them onto public transit.

Which means you'll probably get to work at 10. And the only train back leaves at 3 PM.

Again, not much in the way of solutions, is it? You're not telling me why anyone would want to take public transit... only justifying why they don't.

The thought process shouldn't brickwall there. The next logical step, if you're serious about this, is to ask, "how can that be changed to suit the needs of people whose needs clearly are not being met currently?"

Just saying, "well, they're screwed"; it doesn't help.