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Poppies

Northern Light said:
Rather, when Iooking at those in society who die short of a long, full life; why should any one of those be honoured over another, by the population at large?
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Because we, as a civil society, asked them to. Death in a mine or factory is an unfortunate consequence that can be avoided and hopefully eliminated through best practices. The activity is not inherent violence. Warfare is violence committed by citizens at the behest of their society, ostensibly to protect its very existence.
 
lenaitch said:
Because we, as a civil society, asked them to. Death in a mine or factory is an unfortunate consequence that can be avoided and hopefully eliminated through best practices. The activity is not inherent violence. Warfare is violence committed by citizens at the behest of their society, ostensibly to protect its very existence.
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I don't wish to argue this point at length, noting I have worn the poppy and do have sympathy for those whose lives have been lost or irreparably harmed in war. (including soldiers, lest that be unclear)

But I do feel the need to point out that conscription isn't a request, its a demand w/the threat (albeit rarely enforced) of jail for non-compliance. I would also point out conscription was exceedingly controversial and opposed by many in Canada, especially in Quebec.

I also confess I feel greater empathy for those non-combatants who lose their lives as victims of war, as opposed to any soldier who volunteered for the risk.

Its one of those things that I'm not against the poppy, I'm just against blind commitment to any symbol; and the oversimplification of almost any issue into right/wrong. This results in demonizing those w/nuanced thought on any given subject or symbol.
 
Northern Light said:
I don't wish to argue this point at length, noting I have worn the poppy and do have sympathy for those whose lives have been lost or irreparably harmed in war. (including soldiers, lest that be unclear)

But I do feel the need to point out that conscription isn't a request, its a demand w/the threat (albeit rarely enforced) of jail for non-compliance. I would also point out conscription was exceedingly controversial and opposed by many in Canada, especially in Quebec.

I also confess I feel greater empathy for those non-combatants who lose their lives as victims of war, as opposed to any soldier who volunteered for the risk.

Its one of those things that I'm not against the poppy, I'm just against blind commitment to any symbol; and the oversimplification of almost any issue into right/wrong. This results in demonizing those w/nuanced thought on any given subject or symbol.
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AFAIK There was no real conscription during either wars (save towards the end of the First), and it is purely voluntary now for sure. We ain’t the states, which didn’t go voluntary until the late 70s I think.

AoD
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
AFAIK There was no real conscription during either wars (save towards the end of the First), and it is purely voluntary now for sure. We ain’t the states, which didn’t go voluntary until the late 70s I think.

AoD
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Certainly, in WWII, it came quite late, though it did come; only 2,400 and change (conscripts) ever reached the frontline.

Worth pointing out though, is that the imposition of conscription, even provisionally caused a mutiny in BC!

Conscription Crisis of 1944 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

****
The conscription crisis of 1917 was rather more significant............

en.wikipedia.org

Conscription Crisis of 1917 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
Northern Light said:
This results in demonizing those w/nuanced thought on any given subject or symbol.
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Absolutely valid point.

"blind commitment to any symbol; and the oversimplification of almost any issue into right/wrong."

In peacetime, democratic societies have the luxury of debating complex issues. In the combat that it may end up committing its 'sons and daughters' to, those folks have no such luxury and their world is distilled down to very few simple and primal issues.

But, as you say, beyond the scope of forums and tweets. We all enjoy the freedom to celebrate, mourn or do neither, as we each see fit.
 
As a central European-derived Canadian, I greatly value the sacrifices made by those who gave their lives fighting evil authoritarianism.
My people know what it means to be prisoner in their own lands; to have their lives taken away from them for political reasons; to be the dirt under the boot heel.
It's a very important day for me, personally, and wearing a poppy is a symbol of my commitment to the struggle against authoritarianism and war and a marker of my reluctance to forget what went down in the first half of the 20th century so that it may never be repeated.
 
AlbertC said:
'I cringed': How some former and current soldiers reacted to Don Cherry's poppy comments

Stephanie Hogan · CBC News · Posted: Nov 13, 2019 4:00 AM ET

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Stewart wonders if it should be part of what new Canadians learn when they come to this country.

"Is it part of immigration, part of your exam? Like, is it a big enough issue that's been brought to light, that you know, it's on us as a country to do a better job of educating?"
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Yes, though perfunctory reading of a passage or two in the citizenship guidebook and then passing a test transmits at best knowledge, not understanding. I think it would have been better if there are no tests (a pointless exercise of rote memorization that serves no one) - but actual mandatory classes that would be citizens have to attend staffed by among others, veterans chosen from a selected pool. Interaction with actual people matters.

Better yet - find a veteran/current CAF member from various ethnic groups and give them some outreach responsibilities. I mean let's face it - how many of us, much less new immigrants actually know someone serving/having served in the CAF?

That, and get everyone to watch the old CBC series Canada: A People's History to get a basic understanding of Canadian history in a more accessible, visualizable way. Reading it from a book is just about the most ineffectual way of communicating history to the average person without any knowledge of the context.

AoD
 
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Going by the other high profile firings at Sportsnet over the past year. I'd say this is a convenient salary dump. They have been cutting talent and costs at every opportunity. Rogers are on a money-losing deal with the NHL., so they were waiting for Cherry to say something stupid so they could cut his fat salary from the books.
 
gabe said:
Going by the other high profile firings at Sportsnet over the past year. I'd say this is a convenient salary dump. They have been cutting talent and costs at every opportunity. Rogers are on a money-losing deal with the NHL., so they were waiting for Cherry to say something stupid so they could cut his fat salary from the books.
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I would love to know if this was live or taped. If it was taped, would they not have seen red flags all over? Do they have a plan B for when he says things he shouldn't?

Last night he was on Fox with Tucker Carlson and he was backpedaling but not because he felt bad for what he said about "those people", no, it was do as he could protect himself.

So those of us who disagree with what he said are fascists.
https://twitter.com/x/status/1194448649079549952
 
I feel bad for MacLean cause he was dragged through all this. I don't think he was fully paying attention to what Cherry was saying.
 
EagleEye said:
I feel bad for MacLean cause he was dragged through all this. I don't think he was fully paying attention to what Cherry was saying.
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MacLean's been rolling his eyes and holding his breath for years....I swear he was already nervous back when I still watched hockey (2004).
 
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